Helping a friend starting the old hag need some help

[scythewing]

Hello all I have a friend who is just starting out Zorada and was wondering the use of the voodoo doll? Can she attack it via conduit and hit the target character also toss some poison on it then obey said character?

Not to mention can her poison stack?

[Koali]

No Poison does not stack... but you can "refill" the Marker every time...

And no the doll can not "attack" if you mean a meleestrike via conduit.

Conduit means that as long as the doll is within 1" of Zoraida. Zoraida ignores LOS and range when casting at the target model.

[AvatarForm]

No Poison does not stack... but you can "refill" the Marker every time...

And no the doll can not "attack" if you mean a meleestrike via conduit.

Conduit means that as long as the doll is within 1" of Zoraida. Zoraida ignores LOS and range when casting at the target model.

Thanks, as someone about to begin playing Big Z (once finished painting) these are some questions that I had.

[Ciaran]

The language on the original card for the Voodoo Doll (and the original book) allowed Mama Z to attack through the conduit (and receive a positive twist to damage AND give them poison) this was changed in errata.

It doesn't make her unplayable. She has a ton of little tricks up her wrist wraps...

[scythewing]

Yea the way its written is very confusing. Even though what are some of the play styles of big Z? I myself am mostly a gulf player but my friend loves his neverborn but he just don't know how to expand on his force or some of the tricks and tips with Zorada. So any help would be appreciated thank you.

[Ciaran]

Read through Rathnard's Zoraida Tactica. It's incredible!

Z's adaptable, very. Rathnard gives some great starting ideas.

[Rathnard]

Definitely take a look at the errata for the Voodoo doll. You can't make melee strikes through conduit, but you're able to target it with spells (usually bewitch/obey) from outside range and line of sight, and with a to cast. They'll get poison 2 at the end of every turn.

http://www.wyrd-games.net/forum/showthread.php?t=13573

That should give you a good idea on how you can use Zoraida, but let me know if you have any more questions.

[Ciaran]

Every few games I come back and reread that tactica. Oftentimes I end up seeing a different permutation that helps me bump my game.

I think that in general it's a good idea to revisit basics. A lot of times players get wrapped up in the next esoteric and tricky strategy, and end up forgetting fundamentals.

Just my thought for the moment...

[AvatarForm]

Without reading walls of text or pages of discussion, is there a refined crew list for Big Z for each playstyle?

Eg. Doppleganger + Candy?

[Natty]

My thoughts on Zoraida are the same as with Pandora, in that she is very Wp duel based, and that you want to flush out your army with physical damage minions.

If you just use stuff like Candy and the Doppelganger (which doesn't have anything to copy for physical if your opponent doesn't have it), then you are stacking all of your eggs into one basket. You will get destroyed by high Wp or immune to influence armies.

So just like Pandora, I would strongly recommend taking some combat guys to round out her abilities.

[Rathnard]

Honestly, I think there's too many variables from game to game to come up with an 'optimised list' for each playstyle. I suppose there's a few archeotypes that provide a good start though;

Shooting/ranged

Convict Gunslinger 6

Jack Daw 10

Baby Kade/Waldgeist 6

Bayou Gremlin 3

Kade/Waldgeist acts as the close combat muscle if needed, with either Lure or the Forest shenanigans to help out your shooters. Good for when you want to keep at arms length to your opponent. The Bayou gremlin fulfils the speed bump role if needed, otherwise it can throw some shots out and even do some serious damage in conjunction with a bewitch, focus shot and/or dumb luck.

Jack Daw and the 'slinger can provide some synergy by emptying your opponents hand, and Zoraida can obey them for extra shots.

Pure Melee

Mature Nephilim 10

Young Nephilim 6

Young Nephilim 6

Terror Tot 3

You just can't beat Nephilim for outright damage, so it's a pretty logical step to just load up on the suckers. The Terror Tot is a speed bump and a potential target for the Mature to Knock aside for an extended charge. I didn't bother trying to take advantage of grow, but it's definitely an option if you look into taking a black blood shaman and/or desperate mercs.

Hit and Run

Bad Juju 10

Silurid 5

Silurid 5

Silurid 5

Surprise! It's the starter box. If Bad Juju isn't going to be useful for the specific scenario then you could replace with the Hooded Rider.

Killjoy

Killjoy 12

Terror Tot 3

Terror Tot 3

Waldgeist 6

As far as I'm concerned, Killjoy is a tactic, and a potentially fun one at that. Voodoo Doll is the ideal sacrifice target but the terror tots are the next best for their speed. Waldgeist can help keep key elements safe until you get into position.

I haven't incorporated any of the book 2 minions, but for the most part you can probably work out where they would go if you want to fit them in.

As a general rule of thumb, when building a 25SS list I start with an 8-10SS minion that suits my strategy/schemes, add one to three 5-6SS minions and then however many 2-4SS minions as I can fit. I almost never deliberately keep SS aside to add to Zoraida's cache - she does fine with what she's got.

Edited September 29, 2010 by Rathnard

[AvatarForm]

Awesome effort

Thank you for that Rathnard. As always, your efforts are greatly appreciated. it was really a bonus when you included explainations also.

[Golden]

I just ordered a Killjoy today for my Nicodem crew, he seems solid.