Creeping Fog

[AngelSanguine]

Hi,

I've been facing my brother's Dreamer alot lately, and ofcourse he's been using the Stitched's Creeping Fog.

Now the question I want to ask is: How does it work?

At first it was assumed that it acts as a "terrain piece" with the AOE of a 4" aura around the Stitched. But then I started to read the rules of Obscuring and Aura, and I don't think that is the case.

An Aura affects all models (friend or foe) within the "area of effect", and those models are affected by the effects of the ability; In this case "HT5 Obscuring". Obscuring gives Soft Cover and that you can only see 3" in, out or through, or above if you are higher. The ability also points out that the Stitched also is affected by the Aura. Nowhere can I see that it acts like for example Lillith's Illusionary Forest. Instead it just makes all the models in the 4" aura act as Ht5 and gives them Soft Cover (from being obscured). Please, can you show me where/why it acts like a "piece of obscuring terrain".

Thanks in advance,

Best Regards

AngelSanguine

[Kadeton]

Um, it doesn't "[make] all the models in the 4" aura act as Ht5", it's an aura that is obscuring up to Ht 5.

I'm not really sure what you're asking... Creepy Fog obscures everything within the 4" area. A "piece of obscuring terrain" would also obscure everything within its area. The effect is almost exactly the same.

The only difference is when it comes to abilities like Hunter, which allows the model to see further through terrain - since the fog is not actually terrain, the ability doesn't apply. Similarly, the Rail Crew's Shapes in the Steam ability allows them to see through the fog, but not through terrain.

[AngelSanguine]

But from what I read in the rulebook, it only makes models obscured, it does not really create an obscuring AOE. What I guess I'm looking for is citations, pages, rules or something that can clarify why everyone playes it as a 4" Aura of obscuring, when from what I read from the Obscuring Trait and Aura rules in the 1.5 rulebook, that only the models in the 4" aura is affected (with HT5 Obscuring).

[mythicFOX]

I think the point you're missing is the first line of the rules, on P20 of the RM:

"The Aura area effect represents an ongoing circular area around a target."

So the Stitched's Creepy Fog creates an ongoing 4" Ht5 Obscuring area effect.

[AngelSanguine]

Then why state the very next sentance as:

(P20) "All models within a number of inches equal to the aura's number(#), excluding the aura's originator, are affected for the duration indicated."

This means that only the models not the area gains HT5 Obscuring. That Creeping Fog also states "for all models, including this one", is to also give the Stitched HT5 Obscuring.

Nowhere is it stated that the whole 4" aura is treated as an obscuring terrain piece or some such, but rather (as I interpret it) it makes the models in the Aura harder to hit (soft cover), and harder to see over (Ht5).

If they wanted the aoe to be treated as an obscuring base, shouldn't the ability be written differently, perhaps "treat the aura as a piece of obscuring terrain" or some such.

Ofcourse, I might just be looking into this too much, coming from games such as 40k and Warmachine/Hordes.

[Jonas Albrecht]

This means that only the models not the area gains HT5 Obscuring.

I don't understand how you've reached this conclusion.

[Ausplosions]

I have no idea how to explain this to you in a way the others have not.

You're interpretation is wrong, and frankly quite abstract.

Maybe think of it as a 4" 'dome' around the model that is height 5 and obscuring?

Honestly I do not see where you are getting this idea from...

[AngelSanguine]

Yes, I know that everyone plays it as a Ht5 cylinder around the model that is some sort of "almost" impenetrable darkness. But I dont see where everyone gets that from.

Lets break the action down. It is a Aura(4) that is Ht5, obscuring for all models including this one, until the end of the turn. Applying how auras normally work, models within 4" gets the effect of the aura, which in this case is Obscuring if they are within Ht5. A Ht6 wall or such would block the ability from reaching models on the other side. What I can't find is the leap from "aura affecting models within 4"", to "aura affecting everything else as well" within 4".

Normally, an obscuring thing has a base. But nowhere does it specify that the aura is an obscuring base. According to P15, Obscuring Trait, "Models can draw LoS up to 3" across an intervening base". Is this truly a base?

I'm sure this comes from me being relatively new to this game and how the Malifaux-rules are written. I'd just like to find out why everyone has made the jump of logic mentioned above in this post.

Edited December 15, 2012 by AngelSanguine

[mythicFOX]

Ok. Think of it like this:

"The Aura area effect represents an ongoing circular area around a target." (RM P20)

Creepy Fog is :aura4 Ht5 Obscuring

So the area of 4" and Ht5 around the Stitched is Obscuring.

The "for all models including this model" indicates there is no 'doghnut hole' in the middle of the aura where the Stitched is standing.

That's how I and IMHO the community sees the rule here.

[brib4169]

I have always liked to think of it as a fart, that acts identical to the smoke pellets that ninjas drop in all the movies (ie a column of smoke the extends out (4) and up (5), hiding everything inside).

4 (p.20) simply means it effects everything 4 inches out from the base of the model in any direction, yes this makes the total area of effect 9.25-ish (4in+4in+30mm [1.18in]) inches across

Ht 5 (p. 11) means the effect extends up 5, so a model that is up 6 is not effected or a model that is up 3 is only effected by the last 2.

obscuring (p.15) means blocks LoS, however even without abilities, any model can see 3 inches into obscuring areas. So the stitched has 4in of fog between him and anything outside the effect, and is effectively out of LoS. (also he has no LoS to anything outside that 4"). models inside the aura are only effected many inches of fog are between them and one of the edges of the effect.

The "for all models, including this model" part makes this a solid column instead of the usual 'donut' area of effect that is detailed in the description

"until start close phase" tells you when the effect stops and things can be seen normally again

hope this helps.

sorry I was still typing all this when mythicFOX posted theirs

Edited December 15, 2012 by brib4169
I type slow

[Ausplosions]

Stop trying to break the game.

[Kadeton]

Stop trying to break the game.

Ease up, I don't think there's any malicious intent here.

I would suggest to the OP, though, that trying to use strict semantic logic to determine how things work is a bad approach to understanding the rules of Malifaux (and any other game). If you think instead about what the rule is actually trying to simulate, and then consider what interpretation of the rule makes the most sense in that context, you're on a much safer footing.

This is especially true when everyone already plays the rule a certain way.

[Ausplosions]

Oh lighten up. It was a lighthearted comment. Clearly my humour does not translate well on these forums.

[Kadeton]

Clearly.