Zaqir Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Can people give me some of the lowdown on why these guys are considered that good together? I am looking at them and frankly because Ryle is never a friendly he is nothing more then a great stand alone piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoboStele Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Hoffman has an ability called Maintain Machines that allows other constructs in his crew to ignore any of their abilities. Ryle is only considered 'un-friendly' for abilities that 'target' friendly models. Since Hoffman's Maintain Machines is just a general ability with a range, and it doesn't use the word 'target', it bypasses Ryle's restriction, and actually allows him to ignore that restriction altogether if you want. Then, the best combination of them is when Hoffman uses Machine Puppet to give Ryle LOTS of attacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infernosolarc Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Hoffman has Machine Puppet and Override Edict, neither of which (in the book at least) specify friendly target. As such, you can Activate with Ryle, shoot a bunch, Activate Hoffman, use Tap Power to gain Fast, then use Machine Puppet and Override Edict, or just Machine Puppet 3 times. Quite a lot of shooting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Lobo has it. Hoffmans ability allows friendly constructs to ignore there abilites. Which means Ryle plays nice with everyone when around Hoffman. Its also why the Peacekeeper is awesome with Hoffman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Lobo has it. Hoffmans ability allows friendly constructs to ignore there abilites. Which means Ryle plays nice with everyone when around Hoffman. Its also why the Peacekeeper is awesome with Hoffman. Bah he is awesome with out hoffman. With him he is death incarnate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaqir Posted April 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Ok its cause Hoffman's aura doesn't target things right? Another side question then. Ryle is pretty much immune to WP checks except he has the -3 wp and insig until he kills something. Isn't that semi redundant. Unless vs Pandora and even then 5 wp aint gonna cut it. Also what are thoughts about taking a Desolation Engine with Hoffman? is it a tad too pricey? I think there are some interesting abilities to be had there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sliver Chocobo Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 Ok its cause Hoffman's aura doesn't target things right? Another side question then. Ryle is pretty much immune to WP checks except he has the -3 wp and insig until he kills something. Isn't that semi redundant. Unless vs Pandora and even then 5 wp aint gonna cut it. Also what are thoughts about taking a Desolation Engine with Hoffman? is it a tad too pricey? I think there are some interesting abilities to be had there. He can't hire desolation engines without Levitcus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaqir Posted April 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 hmmm pardon my ignorance but why not? I think you are right but I just can't remember why not myself :/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Bigglesworth Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Desolation engines are not mercenaries therefore can't be hired outside of faction unless some special ability states otherwise. Hoffman special ability only applies to Arcanist constructs. And even than Corphyee duets have a special ability that prevents Hoffman from hiring them too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoboStele Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Ryle is pretty much immune to WP checks except he has the -3 wp and insig until he kills something. Isn't that semi redundant. Unless vs Pandora and even then 5 wp aint gonna cut it. Well, first of all, Ryle's Breach Psychosis basically protects him against everything except for Terrain Effects which cause Wp duels (like the Hanging Tree). But I think the Destructive Impulse thing is somewhat to make him have a lower Wp, but without making it possible for him to be included in a Zoraida crew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 It was ruled that ryle has to make Irrestible wp checks on Performer's as well. I guess that would apply to the Lithu or however it is spelled as they changed hers to match the performer as they had 2 different abilities with the same name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 Yeah basically you always have to make an irresistible check Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magicpockets Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 Doesn't it affect Ryles WP when making a harmless test to target someone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearLord Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 Doesn't it affect Ryles WP when making a harmless test to target someone? Surely Harmless is ignored by Breach psychosis (because Harmless is a talent belonging to another model that requires Ryle to make a Wp Duel) - Irresistible is the exception since it states that "This may not be ignored by any talent." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratty Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 Exactly right. Breach Psychosis allows Ryle to not take test like Harmless or Pitiful (as they are WP checks he is required to make by another models talent), however Irresistible says that the ability cannot be ignored. So Ryle has to make a test to target the pretty ladies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearLord Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 (edited) So Ryle has to make a test to target the pretty ladies. I guess there's only so much of a man's mind you can destroy... ;-) Edited April 22, 2011 by FearLord Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Necromorph Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 It is, quite frankly, retarded. I was on the business end of that combo yesterday and I'm now never going to show any mercy to anyone that runs the combo...I'll use Hamelin in all of his cheesy glory, gg lol. I mean, it's no Alp Bomb, but it's just very annoying. He shot, what is it six times (well six shooting actions, 3 from Machine Puppet) triggering extra damage flips on half of them. Gunned down Taelor and a convict in 2 consecutive turns. Interesting note, he was shooting at both models in cover, Taelor is hard to wound as well, but he just managed to do 1 damage enough times to kill both models. I finally cut his lame ass in half with sword Vik turn 4, but then learned that magical weapons don't ignore armor (don't know how I missed THAT one lol) and that basically screwed me for the game, as I couldn't kill fast enough to stop him from dropping my supply wagon (I will ALWAYS burn a stone to reflip that f**king strategy from now on, lol). This was the first time I've seen that combo used...not gonna lie, kinda bummed. Yeah it's a nasty combo, but I screwed up on the placement of models a tad, (not to mention I "had" to move up because of that f**king supply wagon), and having to face that combo, plus making a dumb mistake, plus learning that your master doesn't fill the role you took them for (Magical not ignoring armor blah blah) didn't make for a very enjoyable game, lol. /rant lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoboStele Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 Yikes...if he was hitting you that badly while in cover, then I would blame the deck of cards more than anything else. That bites. I never get that lucky with shooting into melee. No, I get stuff like last night where my Levi was forced to cheat in the Red Joker just to make sure I hit my opponent's Viktoria, and then I discarded cards to try and get the Severe Damage, only to flip an 11 (yes!) and then the Black Joker in the damage flip. Sigh... I will admit though, Ryle is arguably Hoffman's best option for Machine Puppet. Choosing either Critical Strike or the Automatic Fire triggers is down right nasty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Necromorph Posted April 24, 2011 Report Share Posted April 24, 2011 Ugh, yeah it's uuuugly. I feel like when I use him with Levi I'll just be like, meh, not so awesome without Machine Puppet, lol. Granted, Levi, Alyce, and Ryle make one hell of a fire platform. I feel like crews that can't cast or ignore armor in some way will have a haaaard time dealing with Hoffman. My first game with the Lacroix was his first game with Hoffman. I had to companion damn near my whole crew to drop the Guardian, doing 1 dmg every shot through his armor, and most crews can't pull off mass activation like that. Though I did find a combo with Von Schill that can be brutal. Run him up, (0) Magnetic Pulse to make the constructs slow, then (1) Supressive Fire with the Convict. Forces them to blow their hand to activate all of their Slow models....it's pretty nasty. Even though I only got it off once before the Convict died, (well I did the tactic in reverse order, so Ryle wasn't slow after I cast SF and got all his shots off to kill the CGS before I could heal him) that one turn of totally messing with his activations was the only reason I didn't lose worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaqir Posted April 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2011 Ryle likes the ladies eh Good to know lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoboStele Posted April 25, 2011 Report Share Posted April 25, 2011 Though I did find a combo with Von Schill that can be brutal. Run him up, (0) Magnetic Pulse to make the constructs slow, then (1) Supressive Fire with the Convict. Forces them to blow their hand to activate all of their Slow models....it's pretty nasty. Even though I only got it off once before the Convict died, (well I did the tactic in reverse order, so Ryle wasn't slow after I cast SF and got all his shots off to kill the CGS before I could heal him) that one turn of totally messing with his activations was the only reason I didn't lose worse. Heh...I learned first hand this weekend the despair of card draining... Playing against Ortegas and I didn't think about needing to hang onto cards until after Nino activated. That and my opponent had a SICK amount of luck with his flips in that game. He flipped a 12 of :crows against my Peacekeeper when I only had 1 card left in my hand, then next turn he flipped a 13 of :crows against Hoffman when I only had 1 card left (and no Soulstones! Doh!). So, yeah...that sucked, LOL. Was close to winning the game up until that point. Darn Headshot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Necromorph Posted April 26, 2011 Report Share Posted April 26, 2011 Yeah, I have fun with my card drain lists, hehe...they can take some luck and practice to work well though. Levi with Alyce, Daw, and Bete is pretty brutal. I think next time I go up against Hoffman I'll take something like Von Schill, Convict, Hans, Libby, Specialist, Taelor, Student o Conflict. Should give me enough mobility (well not Hans lol) and armor ignoring utility...plus I can still drain his hand with the Convict (just gotta remember to make ryle slow first, lol). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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