jonahmaul

Thanks for the info folks. Not that bothered that I want to sign up to Fedex, just thought I was missing something! I'll just wait for it to turn up, I'm sure it'll be here soon enough and I have plenty to tide me over in the meantime!

Because equally it doesn't state on Bodyguard that the model cannot die and come back to life (through whichever mechanic). It just says that you reveal on turn 4 and if still alive you get a VP, same on subsequent turns and if alive at end of the game and on over half wounds another VP (up to the obvious max). If a unique model has died but been re-summoned it can be interpreted as still alive and therefore fulfilling the VP requirement. I'm sure there are other examples that I do not know of, but Ancestors and Yan Lo, Bete Noir and Candy were the ones that came up in discussion with my friend (although Candy's bury mechanic moves her back to her deployment zone so not as good for VPs).

Just to add again - I'm not trying to be argumentative and argue against this ruling because it does make the most sense. But I would like something clear to refer to.

Pardon my potential stupidness but where is everybody getting their tracking numbers? My order confirmation doesn't have one and I can't go into the Wyrd website which is still showing a closed sign. Or do you only get them when the order is dispatched?

I was referring to this Teddy example not the resummoning one: I definitely agree that it is (sort of) a new model, it would just be good if there was something clear in the rules/FAQ to make this explicit as my gaming group have interpreted it differently (which has worked to my advantage at least once that I can remember, maybe two or three times) and I could definitely see others doing the same.

My bad! Had it in my head that it had to be an enemy model for some reason. Makes her a very interesting choice for Bodyguard if you've got some cheap stuff around that you don't mind killing off to pop her back up. Have to get this lady on the table!

I never said it would be played either way, I said it could be interpreted another way as I have demonstrated. Now I'm not claiming that this interpretation is correct and I would agree that being able to summon the same model back (even though this is what the Yan Lo upgrade suggests) is a bit much. But there is an interpretation that suggests that it is possible to bring the same model back. After all the rules for Bodyguard specifically mention a 'model' and there is only one Izamu model (edit - or other Ancestor, I am just using Izamu because his self heal and armour makes him a good BG choice) in the game so it could be argued otherwise and it is a very easy mistake to make (as my gaming group has done). The Teddy example doesn't work because you have to declare a specific Teddy for Bodyguard but there is only ever one Izamu model. And there is nothing clear in the rules or FAQ that I can see that specifically states you cannot do this.

Just copy and pasting my response from the other thread discussing this: Good discussion though I'd still love to see something official on it as it could be argued either way. Although I play Ressers with Yan Lo I would accept it's a bit too much to be able to bring him back and get Bodyguard. But there is definitely an interpretation of the rules that suggests it is the case. I don't know anything about Bad Juju but does his bury mechanic mean he is really hard to deny Bodyguard points on? The other case I was thinking of with my own crew is the Bete Noir and her bury/unbury mechanic but as she can only unbury on enemy kills it's nowhere near as effective. (could a mod merge these two threads if appropriate?)

Good discussion though I'd still love to see something official on it as it could be argued either way. Although I play Ressers with Yan Lo I would accept it's a bit too much to be able to bring him back and get Bodyguard. But there is definitely an interpretation of the rules that suggests it is the case. I don't know anything about Bad Juju but does his bury mechanic mean he is really hard to deny Bodyguard points on? The other case I was thinking of with my own crew is the Bete Noir and her bury/unbury mechanic but as she can only unbury on enemy kills it's nowhere near as effective.

I've just started a discussion about this in the rules subforum too!

They rules are a bit abstract in Malifaux sometimes, especially with LoS/Ht/Vantage Points. But they are very clearly defined so as long as you follow them and make sure you agree on terrain traits before the game begins (i.e. what is blocking/climbable/severe etc.) it should be clear. It is sometimes a bit odd when you look at the actual models and are convinced that something should be/shouldn't be able to be seen (Ht 1 models directly behind crates can still be seen by anything Ht 2 for example), particularly if you are used to true LoS games.

So the thread on whether stuff was OP got shut down (though I'm not entirely sure why as it seemed to be a pretty good discussion about different things that could be OP). This question came up so I'm just copy and pasting it here in the hope somebody can give me an answer: The Godlyness, on 27 Aug 2014 - 7:45 PM, said: How so? My declared model is Izamu. Reliquary specifically states name a friendly Ancestor model (Izamu) which was killed or scarified in this game...summon the name model (Izamu) into base contact with target corpse marker. Is there a rule or FAQ that specifically addresses this not being the case as I don't see how it could not be the model that you named (edit - this seems like I'm being argumentative which I'm not, this is a genuine enquiry. Hard to get tone on the internet!).

As has been pointed out a single line of extra text on the scheme/strats could easily counter this my stating any ability/action cannot remove the condition. I have yet to encounter the problems discussed regarding Dreamer/Levi so I don't know how much of an issue it is but it doesn't appear to be a big deal to me. Just pointing out that it is not difficult to account for these. How so? My declared model is Izamu. Reliquary specifically states name a friendly Ancestor model (Izamu) which was killed or scarified in this game...summon the name model (Izamu) into base contact with target corpse marker. Is there a rule or FAQ that specifically addresses this not being the case as I don't see how it could not be the model that you named (edit - this seems like I'm being argumentative which I'm not, this is a genuine enquiry. Hard to get tone on the internet!).

Could I ask what proxy you've found is as I've been thinking of trying to proxy one myself. I can't comment on the Rogue Necromancy as I've not used it but Belles are the Masters of luring. At Ca 8 with the suit in-built there is very little that can resit being lured by them. How do you use Hanged effectively with Molly/Nicodem Fetid? I've not got Molly on the table yet either but I want to play both so would love some advice on them. Most of my gaming group (including myself) are pretty inexperienced when it comes to Malifaux (I'm one of the more experience and have played probably less than 30 games) so maybe it's not been countered very well in my group as you suggest.

My friend and I had this conversation regarding the way some models interact with Bodyguard. I play Ressers as my main faction and both Bete Noir and Yan Lo's Ancestors can be killed and come back to life (multiple times with the Bete) which makes Bodyguard easier to achieve. I often run Izamu and run him forward to do some beating then bring him back up with Reliquary. With Yan's own heal and Izamu's self heal he can make a very tasty model for Bodyguard. Bete is not quite as effective because she can't count for Bodyguard if she's buried (I assume she doesn't count as in play) but if you can pop her back up at the end of your own turn then you can usually easily score 2 VPs for being alive at the end of a turn and having more than half wounds at end of the game.

I really like Hanged although I can't comment on their usefulness for Nicodem as I've yet to run him yet (he's at the top of the to do list). They do seem expensive at 9SS but I find Whispers very good just for the half wounds as getting it off on Masters/Henchmen or any other high wound stuff is wonderful! The no healing is often a big bonus too. Their attacks also cause horror duels if they damage which is very nice, if only to eat up opponents cards. I find a Hanged with Seamus and Sybelle creates a very horrible bubble of Terrifying which the Hanged ability that you lose immunity to it means at the least a few cards being eaten up unless your opponent is very lucky. Again I can't comment on their usefulness with Nicodem but having the option to summon them seems very useful.

It's worth noting that both Ototo and Yamziko can carry Smoke & Shadows if you want some teleporting shenanigans when Misaki is not around.

Apologies, I thought they were Oiron were 6SS (I'm used to the more expensive TT options as I haven't added in Brothers/Tengu yet which I really need to do!). I assume the upgrade is carried by somebody else to give them said buff?

Sounds like you were both playing it correctly. Targetting your own models is a valid action in Malifaux and with something that can blast can often be better to attack your own stuff because you are able to control the outcome of the duel a lot more and give yourself an almost guaranteed chance of getting off the blasts. It may end up costing you your own model but the double blast could be really horrible against crews like Pandora that bunch up naturally.

They're not great. They're quite expensive (6SS) and their Lure doesn't have a built in suit. I know I often don't use them and if I do only one because they are expensive for what they do (and I play Ressers as my main faction so compare them to Belles which are a country mile better). But wondering what has given them a buff in the new cards to make them worth taking.

What has happened to Oiron to give them a buff? Pardon my ignorance!

Whoops, yes I did! The rules for Cursed Object and Distract do say that they can't be removed by any other action apart from the interact action. How to Levi/Dreamer change this?

The danger of trying to build your crew specifically to counter the opponent means that you put too much faith in what you've chosen. The Student of Conflict can be great (I took him against a Ramos crew with a Rail Golem and he chopped up a Rail Golem in one activation which was loads of fun) but if you've stuck him in and he gets killed straight away then your plan is nullified. It's better to build your crew to fulfil the schemes/strats.

As others have said, you need to discuss these things with your opponent before the game begins. The Malifaux rules are pretty good at explaining exactly how different types of terrain effect models but you need to define your terrain as there are no hard and fast rules on what types of terrain count as what generally. For example I have a load of mdf laser cut terrain building that we often use to play which are just under 2.5". We set these as Ht 3" so that models can't see over them and make them blocking and climbable all around (though I will soon be adding ladders to them which will be climbable themselves and the only place the buildings can be scaled). With the window example I would probably agree with my opponent that models could move in and out of them even if they were less than the 30mm bases. Just doesn't seem to make sense otherwise, the models should be able to jump in/out of windows.

Hah, sorry! Unfortunately I don't know her crew very well. Pullmyfinger Wiki will be your friend here again as the entries include info on playing against stuff as well as with them. Death Marshall's can bury you which can always put a spanner in the best laid plans although Seamus' Wp (which I think they target) is pretty high. Although if they target Df then you need to be very careful as he has a low Df. A lot depends on what strats/schemes you are playing.