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mirparx

Back on Malifaux - Learning with Lilith

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You mention the Primordial Magic would have been useless except for Rush of Magic... but even if it's just there for that, it's useful enough to take :)

Rush of magic is one extra card / discard per turn. In a 5 turn game, that's 5 cards, or 2.5 soul stones worth of cards if you keep him in the back corner hiding. And he only costs 2 SS. Plus he's an activation. Totally pays for itself in other words. And if you can use it as a scheme marker or get the rare Nullify off, it's just gravy.

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Primordial magic is OP ;)

As Philo said you just need it to hang around your deployment to make up its points.

The insignificant attack thing can be huge. The enemy starts doing claim jump with a leap-model and then you just turn it insignifican't so that model becomes useless and they need to figure out how to do it qith models they wanted for another job.

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Never even took in consideration PM attacks... always thought to it as a "rush of magic" + free scheme marker at the end of the game.

Effectively, 2SS, you take one more card each turn, stacking on Lilith Rush of Magic should grant a decent hand most of the time 

Plus you have the possibility to place as scheme marker 

Plus, specially in mission when enemy have to place marker in your half of table, can make enemy insignificant...

Really need to test it more....

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The PM is great - if it wasn't for the fact that it stops you from taking the Cherub. Therefor, I wouldn't even take PM if it was free. Cherub fanboi all the way ...

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On 2017-09-07 at 7:08 PM, Mutter said:

The PM is great - if it wasn't for the fact that it stops you from taking the Cherub. Therefor, I wouldn't even take PM if it was free. Cherub fanboi all the way ...

There are pools where you might not care about the interacts from the cherub. The hand sculpting of double rush of magic and a stone with qinga can lead to some silly hands which is nice when aggression is the name of the game. Apart from that I also like the cherub, slowing stuff and free interacts can be a real gamechanger.

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I do like the Cherub for interact heavy things, but usually only if it's a (2) interact. The problem with the Cherub is that he needs to be right there in the thick of the action to get the full effect. And it requires setup. The Cherub has to be in position before your interacting model, which telegraphs to your opponent what you're doing. When I used to use the Cherub more against opponents that were familiar with it, it would get murdered as soon as it moved into position and before I got much use out of it.

So between being 50% more expensive, arguably more fragile, and require much more work to get it to pay off, I tend to go straight to PM and forget about it. Sure, Cherub can pay off big in the right situation, but it has to be 50% more valuable than the PM to value his points, and that's requires a lot of attention I'd rather devote towards setting up some wicked Lilith pounces.

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Cherub + a tot doing claim jump behind a house is neat. I don't own gupps and haven't painted my silurids. ;)

Mark for death as a (0) can also br handy.

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Hello I need some advices.

Something I need to clarify happened a couple of time. 

I activated lilith, placed forest, done a wicked vines on enemy, moved and... then?

I did not had another enemy in range for wicked vines, no need to tangle shadows ,already repositioned.... wasted an AP.

 

Is that normal or just my bad placement/planning causing this?

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13 hours ago, mirparx said:

Hello I need some advices.

Something I need to clarify happened a couple of time. 

I activated lilith, placed forest, done a wicked vines on enemy, moved and... then?

I did not had another enemy in range for wicked vines, no need to tangle shadows ,already repositioned.... wasted an AP.

 

Is that normal or just my bad placement/planning causing this?

Wasting a master's ap is almost always bad planning. Is this happening turn one or in other turns of a game?

 

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Once in turn one, once in turn 3 ( in 2 different games)

I usually try to keep Lilith in " the center of the web" so to be able to support the other members of the crew, possibly in cover as she does not need LoS for her Ca actions.

It happened that I had to swap 2 pieces ( Nekima was in a bad status, so I used Tangled Shadows to swap her with a young neph ), I used wicked  Vines to root a Samurai, placed the illusionary forest and then??

Another Tangled shadows was useless (and it is also high resource cost ).  No other valid targets for Wicked vines. Moving her out of cover to reposition didn't seemes wise to me...

Probably I tend to keep her too much on the back , while she is more effective if I user her a bit more aggressive, more close to enemy...

 

 

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Root + wicked vines into the terrain you just created, preferably into the reach of a model with pounce is usually nice. If you think anyone will attach her before she activates again you can go defensive. 

She can also swap her own position with a friendly model through tangle. Seems like you and your opponent are both very cautious, I usually have plenty of targets to push.

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Yeah, I'm with Ludvig here. It sounds like maybe you were playing a bit too cautious, or your opponent was.

 

Having Lilith be the "center of the web" is great, but you want to make sure you're bringing a fly to the spider in that case. You don't want Lilith out in the middle of things to get beat on, but she's got a great sword to make use of when there's nothing else to do. That's why I like having Lilitu and Doppleganger around, because I can always lure something close to Lilith (and friendly pounces) if I don't see great uses for her other abilities.

 

Lilith isn't a pure support master, she likes to get her hands (or at least her sword) dirty too

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On 14/09/2017 at 5:18 PM, mirparx said:

Hello I need some advices.

Something I need to clarify happened a couple of time. 

I activated lilith, placed forest, done a wicked vines on enemy, moved and... then?

I did not had another enemy in range for wicked vines, no need to tangle shadows ,already repositioned.... wasted an AP.

 

Is that normal or just my bad placement/planning causing this?

I would say bad planning, especially if it happened more than once. 

Things that you could have done with the extra AP. 

Drop a scheme marker. Scoring points is always good. 

Move to a better location before you drop the forest - Can help in future turns with dropping markers, or having more wicked Vine targets

Defensive stance. 

Focus before your wicked vines.

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Hi,

 

im here for some clarification. If i cast wicked vines on an enemy model (for example on a Molly), can my enemy move the Molly with a lure, as it is not a walk action, just a move? I've read the condition drops on pushes, but not sure how it works with lures or any other placement effects.

THX!

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Rooted will not stop a model moving as a lure because it's not a walk or a charge, and because it is not a push it doesn't remove it. 

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