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2 Viktorias


Sezar

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Then what is the point on the Ability "Weapon Selection" then? If you cannot choose to have them both equipped the same why does that Ability exist?

You can't field one without the other at the start of the game (so no need to choose if you can't have them with the same weapons), and you cannot summon a new one without the other, so again you wouldn't even have the chance to choose their weaponry anyway, since the new one would have to have the weapons the summoner is not wielding...

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You do NOT field two Viktorias. Viktoria (either one) is a master model. When you make your crew, technically, you only have one Viktoria in your list.

Before you deploy, you get a second Viktoria for free.

When you deploy, Weapon Selection forces you to choose one of the two Viktorias which loses its gun and gains a sword.

When you SUMMON a Viktoria (ie, using "Another One?") you can summon either Viktoria, armed as you wish, regardless of which one is already in play, as long as you have an appropriate model to do so.

I'm totally with you though. Because of how badly the Viktoria's rules are worded, there is nothing to stop you buying two Sword Viks, and having two Sword Vik cards, and then starting the game with two sword Viks. You must still follow Weapon Selection and "select one Viktoria model", but since it has no Clockwork Pistol to lose and already has paired, the effect does nothing.

Interesting. Wonder if any Viks players have ever thought of this before. I can't see any reason why you can't do it RAW.

Edited by Calmdown
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When you SUMMON a Viktoria (ie, using "Another One?") you can summon either Viktoria, armed as you wish, regardless of which one is already in play, as long as you have an appropriate model to do so.
Huh - never noticed that before. Don't think I would ever try doing it, though.
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The idea is not to buy 2 Swordmistress models, but to convert the Bounty Hunter one with a removeable left hand, to switch it from having a pistol or another Masamune depending on the game and my plan.

I cant see any reason why it wouldn't be legal to have two sword Viks as mentioned before. Obviously it wouldnt work with two gun Viks though, as one of them would lose its gun.

Summoning can still get you either.

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It's been ruled before that you always summon the 'other' Viktoria after casting Another One, tried to do a search, but couldn't find the original ruling.

Goblyn restated it here though.

Good find.

That ruling breaks the Viktorias though :)

"Each Viktoria is individually unique"

This means that when you get your second Viktoria at the start of the game, you have both Gun Vik and Sword Vik in your crew. Then "Weapon Selection" kicks in, gun Vik loses her pistol, and hey Presto - you have two Sword Viks. And then the universe implodes.

Also, the card specifically states that whilst Viktoria is unique, you may have two in play.

Basically, the ruling you linked makes no sense at all and completely breaks the card mechanisms. I'd say at worst it should be ignored, and at best it needs to be re-ruled, because making both Viks unique is definitely not the correct ruling to address the questions in this thread.

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This means that when you get your second Viktoria at the start of the game, you have both Gun Vik and Sword Vik in your crew. Then "Weapon Selection" kicks in, gun Vik loses her pistol, and hey Presto - you have two Sword Viks. And then the universe implodes.

Not quite. If you bought the Viktoria whose card does not have the pistol, then after "Weapon Selection" kicks in you would have one Viktoria with paired Masamune Nihonto, and one that lacked both a pistol and paired. Check the card: the Masamune Nihonto is not paired until Weapon Selection makes it so. You can therefore have one Sword Vik, and one Gun Vik without a gun if you so choose (and the model must accurately reflect this). :P

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Or alternatively you could just take the ruling as 'you cannot have two of the same Viktoria' and be done with it, knowing in your heart that you play them as they were intended.

Unfortunately this is not how rules work. There is no "oh, we know what they meant so lets do that" in competitive play. The card as written functions a specific way (the way I've stated above) and until a rules marshal rules otherwise, that cannot change. Erratas and rulings are they mechanism by which rules people let us know what was intended so we don't have to infer it :)

Not quite. If you bought the Viktoria whose card does not have the pistol, then after "Weapon Selection" kicks in you would have one Viktoria with paired Masamune Nihonto, and one that lacked both a pistol and paired. Check the card: the Masamune Nihonto is not paired until Weapon Selection makes it so. You can therefore have one Sword Vik, and one Gun Vik without a gun if you so choose (and the model must accurately reflect this). :P

True.

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Unfortunately this is not how rules work. There is no "oh, we know what they meant so lets do that" in competitive play. The card as written functions a specific way (the way I've stated above) and until a rules marshal rules otherwise, that cannot change. Erratas and rulings are they mechanism by which rules people let us know what was intended so we don't have to infer it :)

Really?

Earlier you said:

Good find.

That ruling breaks the Viktorias though :)

"Each Viktoria is individually unique"

This means that when you get your second Viktoria at the start of the game, you have both Gun Vik and Sword Vik in your crew. Then "Weapon Selection" kicks in, gun Vik loses her pistol, and hey Presto - you have two Sword Viks. And then the universe implodes.

Also, the card specifically states that whilst Viktoria is unique, you may have two in play.

Basically, the ruling you linked makes no sense at all and completely breaks the card mechanisms. I'd say at worst it should be ignored, and at best it needs to be re-ruled, because making both Viks unique is definitely not the correct ruling to address the questions in this thread.

So, you want a Rules Marshall to give a ruling to change it, yet you'll ignore the Rules Marshall's ruling on it because you disagree with it?

I must be missing something.

Can you explain your position here?

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