Defensive Triggers and Abilities in Collect the Bounty

[PositronMike]

How do you determine the active model in collect the bounty for situations where a model has an ability or trigger that allows them to do damage in response to an enemy action?

 

Two examples I am looking at are:

 

1) A model belonging to player A killing a model belonging to player B who has explosive demise. If the damage from explosive demise kills one or more of player A's models does player B score for those kills? If the damage from explosive demise kills one or more of player B's models does player A score for those kills?

 

2) If a model belonging to player A attacks a model belonging to player B who has a defensive trigger such as Riposte or It's All in the Reflexes does the model belonging to player B become the active model when resolving the damage from the defensive trigger?

[Bengt]

Only the acting player can get points, i.e. the one taking Actions. And you only get points for enemies.

 

1) Player B gets no points. Player A get points for any of Player B's models that die, regardless of what killed them.

 

2) Defensive triggers are not Actions, so player B gets no points.

[Ausplosions]

It's not "model taking an action" it's "acting model". Which is any model doing something.

[PositronMike]

It's not "model taking an action" it's "acting model". Which is any model doing something.

This is where my confusion came from. I think that in scenario 2 player B would score. Explosive demise is a models ability but is the model with explosive demise doing the damage and if so is it the acting model?

[Ausplosions]

It's not acting if it's not taking an action.

[StuffedKiwi]

It's not acting if it's not taking an action.

 

It's not "model taking an action" it's "acting model". Which is any model doing something.

This made me laugh. I'm sure you're trying to be helpful, but I don't think that's going to help Mike (or any of us).

Here's the rule from Gaining Grounds (2015):

Whenever an enemy model is killed or sacrificed, the

acting model's controller scores a number of Bounty

Points depending on the type of model which was killed

or sacrificed.

As I read that, there are a few things to notice:

* only models that count as 'enemy' to the acting model score Bounty points.

* the only time you can score points is when a model you control is acting. But 'acting.' unlike Action or Activation, is not a defined term in Malifaux, so it's unclear to me whether the rule means that only enemy models that die due to an Action of a model I control will score me points, or whether it means that any enemy model that dies during the Activation of a model I control will score me points.

I think that's what Mike is asking -- it's certainly something I'm unclear on, and would like help understanding.

Thanks.

[katadder]

would assume is say perdita killed someone with her defensive trigger perditas controller would get bounty points as perdita was the one acting at the time

[Bengt]

would assume is say perdita killed someone with her defensive trigger perditas controller would get bounty points as perdita was the one acting at the time

I disagree. As Kiwi points out "Acting" is not strictly defined, but I really can only imagine it meaning either a model taking an Action or the model who's Activation it is. 

 

Perdita's trigger does not let her take an Action, it does plain damage, very similar to explosive demise except the damage is variable. The grey areas to me is Izamu | A warrior's death, Teddy | Smell fear and similar, as those abilities give Actions out of turn. If "Acting" is supposed to mean taking an Action, there will be multiple "Acting" models and both players can get points in those situations, if it's supposed to mean Activation only one player is eligible.

[HowNot2Wargame]

But perditia is not acting, it's a response to so done else's action.

Hence as far as I can tell, she would not score head hunter points

Hence you need to be careful with things such as sebastian's aura. They could die if they take 3 DMG due to poison but no one was actings, so no one can score.

I think

[HowNot2Wargame]

I would also agree with Bengt that when you have an action triggered by another action, its going to be both. Just in case you needed a reason to put Izamu or teddy on the table... Such rarely seen models you know?...

[PositronMike]

So for a model to be consider to be the acting model it must be the one taking an action? So models with damage   like misery won't score bounty points if a model dies due to failing a WP duel in the   unless they did an action which triggered the will power duel?

[Bengt]

So for a model to be consider to be the acting model it must be the one taking an action? So models with damage   like misery won't score bounty points if a model dies due to failing a WP duel in the   unless they did an action which triggered the will power duel?

It could also mean a model who is doing an Activation, which is slightly different. You should discuss this with your opponent before starting so you are both on the same page.

 

For misery, the side who has the model with misery need to be the one taking an action (or activation). So if Pandora succeeds with an Action targeting Wp of an enemy and that causes the enemy to die from Misery, Pandora will get bounty points.

[Myyrä]

I wonder if could just get all references to acting model's controller removed from the gaining ground scenarios? The term only causes confusion, and it isn't all that difficult to alter a document that only exists on the interwebs.