regleant

Sounds like you don't like anyone. All that is left is Mei Feng? That aside, I'm not sure why you think McCabe1 is mediocre and not versatile. His crew brings exceptional mobility and tricks, alongside healing and some hitting power. You can always tap into Versatile models to shore up weaknesses. He and Youko2 probably have my highest winning %. Though if you're looking for 2 usable versions of a masters, only Youko2 is viable. I don't think I'll play Youko1 ever again.

You should use my painting trick to speed things up. Don't. 😇 (I know I know, many people play for the hobby aspect and visuals..)

Where are people talking about these things, as I don't see any other discussion here in the forums, nor in the FB group?

I got my first game in with Sayuri the other day, which might not be saying much as it's my 2nd game in over a year. But notwithstanding: Misaki1 Shang Koji Kara Amai Wokou Raider x2 Katanaka Crime Boss 6 Soulstones vs. Leveticus1, Standard deployment, Carve a Path My plan was to try 1 of everything that could possibly benefit just to see how it played out. Turn 1 was great. The Amai dropping an enemy scheme marker to trigger 3-4 abilities at the Start Phase was just pure fun. Giving the Wokou Raiders Fast helped in getting more actions to move the pillars across the board, and nearly my entire crew was at the halfway point holding back my opponent, in Turn 2, while Misaki cherry-picked her entry point. Kara is the one that I was least impressed with, because she failed her attacks and then died. That could have been more a function of the cards than her, though. Amai is soft, but has just enough unique abilities to make him annoying to deal with. Drop a Scheme marker with him early and just carry it to where you need it, which helps in getting past the 4" rule. I kept Koji further back and mostly used his guns and his Boryokudan (which you can't help but yell like Ryu does "Hadouken"). Since it has been so long since we played, we were on Turn 3 when the 2-hr time limit was up. His crew was in really rough shape with several losses, while I had just lost Kara and was generally in good shape, so I took the win. I also had 1 Strategy marker in his deployment zone and the other on the line ready to be moved. He had one Strategy marker on my table half and the other on the line, so I was ahead here as well. Overall I am happy with it and would put it on the table, again. Because of the scenario, I wasn't able to ball up and get full synergy of all the abilities across every model. I'm not sure that it's necessary, but man is it fun triggering so many random abilities by doing something that normally would help your opponent. Also important, I kept forgetting to give myself Shielded +1 from the enemy scheme markers..., but that would not have saved Kara.

Interesting question. Read page 28 of the core PDF rulebook. in short, markers either "Dropped" or "Created", but either way they are placed on the table, invoking the trigger. The rules for this could have been better-written. There's only 1 mention of "...the marker is placed..." indicating that this is term is used openly. That said, the rules forum is the best place to check these things, as I could be wrong.

@FoundryWorker Let's ignore the fact that Shenlong was my first Master, simply because it was the only one available at the time. What drew me to this faction is the breadth of Versatile models. I loved the dragons and Samurai. My 2nd Master was Misaki (Core box) and I picked up Fuhatsu (as a single used model at the time when he was a stronger Henchman), Dawn Serpent, and Shadow Emissary. Shortly after, I picked up the 3 Samurai (used) and Karmic Debt. So keep that in mind - we may have different interests in the faction aesthetics which impact purchases. If I could only buy 2 boxes, it would be the Dawn Serpent and Silent Strike. The Dawn Serpent has won me plenty of games because it's hyper-mobile, it doesn't die, it self-heals, and it has respectable damage output. And I've enjoyed everything in the Silent Strike box thus far. If I could only take one of those, it's the Dawn Serpent. But you seem more interested in Last Blossom models, which is perfectly fine (and fun fact, I actually like Ototo in my list). Of the 4 boxes you named, I would absolutely pick up Karmic Debt and Crime Syndicate over the other two. Of those two, I would lean towards Karmic Debt if you plan to get Asami one day, and Crime Syndicate if you mostly play against melee-based crews (because Extended Reach is game breaking at that point). I hate to be too prescriptive because play style and aesthetic interests really do play a role. And Misaki supports Versatiles as well as she supports Last Blossom.

Fun choices! As a heads up, some people will say that Mei Feng "runs better" under Arcanists but don't listen to them. She is plenty strong in Ten Thunders. That Metal Golem is a great pick-up, especially if you get the one associated with the Nightmare Box. Specific to Last Blossom, she has a lot more freedom to run Versatile models than Mei Feng, so keep that in mind. She just doesn't need her keyword, which gives you much more flexibility in how to run her. My personal thoughts (based on my playstyle: Crime Syndicate: I did not regret this purchase, but the Crime Bosses take a few games to figure out. They can play several roles. Yamaziko is mostly a buff-bot. She always dies easily for me... but to be fair, Last Blossom as a keyword is "glass cannon." Expect to lose pieces, and try to take out more than you lose. Lords of War: I personally don't like this box. The Brothers don't look impressive, and Fuhatsu is cool, but there may be better options. I much prefer Silent Strike box. The Lone Swordsman is fun, and the Samurai are amazing. They also add much-needed durability to the list, and Samurai do benefit from Yamaziko. Thunder Archers: This is the only purchase that I regret making. They get engaged by the opponent then sit on their thumbs until they die. The Snipers are better if you want ranged models, as are the Samurai. Karmic Debt: Very fun to run. Wanyudo gives some mobility when you need it, though unnecessary when you have Mei Feng and Misaki. Minako Rei is pretty decent, and works well when you have more models that can produce the Shadow Markers. The Summons are not that strong, but they are annoying for the opponent to deal with, and Minako herself can pack a punch. Just remember to hold a few extra Soulstones when you build the list to guarantee the suit. I usually do the 2 Summons on Turn 1 using the Shadow Markers from Misaki.

Interesting. I have to agree with some of what you said. Misaki herself doesn't really care about her keyword, and some of my most fun lists were basically her leading a bunch of Versatile models (Love those Samurai and dragons). Even within her keyword, I've found 3-4 different ways of running her. One of the most irritating for my Neverborn opponent was a list full of Extended Reach. I even used the Jorogumo, who work very well with Yamaziko and Great Teacher. I am pretty sure my opponent scooped Round 2.🤣

Thematically, I agree completely. In practice, I find OG Lynch very difficult to use well. Lynch2 is like playing on easy-mode by comparison. I've had the same experience with Youko1 v Youko2. Youko2 just opens up the game so much more for me, even though Youko1 is thematically much more fun.

I just got my first game in with Jacob Lynch2. The list was: Hungering Darkness Kitty Lone Swordsman Beckoner Illuminated x3 vs Zipp, Curse Objects, Flank The very killy Strategy and Schemes was pure luck, as I built this list ahead of time. The only update I made was adding in the Lone Swordsman in place of the Dawn Serpent. Zipp is very fast - I never really made it out of my deployment zone. That would have been a near auto-lose in a Scenario-based game, but as the majority of points were scored by killing things, I owned it outright. I had Gracie and Skeeter gone by first action top of 3, having only lost the Swordsman and the Beckoner (which scored me Hidden Martyrs). Using Kitty to add Brilliance all over my own models, notably Hungering Darkness, is phenomenal. Looking forward to getting him back on the field!

Thanks. I must have been referencing an older version of the Errata. I see it now.

Situation: Kitty Dumont passes over Hungering Darkness with a Walk action. This triggers her Brilliance Saturation ability, which says Hungering Darkness must pass a TN 13 MV duel or gain a Brilliance Token. Can I choose to relent and automatically fail? Or must I flip and use the result (and subsequently cheat)? I heard that the latest errata clarifies this situation, but I could not find the specific line that allows it. Thanks!

When you run Honeypot, are you focused on Lynch1 or Lynch2? I just picked up Lynch2, but haven't gotten in any games, yet. I've had a lot of success with Youko2. I use a beefy Versatile build and it works well for fighting-focused with some decent scheming capabilities. Youko1, less so. Which is a shame because I love the model. Wastrel (Lucas1) is a lot of fun with hyper-mobility for scheming, which still comes with some punch. But I find it falls apart quickly as I start to lose models. They don't want prolonged combat. My W/L record here is respectable. It helps that I use the Nightmare Box. Lastly, Foundry (Mei Feng1) has been solid for me as she has a lot of options and can switch styles as needed. Scrap markers just improve board position and mobility late game, which ideally keep momentum in your favor. Again, I use the Nightmare box, so have incentive to put them on the table. Special call out for Last Blossom and Oni. I love both for the mobility and hitting power, but they are too glass-cannon for my play style and my W/L record is abysmal, despite how much I enjoy playing them. I cannot play Retainer / Ancestor. There is too much "bookkeeping" for me to keep track of with all of the Upgrades and bonuses. I can barely keep up with Wastrel...

Curious how the early games have gone

Note, if you could find that QQ chatroom mentioned by LokiAuel, that may help. I personally couldn't figure out QQ and just used WeChat. Also, a buddy of mine confirmed the shop I mentioned above is still open, at least the last time he visited. So that's good news.

Sorry, I do not. I returned to the US in 2018. If it helps, at the time the biggest (only?) place in Shanghai for miniature wargaming was on the 8th floor of Joy City next to the movie theater, South Side off of line 8 Qufu Rd / Xizang rd., exit 1 (per Baidu Maps) For the life of me I can't find the characters for the mall if you want to take a taxi(大悦城 maybe). The front is a coffee shop, with the gaming and such in the back. But 4 years and 1 pandemic later, not sure if the shop is still there. Of course there were 3 Games Workshop stores in Shanghai, but that doesn't help anyone. 😆 I can also ask around to see if they are still open, but most people I know there either stopped mini war gaming or left China.

Woo! You chose a Master with a high learning curve. The Kabuki Warrior and Bunraku are strong, but always better to start smaller given funds to learn the game. Some immediate thoughts as a Youko lover: Youko, Unseen is generally stronger. If your group allows, give her a try a few games as a proxy. Youko LOVES Soulstones, and you left yourself with only 2. Drop a Kunoichi for more stones and use them liberally to make Backroom Dealing triggers happen more reliably. Also with 3 Soulstone users, you will want more for damage reduction at the very least. EDIT: I personally use upwards of 8 Stones with Yokuo. For models without Armor, Hinamatsu is 'death by a thousand cuts' and the damage output is huge. But against armor, she really doesn't work well. She is also quite mobile, so be ready to use her for scheme running when needed (note, you don't need a "charge target" when you charge for further distance). Bill has Heroic Intervention with Debt of Gratitude. In many situations, this makes him a Min-5 Damage attacker per attack. Quite brutal. I am one of few people who like Geishas. For 4 points, the first turn you can Lure your own models forward to get them up the board faster. Mid/late game they can spam Sharp Wit to drop Slow on opponent's models (which the Geishas come with Distraction, giving enemies a negative flip against it). Geishas are also good for spreading that negative Willpower flip for Youko. Nonethless, expect them to die, easily, in droves. Kunoichi I personally do not like and rarely have gotten them to work well for me. Tools for the Job is great, but other than that, they don't do much for me at 6 points. Given the number of models you have, maybe use them as a buffer to protect your important models (Bill, Hinamatsu). Chiyo will die, quickly and often. If you have an opponent who doesn't know better, you can get off her Misinformation attack. But generally, she is good for a few free Pass Tokens and scheme running and not even trying for Misinformation. Riddles in the Dark looks so good on paper! But you'd be surprised how difficult it can be to balance your own control hand vs. the opponent to make it worthwhile. Now that said, if you end up enjoying the crew and keyword, definitely expand out to the Kabuki and the Bunraku. Kabuki gives you a lot more punch to the list, and the Bunraku drastically improve mobility and scheme running. If you want to buffer using Versatile models, you are in luck because Ten Thunders has some of the best Versatile models in the game and can generally shore up any weaknesses. But for your first group of games, just feel it out. The one weakness you're going to have (from my experience) is against hard-hitting punchy lists, like Nekima. Youko1 likes to dance, play, control, and strategize. Nekima just takes the Mike Tyson approach of "everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face."

I was waiting for someone to answer this other than me, as I haven't played Lynch in a year, and had a lot of difficulty getting it to work. What I have found: Don't bank heavily on Brilliance. It's a neat addition, but you could easily fall into the trap of spending the first 2-3 turns trying to load up the enemy and end up losing the game. Kitty is deceptively good. She ends up having to play a lot of roles at once so you have to be careful. She is your best scheme runner, she can manipulate the battlefield, and her damage is reasonably consistent. Illuminated are your primary, reliable damage dealers. IMHO, you should run at least 2 in every list, and this is one of few models I would support running 3x. Beckoners are great as I like Lure. I use it to move my slower models up the board faster turn 1, then try to move things to where I want them on later turns. They are also great at tying up more-expensive models on later turns. The keyword does lack mobility, so I like Wanyudo or the Dawn Serpent to supplement scheme running as needed. I think Lynch2 is better than Lynch1. For models not listed, I'm either not a fan of (Gwyneth for 9 pts seemed overpriced for what you get) or I haven't had an interest to use. And overall, I lost most of my games...

Wokou Raiders are also an option with Last Blossom keyword.

Don't forget the fix to Chi! It's official - when you burn a Chi token to add +2 to the duel, this impacts who will cheat first. This was not the case, before...

She is what Youko1 should have been. Nice to have another Control-based master.

Core rulebook, pg 21 in the PDF: No Victory Points can be scored on the first Turn. Core rulebook, pg 3 in the PDF: When a special rule explicitly contradicts the core rules, follow the special rule rather than the core rule. All 4 Gaining Grounds 3 Strategies: At the end of each Turn, a Crew gains 1 VP if.... Based on combining these rules, is it fair to say that points can now be scored on Turn 1? Is GG3 a special rule that overrides the core rules?

For me personally, if I am going to spend 9 points on a model, I have to have a game plan for it on the table. Either it's going to score me points, or it's going to rampage and murder. Gwyneth does neither of these, well. "Come play at my table" is her strongest ability, imho, and it's utility. Specific to your friend's preference on aesthetics, if he doesn't like the Asian theme, then probably avoid the Dawn Serpent to keep happy. Fuhatsu, though, is always a fun add. That said, I agree with Maniacle_Cackle - it's better to get in games with a smaller list, then grow as you find you want to experiment with different things.

Honestly, my first purchases for Ten Thunders were a bucket of Versatile models: Fuhatsu, Samurai, Dawn Serpent, Yasunori (who I do not recommend now), Emissary, and Tanuki. Shortly thereafter I picked up Wanyudo and lastly Lone Swordsman. These were the core of my lists for a long time, often running 2-3 Versatiles and choosing the Master based on which flavor I wanted to run that day. It provides a safe set of core purchases and more mileage out of purchases. But everyone has their own play style, preferred aesthetic, and reasons for choosing particular masters. What I did may not work for your friend (or anyone else), but it did work for me. In the case of Dawn Serpent with Lynch, it gives another scheming model so that Kitty isn't expected to do all of the work. Anyway, I've rambled quite a bit. I'm sure others have their own perspectives as well. Also if it helps, I think Lynch2 is stronger than Lynch1, and may be easier to start with. Good luck!

My personal playstyle is one that tries to take advantage of Scoring situations, my personal safety be damned. I've won most of my games with fewer models than my opponent at the end. As such, I look for mobility, durability, and dropping scheme markers. If I am going to bring a beater to the table (which I often do), it has to have other abilities to be worthwhile. Mr. Graves does come with Hard to Kill, which is an amazing ability, but no healing. At 8 points, he's easy to get bogged down, and doesn't feel as impactful as other 8 (or 9) point options. Also, no ranged and no real threat extension. BUT if I expected to see Terrifying models, he would absolutely go into the list as Ruthless is amazing. Min 3 damage is also a great floor. Mr. Tannen is a finicky tech piece. Boring Conversation is situationally great if he can get himself mixed up with a bunch of opposing models just to force them to flip cards. But beyond that, I personally don't feel that he brings anything to the table. He was also errata'd not too long ago which brought him down. If I were only to ever take one Versatile model, it will always be Dawn Serpent. Flight, Agile, and MV 7 means he will always get to where he needs to be. Hard to Kill and Rising Dawn means that it takes significant amount of dedicated effort by the opponent to kill it, meaning they will spend an inordinate amount of activations or simply ignore it. And in a pinch, the damage track isn't too bad, but he's not there as a beater. Counterpsell and the ranged options are both just icing. And this is not specific to Lynch. I would have the same strategy, regardless of the Master. I have a Soulstone addiction. I wouldn't run fewer than 4, and if I have 3 models that use Soulstones (as you do in this list), I would try to run at least 6. Also, at least theoretically, Lynch2 brings more of a durable "beat face" strategy which would require a slightly different list, but doesn't matter as much in this case. I personally have built the following list, but as my gaming group moved on to playing Magic instead of Miniatures, haven't had an opportunity to play it out. This was also before the latest Gaining Grounds, which may change up some of the models I want to take: Lynch2 Hungering Darkness Kitty Illuminated x3 Beckoner Dawn Serpent 6 Soulstones