tenabrae Posted July 8, 2010 Report Share Posted July 8, 2010 We've had the slow/summon argument before and no official answer came down. As written in the rulebook Ropetus is correct, summon tells you after the turn the model's summoned it acts normally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 (edited) We've had the slow/summon argument before and no official answer came down. As written in the rulebook Ropetus is correct, summon tells you after the turn the model's summoned it acts normally. Yeah, basically, ditto this. I'm not sure what all the fuss is about. Pg. 66 first paragraph last two lines: "The summoned model may activate during the turn it was summoned but receives slow for that turn. After that turn, the summoned model has full capabilities." So, while regular slow carries between turns, slow from summoning actually IS different. Edited July 9, 2010 by Justin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastDinosaur Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 I still have not found where it is stated that Leveticus is placed instead of summoned. Anyway, found what WS said back then: http://wyrd-games.net/forum/showthread.php?t=11919&page=3 I feel overlooked ;( But he only mentions future changes.. Also in the Summon/Slow thing.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ropetus Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 LastDinosaur: Thanks for the link. Got to say changing the wording would clear the rule up quite a bit. Although it is quite easy to get the right answer from reading the rules carefully, it is not immediately obvious that Leveticus does not receive Slow even though he gets summoned. Changing it to a Placing effect removes all doubt. -Ropetus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 I feel overlooked ;( But he only mentions future changes.. Also in the Summon/Slow thing.. My guess is the future change to summon will necessitate the future change to eternally shackled. But for the moment, everything works fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaehl Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 This creates an effective solution for the alpha strike problem, at the same time not sacrificing the efficacy of the models as a whole. bravo Wyrd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karn987 Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 My guess is the future change to summon will necessitate the future change to eternally shackled. But for the moment, everything works fine. Exactly. As it is right now, things work. *shrugs* I'd take that any time I can get it ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntiZombie Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 Learn stuff everyday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Csonti Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 The official answer for the summoning confusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenabrae Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 None of those changes are official until we see them added to the errata. We've been told some stuff is changing, but not how or to what extent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nutcase168 Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 Well WS is about as official as it gets without being in the errata yet. So if I read that right, slow lasts until the next activation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Csonti Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 Well WS is about as official as it gets without being in the errata yet. So if I read that right, slow lasts until the next activation. Indeed it is official. That's why WS has a nice badge above his lovely picture. A rules question was asked and WS informed us about the intent of the rules and how it should be played even before the wording will change to make it more exact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 Indeed it is official. That's why WS has a nice badge above his lovely picture. A rules question was asked and WS informed us about the intent of the rules and how it should be played even before the wording will change to make it more exact. Errr...all he said in that link was that there was a change coming. Not how to play with the current wording. And really, so long as they don't change the summoning, eternally shackled will be fine. I think a lot of confusion would be avoided if we were left ignorant to errata until it actually comes out. Explain the intent, sure, but I'm tired of being linked to pending errata. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nutcase168 Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 Well until I read the new eternally shacked rules I'll play him like I have: Levi dies returns and is summoned to a waif (6") has slow on next activation Can't wait for the placement rule. Anything more than btb would be fantastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WEiRD sKeTCH Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 How about this? Eternally Shackled: If this model is killed or sacrificed during the turn, replace a Hollow Waif with this model during the Closing Phase. Sacrifice any other Hollow Waifs in play. Discard your Hand and draw up to your Crew’s Maximum Hand Size. The focus has been on Book 2 over errata/faq stuff. Patience is appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastDinosaur Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 Whoa.. and the replaced Waif doesn't count as killed/sacrificed?! That means you'll have to summon them repeatedly.. hmhmm.. might aswell be slow then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nutcase168 Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 Or just kill enemy models to make waifs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchethead Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 The focus has been on Book 2 over errata/faq stuff. Patience is appreciated. /zen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karn987 Posted July 9, 2010 Report Share Posted July 9, 2010 (edited) How about this? The focus has been on Book 2 over errata/faq stuff. Patience is appreciated. Sketch strikes again! +1 cookies That will 100% change how Levy goes through his usual turn as you can generally ignore having to get any more then just 1 Waif. Infact the only time I get another is by consiquence and never really because I wanted one. This will be interesting indeed.... Edited July 9, 2010 by karn987 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted July 10, 2010 Report Share Posted July 10, 2010 Well until I read the new eternally shacked rules I'll play him like I have: Levi dies returns and is summoned to a waif (6") has slow on next activation Can't wait for the placement rule. Anything more than btb would be fantastic. But that's not what the book says... How about this? The focus has been on Book 2 over errata/faq stuff. Patience is appreciated. So, all effects (including wounds) on the waif will be applied to Leveticus as per the replace rules? Huh. Could work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBugKing Posted July 10, 2010 Report Share Posted July 10, 2010 Just a note Lalo. It's Place. not Replace. Big difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Csonti Posted July 10, 2010 Report Share Posted July 10, 2010 That will 100% change how Levy goes through his usual turn as you can generally ignore having to get any more then just 1 Waif. Infact the only time I get another is by consiquence and never really because I wanted one. Really? That's very interesting because I experienced the opposite. Maybe your partners are not too erm.... agressive. For example a pair of Silurids, Lureing, Perdita and a tons of other models can make short work on a Waif on most cases. 1 Waif vs a good player is suicidal. You have to try to get the second one as soon as you are able. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastDinosaur Posted July 10, 2010 Report Share Posted July 10, 2010 It's Place. not Replace. Big difference. Eh... no? It's replace. Really? That's very interesting because I experienced the opposite. Maybe your partners are not too erm.... agressive. You summon one automatically at the start of the game, I think karn meant that you'd only ever have to summon one more than that as you couldn't lose them (they'd just be resummoned). @Nutcase: Which is how you summon them.. I'm not following you here.. Having to continously summon them puts you in a much worse position than not having to do this.. whatever you say. You'll want to summon one almost every turn and this takes AP, cards, planning on where to be on the table. You might have to target your own corpse more often than not to be certain that you'll get it off, or because there's simply no enemies close enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted July 10, 2010 Report Share Posted July 10, 2010 Just a note Lalo. It's Place. not Replace. Big difference. Maybe sketch mistyped? But I'm copy and pasting here... Eternally Shackled: If this model is killed or sacrificed during the turn, replace a Hollow Waif with this model during the Closing Phase. Sacrifice any other Hollow Waifs in play. Discard your Hand and draw up to your Crew’s Maximum Hand Size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Csonti Posted July 10, 2010 Report Share Posted July 10, 2010 You summon one automatically at the start of the game, I think karn meant that you'd only ever have to summon one more than that as you couldn't lose them (they'd just be resummoned). But if your opponent pressing hard, you are forced to make a new Waif, just to be sure that Levi will have a place to resurrect when he dies. Making a new Waif is also a good method of moving Levy around the board. So I think this new rule will not change the game mechanics too much. Provided your usual opponent was not a defensive turtle... Having to continously summon them puts you in a much worse position than not having to do this.. whatever you say. You'll want to summon one almost every turn and this takes AP, cards, planning on where to be on the table. You might have to target your own corpse more often than not to be certain that you'll get it off, or because there's simply no enemies close enough. Levy got rid of the Slow, so the extra AP is there. And as I said before, even playing with the old rules a good opponent has forced you to summon new Waifs anyway. And yes, Corpse Counters are very good for this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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