benjoewoo Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Here's a quick 1v1 that I managed to actually finish with a friend. I played Seamus, my friend, a new player same as myself, played Rasputina. 35SS. Strategy/Schemes: Turf War, Breakthrough, Vendetta, Distract, A Line in the Sand, and Entourage. Deployment: Flanking (flipped a 12) Seamus had red chapel killer and sinister reputation, Sybelle had Bleeding Tongue, Jakuuna Umube with Unnerving Aura, Dead Doxy, Rotten Belle, and a Nurse. Schemes were Vendetta with Sybelle against the Ice Golem and Break Through. Rasputina had the Black Joker upgrade, the one that replaced Ice Mirrors, and I forget the 3rd but it denied pulses, Wendigo, Ice Golem with the upgrade that gave him the push, and 3 ice gamins. Schemes were A Line in the Sand and Entourage. Rasputina revealed a line in the sand, I revealed break through. TURN 1: Rasputina won deployment and deployed between a mountain and dense forests. I spread out between a shanty building with four corners and otherwise mostly exposed and a mountain. An important note, we made the building only have four corners that could fit a model in them to block line of sight essentially unless you were pretty much inside the building. I deployed my nurse on the far side of deployment, as in flanking positions running to drop scheme markers for break through is pretty good. The turn was pretty much movement and positioning, mostly with Seamus as Rasputina wanted to channel some spells against him. I ran Nurse to get in position for break through next turn, and my dead doxy and belle lured/pushed Seamus to avoid being in range of Rasputina channeling through an Ice Gamin--Rasputina made the mistake of moving Ice Golem so that a dense forest of Ht 3 was between it and any other model, blocking line of sight--this left the three ice gamins as the only effective source of channeling. Ice Gamins all double walked towards the building, getting ready to invade. Jakuuna and the Doxy took positions in the building corners to avoid LoS, and Sybelle stood outside of the building a bit to avoid Rasputina Range and provide support. The belle was similarly positioned, though closer to the building in case a lure was needed later. Seamus got the one kill of the turn against Wendigo, flipping into a straight flip, cheating it for moderate damage and killing the wendigo. Seamus then back-alleyed to the top of a mountain out of LoS of the now nearby Ice Golem. He used his other APs to focus the shot that killed Wendigo and walk out of Rasputina range. Seamus was able to back alley because on Sybelle's activation, she complied Seamus into using back alley to get on top of the mountain. Score is 0:0, as no one could claim Turf War, Rasputina was still not past the center line, etc. TURN 2: This turn saw some more action. The Ice Golem started moving towards the building for Turf War and more effective presence. The Ice Gamins actually changed direction and moved towards the turf war marker--the Rasputina player thought you could earn 1 VP per 2 models. Rasputina ended up voluntarily walking into and engaging the Jakuuna, taking four damage from the hazardous aura in flipping a severe (we used the default hazardous damage track). She burned some cards for the manipulative test, and then setting herself up with armor and the Ice Golem with Armor as well. Rasputina did not take damage from unnerving aura because she did not have LoS on Jakuuna at the start of her activation. Rasputina also shot Seamus channeling through the Ice golem, who had LoS after movements. Jakuuna put 1 damage on Rasputina and gave her slow for the next turn. the Dead Doxy just meleed Rasputina for a moderate. The nurse walked and dropped a scheme marker. Seamus dropped a scheme marker for Break through (his back alley spot put him in position from Turn 1) and back alleyed near where the ice golem was previously and walked to get out of LoS. He also 0 summoned a belle, who on her activation dropped a scheme marker as well for break through--I wanted insurance in case the Ice Golem charged and killed Seamus somehow before going and starting to remove markers, which would at this point take 3 turns, i.e. end the game for the ice golem. Sybelle and the other belle simply maneuvered. The belle double lured an ice gamin, and sybelle shot at the ice golemn, missing the shot. Both teams scored 1 for Turf War, so 1:1. Because Sybelle's first attack was not against Ice Golem but Seamus, I did not gain 1 VP for vendetta and did not auto-reveal it. TURN 3: This turn saw a lot of death. I won initiative, and had dead doxy shove the ice gamin that was double lured towards sybelle and the belle before attacking rasputina, doing sever after flipping really well into a straight flip. Rasputina activated, flipping moderate for the hazardous aura from Jakuuna, and attempted to kill Jakuuna, failing and dying to Unnerving Aura. She had not crossed the center line yet, so 0 VP for Entourage. Seamus went out and shot at an ice gamin with a Focused .50 flintlock, as he had taken damage from Rasp and Sybelle. I cheated to get a straight flip after Rasputina's cheat and cheated moderate damage to kill the ice gamin, then using a live for pain on the ice golem dealing 1 after armor and healing for 1. In a move surprising no one, Ice Golem Charged walked into the building and killed Jakuuna. Hazardous dealt 2 damage to Ice golem. Dead doxy attempted to push golem, pushing ice golem back out of the building and moving away from the ice gamins into another corner of the building to block most of the LoS. Sybelle and the nearby belle did some damage to the ice gamin, failing most of their attacks because I had burned my hand against the ice gamin and ice golem in attacks and push. Nurse double walked so she could participate in the battle next turn, and the other belle walked around and lured the ice golem, since I figured it would just charge Seamus anyway next turn--the lure succeeded and healed Seamus to full. Both teams scored for Turf War, so 2:2. TURN 4: I win initiative again (story of this game), and have Seamus walk, cheat summon another dead doxy, and shoot ice golem with .50 flintlock and live for pain, putting it at 2 health by the end of it. Ice golem Charged Seamus, putting him at 9 wounds between the two melees and melee expert extra attack. T___T. I SS 3 of the damage, so you can imagine my dismay at only taking 9 out of 12. Sybelle shrieked into Seamus and Ice golem, hitting Seamus the first time, so I double cheated them so that Sybelle would flip a positive, getting moderate to deal blast, dealing 1 damage to the golem. I shrieked again, and this time hit the golem, killing it with weak damage. I earned 3VP for vendetta essentially at this point because Sybelle was my vendetta piece and the golem her target, which she killed. When the golem exploded it put Seamus at 1 with the explosion. The ice gamin that was lured and pushed around charged sybelle, doing some good damage. the other two gamins moved closer to the turf marker. The rest of my people moved around. TURN 5: I win initiative, and have sybelle walk away from the gamin successfully to shoot the gamin. The gamin charged the nearby belle, killing it. The two dead doxies pushed around the gamin, triggering triple pounce between both of them. The other two gamin walked around and shot at some stuff, Seamus, Nurse, and the summoned belle walked closer. Game ends, I score 3 for Break Through, 3 for Vendetta, and 4 for Turf War. My opponent scores 4 for Turf War. END THOUGHTS: The game was definitely skewed in my favor--at 35SS and Rasputina only having a starter crew, she had a huge SS reserve of 6. I had a reserve of 4, 3 of which I was able to spend in prevention/attack. Even with such a large reserve, it's hard to overcome a model quality difference that large, as only Rasputina could use them, which she did mostly for initiative flips and card draw (she used 4 of them on the Turn 3 initiative flip which failed ). This plus my better understanding of rules, non-printed abilities (e.g. focus, defensive stance, LoS rules and engagement rules) set the game up as a kind of land slide for me. My opponent thought Entourage meant a horizontal center line, not knowing the center line was diagonal due to our flanking deployment, and he forgot to drop markers for a line in the sand. He moved Rasputina forward a lot, which was a mistake, and he was overly aggressive with her instead of ice gamin and positioning them. Ice golem not being relevant the first two turns really hurt him, as I was able to take out Rasputina by the time he became relevant and had set myself up with two extra summons. Not an entirely fair match because of the above, but the Rasputina player is learning what he's missing in tactics and models, so there was good learning here. As far as my crew selection, I think it was pretty good. I picked Jakuuna because I figured that my opponent would likely deploy in one of the corners with more cover, and given how the board was laid out that would mean I could reach LoS blocking cover with Jakuuna fairly quickly, which is also why I chose dead doxy over a rotten belle. I didn't want to have to use a two model combo just to move Jakuuna her walk, since I didn't take Not Too Banged Up on Sybelle for the extra SS compared to what I knew would be a large reserve for Rasputina, so I opted for the Doxy. The belle I did take I wanted to use for defensive luring on the golem, as I was expecting it to go threaten Jakuuna in short order. Jakuuna also offered me an essentially minimum 3 damage aura, which I thought i'd capitalize on by throwing her near the turf war marker, which surprisingly worked against the Rasputina rather than gamins, since once Rasp engaged I had 0 incentive to move Jakuuna to be in LoS with the gamins. I took the nurse because I knew I'd use her to run my schemes, and after that she could come into the battle right around when my units were expected to be low and bring in some heals or essentially disable enemy models with meds. Seamus was meant to go around and give me some new units by picking off easy units, which he did in killing Wendigo Turn 1--the second doxy wasn't a game turner, but the first belle was an effective tool in dropping a marker, luring Seamus at some point so he didn't have to walk, and luring golem for healing. I think if I had to play it again, I wouldn't have changed anything, other than maybe dropping my hired belle for a crooligan. The nurse never participated in battle, and it was a bit of a waste to spend two turns dropping 1 marker, whereas the crooligan would have dropped 2 markers by the end of turn 2 and been relevant turn 3 for essentially sacrificial melee/charge denial. I wouldn't have chosen necro punk, because once two markers were dropped, I would want the relative sturdiness of the crooligan to keep the golem engaged plus the soft cover would be useful against gamins shooting into engagements. Scheme wise, I think the only better choice than Vendetta would have been Entourage. I was fairly leery of it because I'd have to declare it for full VP, and even with Seamus' ability to teleport, it would mean both my schemes were running around while turf war requires being in the center. I didn't want to rely on Seamus living to get points, considering turf war and break through do not, and though that as long as I could keep the battle at the turf marker mostly even, I would get 3 for break through and try to get 1/3 from vendetta. With Vendetta, sacrificing Seamus was an easy decision because he could blow everything bringing ice golem down to low health, engaging it and Rasputina's attention, drawing it away from Sybelle and allowing her to essentially take free shots at the golem from far away. The map did help with back alley, and I had the corpse counters to red chapel my back alley, but It would have been risky moving Seamus like that as he would then not only have to survive, but not be as active in participating in the fight. Prior to Rasputina dying, I think my crew basically had 3 people dealing decent damage--Seamus (lot of damage), Sybelle (ok damage), and Jakuuna (good passive damage). Manipulative was probably what won me the fight against Rasputina. Manipulative checks burned so many cards from Rasputina in turn 2 and 3, mitigating her hand advantage when I had used most of my hand to cheat summon and snipe wendigo/ice gamin/push and lure. I'm fairly confident my first belle summon was a good decision--had Jakuuna not killed rasp, the belle would have played a much larger role defensively, as rasputina would unlikely have trouble surviving a dead doxy attack--bad damage spread and frozen heart would likely have kept her alive, and golem would have destroyed the doxy, leaving me with only sybelle and a belle in that area. My movements left me pretty thin everywhere, and a concentrated Rasp army coming out of a building that effectively secured Rasp would have been trouble. I'm not sure if the dead doxy or Jakuuna were the right choices. It worked out like I planned, but I think there may have been better options. Hard to tell because my opponent was newer than even me, and the flips and cheats just went in my favor more often than not. As always, thoughts, comments, and criticism welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Ummm, how would the Crooligan have dropped 2 markers by the end of turn 2? The Crooligan cannot take interact actions on turn 1, and if you take the place action after interacting, you no longer can. In general without outside aid, Crooligans can never drop more than 1 marker a turn each, and only starting on turn 2. Im confused how you double cheated when you hit Seamus for a positive flip? I assume you mean you cheated Sybelle's flip up and Seamus' flip down. Assuming the best modifiers in the game, a red joker for Sybelle and black joker for Seamus you still wouldn't get a positive flip. You still suffer the effects of Seamus' impossible to wound. So your damage flip automatically gets a negative modifier, and even if you can get a straight flip, you can't cheat for dmg. The absolute best Sybelle can ever get hitting Seamus and going for blasts, is a straight flip that you cannot cheat. Apart from that I can't really offer much. From your account the Raspy player made tons of mistakes, honestly she should have eaten Jaakuna for breakfast. Thanks for posting, glad you are enjoying Seamus! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjoewoo Posted July 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Ummm, how would the Crooligan have dropped 2 markers by the end of turn 2? The Crooligan cannot take interact actions on turn 1, and if you take the place action after interacting, you no longer can. In general without outside aid, Crooligans can never drop more than 1 marker a turn each, and only starting on turn 2. Im confused how you double cheated when you hit Seamus for a positive flip? I assume you mean you cheated Sybelle's flip up and Seamus' flip down. Assuming the best modifiers in the game, a red joker for Sybelle and black joker for Seamus you still wouldn't get a positive flip. You still suffer the effects of Seamus' impossible to wound. So your damage flip automatically gets a negative modifier, and even if you can get a straight flip, you can't cheat for dmg. The absolute best Sybelle can ever get hitting Seamus and going for blasts, is a straight flip that you cannot cheat. Apart from that I can't really offer much. From your account the Raspy player made tons of mistakes, honestly she should have eaten Jaakuna for breakfast. Thanks for posting, glad you are enjoying Seamus! Sorry I didn't write very clearly. And yes, I miscounted the AP for crooligan because I was thinking I could drop, then walk, then drop, which is 3 AP. Necropunk could do it with leap, so never mind I should have just mentioned necro punk . When Sybelle randomized Seamus on the first shriek, I cheated Seamus low and cheated Sybelle high for the positive flip, which turned into a straight flip because of impossible to wound. That flipped a moderate, getting the blast for moderate damage. I then went and randomized ice golem, shooting him normally to get 1 wd. Any thoughts on who I should have subbed in for Jakuuna? I wanted Chiaki, but didn't have the card, and thought that would have been the smarter hire given Rasputina's love of paralyze. Jakuuna seemed like an ok choice at 7Ss once I added unnerving aura. I was hoping to keep her out of LoS so she couldn't be shot directly, and figured once an ice gamin or two got close I could move her out to tarpit them and deal some damage while Rasp and gamins eventually killed her. Still getting better and learning how to play him--I want to practice against some heavy melee crews to learn how to get around the disadvantages of melee vs. ranged. Any general tips and tricks for how to deal with them? I just try to keep them outside of charge range and shoot if at all possible, but I am unsure that's a long term winning strategy given a double walk from golem plus melee expert means he gets 1 hit on seamus even at max shooting distance. My main solution is waiting to use lures until later in the turn when my masters are engaged to pull off the pressure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Hard to argue effectiveness if it worked for you. I can only tell you what I think from my experiences, which are going to be different from yours. Personally, I would tend not to bring Jaakuna against Raspy, if I knew I was facing her because her best Defense, Incorporeal, doesn't work against Raspy, and she doesn't have Hard to wound, meaning if Raspy can hit her she is the perfect node to trigger blasts off onto your crew. If I KNEW I was playing Raspy, and assuming the pool you had above, maybe something like this... Resurrectionists Crew - 35 - Dustup Seamus -- 4 Pool +Bag o' Tools [1] +Mad Haberdasher [2] +Red Chapel Killer [1] Copycat Killer [3] Madame Sybelle [8] +Bleeding Tongue [1] Rotten Belle [5] Rotten Belle [5] Yin the Penangalan [8] And then after looking at his crew perhaps ironing out Schemes, I'd probably have gone Entourage with Seamus and Vendetta with a Belle. Remember you can easily get 2 VP from Vendetta with a Belle using Lure. The Belle might not be the one to actually get the kill, but you'll get 1 VP just for attacking a model with Lure, and you'll get one more if they are dead if I'm remembering it correctly. Basic Plan would be to have Sybelle and Yin handle the Turf war, and keep them apart so blasts couldn't get them. I do like unnerving Aura, but against masters that bring exploding models, it would be too easy for them get you in the explosion auras. Bag O' Tools in this instance because if Seamus needs to jump in and help in the center he can use the ram trigger to make any model he hit not count for the strat, even if he can't kill them, because they would not longer count as a minion. I could see dropping the Bleeding Tongue, as for 1 SS you have to weigh how often you are going to get benefit from it for the cost, but there are some tricks with Seamus that is worthwhile to keep considering it. Again, Knowing I'm against Raspy, I'm not certain I would bring a nurse. Again no hard to wound, and while the rest of her triggers are still good, she loses out on the paralyze trigger because Frozen Heart can't be used on them. Don't get me wrong I love Nurses and they would still be useful in this instance, but knowing it's Raspy I'd probably leave her at home. This is just quick thoughts, and not to imply you did anything wrong. I think more of the game came down to the Raspy player learning, so it's really hard to evaluate if you could have done anything better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuttleboy Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Don't forget that summoned models can't interact the turn that they are summoned. It may have made a 1 VP difference because you say in the report on turn 2 you summoned a Belle and the Belle drops a scheme marker for Breakthrough and dropping a scheme marker is an interact action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjoewoo Posted July 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Oh I did not know that. I had two scheme markers other than the one the summoned belle dropped, so I would get 3 anyway because I revealed it at the beginning of the game, but that's important to know. Aren't Raspy's attacks all shoot? They have the pistol icon next to them, which are subject to incorporeal, not factoring blast damage of course. I was afraid of using CCK because I didn't want him to get blown up and because he doesn't count for turf war. That he has good damage was a good attraction, I was just concerned that having sybelle and two belles as my turf war runners outside of Yin would be dangerous because of Raspy's explosions and ice golem charge. Can't really belle bomb if the belles are going to die or get paralyzed on raspy's activation. Must play yin...I've been trying to fit her in but when I looked at her I just kept thinking she wasn't going to have the effects necessary to deal with Raspy. Then again, she wouldn't blow up to Raspy like Jakuuna would, but she wouldn't have gotten the 6 damage from the hazardous aura. That's luck though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuttleboy Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Tina's attacks have the gun icon, but are all Ca actions so ignore incorporeal. There are a boatload of CA actions that have the or icon. They are still Ca actions and all Ca actions ignore incorporeal. I highly suggest picking up the PDF rule book from DriveThroughRPG.com and putting it on every mobile device you own. It's only $10. http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/133323/Malifaux--RULES-ONLY-Handbook--2E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjoewoo Posted July 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 I bought a copy of the rule book and have it nearby for my games, especially since I don't have the schemes memorized. Well then, I guess Jakuuna may have died earlier knowing that, because the Raspy player may have decided to cheat higher then. Can Rasputina channel her Ca action through an ice gamin if she's engaged? I thought she could because she is using the gamin as the proxy--is my understanding incorrect? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 I also wouldn't have used the belles as turf war contenders unless you HAD to. I'd have run them out on the edges of the combat and started luring anyone who got into the center away to deny the points for Turf War. My personal way of playing is to go into the game with a plan on how to get max points from the strat, and a plan on how to deny as many of the strat points for turf war as possible. The strat is the only thing you are 100% sure of how the opponent is going to attempt to gain points, and can plan accordingly for. If you can gain the points all game and deny the opponent it twice that puts you in the margin for most games I find. Now if you do know what they are trying to accomplish for schemes, and can stop them, and because of his mobility Seamus can do this pretty well, you can plan to try to stop their Schemes. I do tend to find however that properly chosen and built for schemes are vastly more difficult to stop than the Strat. So in this example I would have brought the CCK precisely because killing him does absolutely nothing for the opponent other than removing him from the board. He's deadly enough to be a threat to most of Raspy's low DF models, and if she spends any AP dealing with him that is AP not directed at getting VP. Definitely worth it for 3 stones to eat up 2 AP, and maybe more if he manages to kill something(s). The Belles would be there to heal Seamus and more importantly to lure out of the turf war circle anything that will keep Raspy's numbers over the critical mass necessary for Turf Points. I might actually swap Not Too Banged up for Bleeding Tongue as well. The goal being not to get whatever you lure to the Belle, but to keep it out of the Circle, and spending it's AP to either go after the belle, far away from the circle, in which case by the time it's done with her and gets back, hopefully multiple turns have passed, or to force it to Yo Yo. It has to wait until after the Belle Goes to get back or it just gets lured out again, and if the belle has to go first she hopefully slows it then lures it again, or just defensive stances before her sister pulls the model out if it gets back in. They would be on opposite sides of the board so as to prevent blasts and to maximize the Yo Yo potential. Seamus would then dart around the edges killing anything not engaged, and forcing Raspy to hopefully, and futilely, spend AP dealing with him. Ideally operating entirely on her side of the board so that if you live to the end you get your entourage points. Because you need him to live to the end I bring the Hat, which is another reason to bring the CCK. Sybelle and Yin would then be spread out enough to protect from blasts. They would contest the center because both are relatively hardy, and have 2" melee ranges so you can engage the Frozen Heart Brigade at max distance, to protect against Freeze over. Yin and Sybelle can also effectively lock down any non-SS user by combining Yin and Sybelle's 0 actions. It's harder to work on Frozen Heart Crews because they won't be subject to Terror, but forcing them to pass WP 13 duels on a negative twist for any action that doesn't target Sybelle can be very crippling if down right. Additionally Sybelle has her Death Mark, for effective Peon and Insignificant status, baked into her whip, and Yin, Sort of, has min dmg 3 on her first successful strike during the turn, due to baked in poison. I've found both together can be very killy and as long as neither is taken out swiftly you should be good for kill and resiliency. That would be my basic idea going into the game anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjoewoo Posted July 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Hmmm, engaging with two people who aren't really meant to kill but stall and kill within a couple turns to deny a point at some time in the match, while also preventing other units from getting the strategy from belle lures. Makes a lot of sense, and seems more sensible to play rather than count on what the opponent's schemes are--lowers the need to achieve the 10 point game every game as well. Could you please clarify the Raspy question I asked? My friend asked me and it made sense to me that since the gamin wasn't engaged she could still shoot through the gamin, but not sure if I'm correct on that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 The Gamin isn't casting the spell, Raspy is. If Raspy is engaged she cannot use attacks. December's Curse is a so if she is engaged she can't use it. All Ice Mirror does is let her draw LoS and Range from a Frozen Heart model. She is still the model casting it, and so suffers all the restrictions thereby. One way I have dealt with it, and it's usually a good way to die, eventually, but if Raspy ever gets close to a piece of terrain I'll use Seamus and the CCK to jump in and triangulate her so she can't get away till she kills one of them and can push away and nuke, assuming she took armor of december. They Lock her in combat forcing her to use Biting Chill to kill them, which is not the action she wants to spend her AP on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drafterman Posted July 14, 2015 Report Share Posted July 14, 2015 Rasputina voluntarily engaging in melee on Turn 2? Yeah. Mistakes were made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjoewoo Posted July 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 14, 2015 I think it stemmed from his misunderstanding that Turf War only gains you 1 VP a turn, and can't be farmed out in 1/2 turns. I think he voluntarily engaged for that and also knowing that I'd simply move jakuuna near him for the next activation anyway. If he had tried to run I could dead doxy him into Jakuuna possibly, depending on our hands and when it happened. The run would've eaten at least 2 AP so that she could be out of hazardous terrain or be just at it's edge, but a Jakuuna sacrifice to burn out Raspy's AP isn't a bad trade when that means I just have to deal with ice gamins and a lone ice golem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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