Can a model gain a condition it already has?

[Myyrä]

What happens when model gains non-stacking a condition (like slow) that it already has?

Does the model still count as gaining the condition? Rulebook says that model can't gain a non-stacking condition if it already has an ability with the same name, but there is no mention what happens if it already has the same condition.

The distinction whether the model gains the new condition is important because several abilities do something when or if a model gains specific condition.

Few examples:

Tap Power: When this model Activates, it may make target friendly Construct within 3" gain Slow to grant this model Fast.

(0) Resting In The Blues: Target other friendly model within 6" may gain the Slow Condition. If it gained the Slow Condition, it heals 3 damage.

Feed on Dreams: Enemy models that receive Slow within 3 of this model suffer 1 damage.

[deValmont]

I would say that they are not gaining the condition on it being applied to them a second time. I don't have the rulebook so I can't check the minutiae on gaining conditions, but I can't see it being read the other way.

[Phinn]

Malifaux 2E - Rules Manual - page 61 - Conditions

Conditions presented without a value in their name do not stack, and a model that would get a second instance of a Condition simply ignores it (the second instance is not applied).

[Myyrä]

Malifaux 2E - Rules Manual - page 61 - Conditions

Conditions presented without a value in their name do not stack, and a model that would get a second instance of a Condition simply ignores it (the second instance is not applied).

Is this same as not gaining a condition? It is pretty clear that the model does not end up with two instances of same condition.

[mythicFOX]

I don't understand, your last post reads like you're asking;

 

When a condition is 'not applied' to a model does it still count as 'gaining' the condition?

 

To which the answer is fairly self evident. 

[The Godlyness]

If a model has slow and activates next to an alp and fails the duel. Nothing happens. Since it can't gain slow so it's never applied. And it can't gain slow if it has slow. For the reasons above.

[Grantt]

On the back of this, what happens when an un-activated model receives Reactivate?

I am under the assumption that this model now activates twice this turn.

[jonahmaul]

It does activate twice that turn.  I haven't got books to hand but pretty sure that if you gain Fast then Slow or vice versa you couldn't gain them again and it be applied (so if you're Fast then get Slow it would just cancel out Fast rather than giving you Slow but you couldn't gain Fast again).

[binkys]

It does activate twice that turn.  I haven't got books to hand but pretty sure that if you gain Fast then Slow or vice versa you couldn't gain them again and it be applied (so if you're Fast then get Slow it would just cancel out Fast rather than giving you Slow but you couldn't gain Fast again).

I do not believe this is correct.  Fast and Slow cancel out and remove the conditions according to the rulebook.  if the condition is removed you no longer have it, so that means you can gain it.  So if a model has slow on it as it's only condition and gains fast, this model now has no conditions on it.  The model can now gain fast as it does not have the fast condition.

 

So if conditions are gained in the following order, you get the listed results:

Slow + Fast + Fast = Fast.

Slow + Fast + Slow = Slow.

Slow + Slow + Fast = no condition as the second slow is ignored.

etc....

[Phinn]

I haven't got books to hand but pretty sure that if you gain Fast then Slow or vice versa you couldn't gain them again and it be applied (so if you're Fast then get Slow it would just cancel out Fast rather than giving you Slow but you couldn't gain Fast again).

You have probably mistaken it for the second paragraph in Reactivate (Malifaux 2E - Rules Manual, page 62):

A model may not benefit from the Reactivate Condition more than once per Turn, even if it lost the Reactivate Condition and then gained it again.

[Ausplosions]

Is this same as not gaining a condition? It is pretty clear that the model does not end up with two instances of same condition.

 

Seriously?

 

It does activate twice that turn.  I haven't got books to hand but pretty sure that if you gain Fast then Slow or vice versa you couldn't gain them again and it be applied (so if you're Fast then get Slow it would just cancel out Fast rather than giving you Slow but you couldn't gain Fast again).

 

You could definitely gain fast again. I have no idea why you wouldn't be able to.

[jonahmaul]

You have probably mistaken it for the second paragraph in Reactivate (Malifaux 2E - Rules Manual, page 62):

A model may not benefit from the Reactivate Condition more than once per Turn, even if it lost the Reactivate Condition and then gained it again.

That is exactly what I have mistaken it for!  Thanks!

[Snakeshit]

I do not believe this is correct.  Fast and Slow cancel out and remove the conditions according to the rulebook.  if the condition is removed you no longer have it, so that means you can gain it.  So if a model has slow on it as it's only condition and gains fast, this model now has no conditions on it.  The model can now gain fast as it does not have the fast condition.

 

So if conditions are gained in the following order, you get the listed results:

Slow + Fast + Fast = Fast.

Slow + Fast + Slow = Slow.

Slow + Slow + Fast = no condition as the second slow is ignored.

etc....

I dont think that's how it works. If you gain fast then slow you cant gain fast again as you already have the fast condition. To make it easier to think if you have fast and slow condition they cancel out for ap purpose but the fast condition will not remove the slow condition.  

[Phinn]

I dont think that's how it works. If you gain fast then slow you cant gain fast again as you already have the fast condition. To make it easier to think if you have fast and slow condition they cancel out for ap purpose but the fast condition will not remove the slow condition.  

 

Malifaux 2E - Rules Manual, page 62

 

Fast

Fast and Slow cancel each other, remove both from the model if both are present at the same time.

[Snakeshit]

Ooooh that's awkward thanks for the reference  

[mythicFOX]

<MOD HAT>

 

I'd remind people about the guidelines for answering rules questions, IE please read the rules before challenging someone else's answer. 

 

Anyway primary and secondary question have been asked and answered so I think we're done here.

 

</MOD HAT>