Fighting Seamus

[Falconrider]

How are people combating Seamus, typically the belle's? Due to their unlimited number and summoning they are hard to deal with. They lure almost any model into certain death, it's overpowered.

[Ausplosions]

Not enough information.

But it is certainly NOT overpowered.

[Falconrider]

I had 2 games today where my opponent started with 3 belle's and during the game summoned 2 more. The belle's were placed in a semi-circle and lured models into their pounce. A good tactic but something i had trouble dealing with. That combined with Sybelle stopping healing and Bete unburying then burying again i am at a loss.

[Mister Shine]

What are you playing as? Whats your crew look like?

[Falconrider]

Today was VonSchill, trunk, Kiljoy, Hans, 2 convict gunsligers and 1 ronin.

[Barnaberible]

my first suggestion would be Hannah to strip the built in suit for lure (it still requires a suit right? I dont have my book with me) It will be alot more difficult to get lure off without the built in suit

[Gorbad]

Might also be worth bringing a specialist or two to put out some blast markers to punish him for keeping so many models together.

[Helm]

If the Belles are close enough to use Pounce, Killjoy must be hilarious. Just let him appear in their midst when they kill a model and let him rip.

Not to mention that if the Belles are standing still using Lure and Seamus is busy summoning them, your Crew can get busy actually completing the Strategy and Schemes. Doesn't matter how many models your opponent kills if you're the one getting the VPs.

[hypoking]

Shoot them? On average it only takes two week damage flips or so to pop a belle. HtW makes a severe harder to come by but again, were only talking about saving yourself an attack so not really worth the effort.

I also find if you can put some kind of wp protection on your important pieces, stubborn or just a high native stat, you're putting yourself in a good position against lure spam.

[Fetid Strumpet]

Also, and it will depend on what your list composition and models you have, but if a Seamys player pulls out a lure list, in general, an effective counter to it is to charge at the luring models with everything you have, all at once. In general a Lure list wants to isolate your models and pick them off one by one. While to some extent at least one of your models is going to get picked apart before your forces arrive, most lure lists, in my experience don't have the setup to be dangerous to a mass of models arriving all at once.

[Drix]

Summoning a Belle needs a 9 and a crow.

Bete Noire needs a 10 or higher in hand to stay alive.

Either your opponent has stupid good draws or you need to exploit him using all of his high cards.

[Falconrider]

Belle's lure has suits built in, they have 8 wounds and hard to wound for a paltry 5ss and can be summoned albeit with a crow. That's my reasoning behind stating they are overpowered. If you compare Beckoners which cost more and are rare 2, Oiran lure requires a crow and are rare 3. Kiljoy got killed as Sybelle was preventing him healing. I'll try the full on assault method and see how it works.

[Ausplosions]

Belle's lure has suits built in, they have 8 wounds and hard to wound for a paltry 5ss and can be summoned albeit with a crow. That's my reasoning behind stating they are overpowered. If you compare Beckoners which cost more and are rare 2, Oiran lure requires a crow and are rare 3. Kiljoy got killed as Sybelle was preventing him healing. I'll try the full on assault method and see how it works.

There is a difference between "This is OP", and "I'm not sure how to beat it".

If you knew Sybelle had Decaying Aura, don't send Killjoy to get her... Shoot her. Or send something that doesn't need heals.

You have access to Suit removal in Hannah. It sounds more like the tactics use were UP, than the crew faced was OP. It's all about learning new tricks to combat certain situations. But something hard to combat is just that, hard, not automatically OP.

[Fetid Strumpet]

Your list has to have good melee support for the assault to work remeber. Additionally make certain of a few things when you assault, 1: keep an eye on what you need to do for vp, and don't forget to do that in the effort to kill the belles.

2: keep in mind who the real threats are in the luring crew.

[Falconrider]

Looking back i could have done things differently and understand what you mean about the real threats. Good advice.

[Sybarite]

i use the Vent steam aura and the hard worker upgrade (Mei player). i also try and kill them fast. Kill the belles before considering killing Seamus (which you don't have to do necessarily). The belles aren't that hard to kill actually. i agree that they're very scary though. Their lure is crazy with Not too banged up.

Hannah should be great.

i've also found that Seamus and Sybele don't like decapitate (although i guess no one does). Do outcasts have access to that trigger?

[Falconrider]

Misaki has that sort of ability though i like your idea with Mei and might give that a try too.

[chris_havoc]

@Hypoking: The belles have 8 wounds two weak hits is not going to do the trick with almost any model. For their points they are one of the most survivable models in the game. Although Von Schill's damage output is crazy good and ignores hard to wound so he should be cleaning up but still would likely need 3 shots.

@OP: What Belles hate especially with Sybelle nearby is Blast damage. It is worth taking a focus shot with a specialist to get a blast as it avoids the whole Hard to Wound mechanic on the rest of the belles you are damaging. It's also a good way to get some damage off on Sybelle who has really high defense so hit a belle and she takes damage. So as mentioned above Hannah is a good addition because she has blasts (she can also steal Sybelle's blast weapon) and also because she has Counterspell as well as a lot of height and base size so you can hide one or maybe two important models behind her. She also gives you Arcane Reservoir so will make your hand a lot better. I would maybe take Engage at Will on Von Schill to give your guys two (0) actions too which means your guys can remove corpse counters thanks to the trunk. Relentless is also always good against Seamus with his huge amounts of Terror.

[hypoking]

I play gremlins. Most of the dudes I'm bringing in my crews tend to swing that kind of damage as a minimum. Admittedly this does color my assumptions a bit.

[TarlSS]

If you're playing TT, you can use Ototo + Torakage to block LOS. Ototo also ignores lures. Then you can use an Archer + Hail of Hochinsu to blast them with AOEs that ignore line of sight!

[chris_havoc]

Fair point! Ha-ha! I face Ophelia early-ish in the beta and she alone killed two belles in a turn and the rest of the crew killed the other two... I changed my list up after that. Also learned not to mess with Dumb Luck... I hate Lenny.