Lactone Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Hello. I am new to Malifaux, and I am trying to figure out the best crew for 35ss games. My first purchase was the Kirai box set, but I was told by the guys at my shop that she is very complex and not the best to learn with. On top of that, I am unable to obtain the Seishen required for an optimal crew with her. I purchased the Perdita box set, and an individual Austringer. Is this a good enough crew for 35ss games? Or should I be playing some other setup? I know about the PullMyFinger wiki site, and have been reading up on the Perdita section, but would like to get advice from actual players who use Perdita. Last, but definitely not least, how strong is Perdita as a master? Once I become decent at the game, is it viable to continue playing with her? (i.e. is she good compared to other Guild Masters? Or should I consider moving onto my Kirai crew and mastering her? From what the guys at the shop have told me, they said Kirai is VERY strong, just a little difficult to use properly, but once mastered she is awesome. Any and all feedback is MUCH appreciated. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caleb Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Perdita is one of the easiest and strongest Guild master, if you'll play a lot of Guild, you will field her a lot. Personally i like Sonnia more but Perdita is more competitive. If you want to play other Guild Masters, Nino is a good addition to every crew. If you want to add more minions, consider buying Abuela and an other big hitter, like the Executioner or a Convict gunslinger. Abuela can shotgun wedding them to the family, so they can alpha strike with the mexicans. (Oh and Perdita's totem and Abuela can obey-move the Executioner, with Perdita is 3* moves. The Executioner is slooooow but when he get's into meele he's a monster and nearly unkillable too.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcontent Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Perdita is the most successful out of the Guild masters I play (which is all of them). She is fast, has high Df and can move a long way which is fantastic. I do find it is easy for her to be well ahead of the rest of the crew as she is so fast, which can cause problems. She has a couple of zero actions which are great and, as far as I recall, I've never let her be killed. As for the rest of the crew I take Santiago and Nino and at least one, sometime two Austringers. I also sometimes take the Guardian to run alongside Perdita as this increases her survivability no end. Her key ability for me however is Obey. Take her Totem and you can cast it twice. Take Abuela Ortega too and you can cast it three times. On occasion I use Obey against the enemy to damage their own models or move them where I want but more often than not I use Obey on one of the Ortega brothers for extra shooting/moving. Another game winner can be having the totem sit alongside a hidden Austringer and Obey another shot with him (often the range finder shot so I know whether to use a 1 action 12" or 2 action 18" shot in the Austringer's own turn). Perdita is very easy to learn, is very forgiving and doesn't require many soulstones so they can be spent on support models. She is a bit of a one-man (woman) army at times and you can use her as a distraction. In the past I have had her run around the outside of the board, seemingly not involved, to then charge an unsupported Rasputina in her deployment zone and pick her off quite easily. Good luck with her – Kirai will play completely differently! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactone Posted March 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 AWESOME advice so far, much appreciated. Would it be better to play with the crew that comes in the box set (25ss) + 1x Austringer (total of 30 ss, leaving me 5 extra)... or the box set crew + 1x Abuela (32ss total, leaving me 3 extra)? The guys I'll be playing with said they usually play 35ss encounters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcontent Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 We usually play 30ss here as it forces you to make some difficult decisions with crew composition but I appreciate that most tournaments are 35ss. For an average game night (I don't play tournaments) crew I'd probably go with something along the lines of: Perdita; Enslaved Nephilim; Judge (or Guardian or Abuela); Santiago Ortega; Nino Ortega; 2x Austringers If you wanted to restrict any additional purchases I'd probably go with your first suggestion –$$box set + Austringer, but I'd also get the Enslaved Nephilim (or Governor's Proxy) as I find the totem essential for the extra Obey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brettqpublic Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Here's my all-comers Perdita list. It has done well for me and is very straight forward to run. Perdita Nephlim for kill based strats Watcher for objective based strats Nino Santiago Francisco Peacekeeper (awesome mobility, offense, and immune to influence) 6-7 cache Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odin1981 Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 I'd consider picking up a pack of witchling stalkers and 1-2 watchers as well. The stalkers are cheap models that melee well for there cost and watcher's are great objective grabbers plus they minor in library manipulation. I would only use the executioner with Perdita I find he is too slow with no obey helping him get around. I would also suggest not using nino once you have enough models so you don't learn to depend on him. He was really powerful in book 1 but their are now fast crews in all factions and they can take him out very easily nowadays if you run up against him. Understand with a Perdita run crew that you do need a balance of melee and ranged units.Alot of people don't they just try to gunline up and it can be worked around fairly easily. If you decide to go out of faction to grab models I would suggest picking up two desperate mercenaries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgraz Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 I know this might sound whacky to some, but I liken Perdita to Zoraida as a master....in the way that Zoraida really has no synergy with minions so she can run with anyone she wants and still be great. The only auto-include for me is the Enslaved Nephilim. The Neph always uses obey on your own crew (10 of any suit) and Perdita is usually on her own crew but I will go for the enemy if it is really worth it. Abuela hardly sees any use since she also needs the mask (like Perdita) to cast it and if I have multiple masks in my hand, I usually use them for Faster Than You or Trigger Happy. Keep Francisco back (he dies easily when out front) as a defender for Santiago and Nino (they really suck once engaged in melee), then charge him out when something gets too close. If you can pull off a 'family' companion with an obey'ed charge followed by a Flurry from Francisco just about anything is going down. So; Santi, Nino, Franky and the Neph puts you at 21. I fill in the rest based on what I'm facing or my strat. If I need to hold a spot I take 2 or 3 Death Marshalls (hard to wound and slow to die). If I'm facing lots of magic or buffs / debuffs I take 2 or 3 Witchling Stalkers. Two of these guys leaves you with max SS so I recommend you start there...once you learn what to watch out for and how to keep Perdita out of harm's way you can put in all 3 (or 2 of 1 and 1 of the other). Perdita's huge stats (Df, Cb, Ca, Wp & Immune to Influence) means she doesn't need a lot of SS to function well. I've been playing her for years and still kick-butt with her. With her Zoraida-like non-synergies, you can mix up your crew quite a bit if you get bored...Austringers, Peacekeeper, Sam Hopkins, Judge, Pale Rider, Executioner, Guardian, Hounds....I've used them all and they all do well in a Perdita list. I'll parrot what others have already said about Kirai....she is vastly different. She is very powerful once mastered and can be played in a couple different ways - sometimes switching play-styles mid-game. I tried her, but she didn't fit my play-style. Good luck and welcome to Malifaux. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brettqpublic Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 I know this might sound whacky to some, but I liken Perdita to Zoraida as a master....in the way that Zoraida really has no synergy with minions so she can run with anyone she wants and still be great. This has been my experience as well. It isn't a bad thing, in fact, it actually gives you a fair amount of leeway in dealing with opponents, strategies and schemes. I always pack Nino, Sunny and Franny with Perdita but she would run just fine without any Family in her crew. On a related note you should really consider picking up Sonnia's box. Stalkers are great with Perdita and Family are great with Sonnia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the junkie Posted March 5, 2012 Report Share Posted March 5, 2012 Not trying to thread jack, but since we are both newbs talking about Perdita here are my questions. So how many Soulstones does she need? I wouldn't think any master would be happy with less than 3. That makes so very hard choices for growing her box. So far my list is: Guild Crew - 35 - Scrap Perdita Ortega -- 3 Pool ---Enslaved Nephilim [2ss] Abuela Ortega [7ss] Francisco Ortega [5ss] Nino Ortega [7ss] Papa Loco [6ss] Santiago Ortega [7ss] Basically the box + totem and Abuela. Abuela has a tough time getting her obey off. Shotgun wedding serves no purpose in an all family list. The healing flip is nice, but in my limited experience people focus fire down and the family drops quick. I think Her base crew is so ranged heavy they would struggle when its time to mix it up in melee. Papa seems like a gimmic that is far from an auto include. The brothers seem to closest thing to an auto include. (Franny, Sanny, and Nino) So perhaps more of a balanced list would be: Guild Crew - 35 - Scrap Perdita Ortega -- 4 Pool ---Enslaved Nephilim [2ss] Francisco Ortega [5ss] Nino Ortega [7ss] Santiago Ortega [7ss] Witchling Stalker [4ss] Witchling Stalker [4ss] Witchling Stalker [4ss] Or in that list I could drop a Stalker for a Watcher... Wow this game is full of hard choices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcontent Posted March 5, 2012 Report Share Posted March 5, 2012 I like your last list but personally I'd be tempted to drop Franciso in favour of an Austringer. 4ss pool sounds about right too, I rarely use more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brettqpublic Posted March 5, 2012 Report Share Posted March 5, 2012 So how many Soulstones does she need? I wouldn't think any master would be happy with less than 3. Actually, the vast majority of masters want to play with as close to 8 as possible. Personally, I like to have 6 for Perdita (8 would be ideal but her starting cache is too low for that to be a viable option in 35SS games). Use Soulstone is the best ability in the game. Between making attacks vs. your master miss, reflipping init, preventing damage that would kill your master, and ensuring attacks land there's always a use for those stones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgraz Posted March 5, 2012 Report Share Posted March 5, 2012 For Perdita I find the soulstone sweet spot to be 5. I try to not go with less but if I have an extra 1 or 2 that's okay but normally if I have more than 5 I have some left over when the game ends. She is so good defensively that she is rarely in a position that she needs them to survive. Don't forget when list building that you build the list after determining strategy and seeing the terrain. I have often said that you don't really play a given master, you play that faction. I don't play Perdita, I play Guild. A nice spread of models to choose from is best and, you could buy every available model for a faction and you would still only have spent enough to start a WHFB army. That said, I agree that with Perdita; Nino, Santi, Franky and the Neph are pretty standard. They provide a solid mix of mobility, short & long range firepower, melee, and survive-ability. I swap in DM's, WS's, Austringer's, a Watcher....whatever, depending on strats / terrain / opponent. I rarely take 3 DM's or WS's but I might take 2 DM's and 1 WS or vice versa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brettqpublic Posted March 5, 2012 Report Share Posted March 5, 2012 Don't forget when list building that you build the list after determining strategy and seeing the terrain. I have often said that you don't really play a given master, you play that faction. I don't play Perdita, I play Guild. A nice spread of models to choose from is best and, you could buy every available model for a faction and you would still only have spent enough to start a WHFB army. That said, I agree that with Perdita; Nino, Santi, Franky and the Neph are pretty standard. They provide a solid mix of mobility, short & long range firepower, melee, and survive-ability. I swap in DM's, WS's, Austringer's, a Watcher....whatever, depending on strats / terrain / opponent. I rarely take 3 DM's or WS's but I might take 2 DM's and 1 WS or vice versa. This x 1000. Malifaux is a game that rewards you for playing depth of faction, in particular with book 1 masters. I find myself usually sticking to a core of models for each master. In most cases this core is between 15-20 points. The remaining 15-20 points of my list are spent tailoring my list to strategies, terrain and opponent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the junkie Posted March 5, 2012 Report Share Posted March 5, 2012 Thanks for the advice. Im glad I bought deep into the faction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
micahwc Posted March 5, 2012 Report Share Posted March 5, 2012 Personally I don't like running a lot of family with Peredita. The alpha strike is great the one time you can use it before your opponent has seen it. All of the family models are expensive, and I personally feel like there are cheaper options which can fill the same roles for most of them. Nino is the only one I really like, as he is the best sniper in the game. Witchling stalkers are better at melee than anything in the family. They are also cheaper. Watchers are great for objectives. A peace keeper, while it may be card consuming without Hoffman, can keep up with Peredita and put the hurt on just about anything. I think that with most of the family models you are paying way to much for the companion ability. There are other models which work better for less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgraz Posted March 5, 2012 Report Share Posted March 5, 2012 I think that may be just a tad harsh. Yes they are a little pricey, but I don't think they are over priced. You are paying extra for the companion, but that can come in pretty handy. It doesn't have to be the 'alpha strike'.....sometimes just two models acting can really swing a game. Lots of masters have it built in as a 0 action but any Ortega can do it. I agree that the Witchlings are better in melee....but the Ortega's are all shooters so that makes sense. Witchlings are not better in melee than Francisco IMO....better CB, much faster, 2" reach, Duellist and Flurry. They are just as squishy as Francisco...the only bonus there is they blow up when they die. I like them with him for their melee and anti-magic abilities. I do really like the Peacekeeper...he is worth every point. As a cheaper melee monster, Judge can be real handy with Perdita. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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