Plastic Kits?

[carbon]

I really like Privateer Press's plastic models, but what I would really prefer from wyrd, would be to go to resin models. I prefer resin, over both plastic and metal.

[Bellygrub]

If Wyrd did plastic I would buy one of every model kit they made. I HATE working with metal. I have since 1989! Plastic is so much easier to convert, paint, drop, transport, etc etc etc.

Currently Malifaux models are the only models I buy in metal. Damn Gremlins...

[GunslingerPanda]

In my experience, metal is absolutely horrendous to work with, so I would love to see some plastic kits.

[Sliver Chocobo]

I my experience plastic is weightless and no sense of quality to it

[Smokey616]

I concur! Keep up the good word Wyrd!! Must be cheaper to make plastic otherwise 'They who should not be named' would have carried on with metal. I was that disappointed when I started looking into restarting 40k after nearly 16 years of not playing, that I didn't bother. Metal is good. Lord chompy bits weighs like he could kick your ass. When those little dudes turn up in the post you've got your money's worth out of the hideous postage. It feels like a cool package rather than a box of air. Please Wyrd, don't sell us pants plastic stuff. It's ok, my wrists can withstand another few decades of lifting them heavy little buggers. For thine is the flurry. Soft cover, hard cover... Amen

[Ratt]

I concur! Keep up the good word Wyrd!! Must be cheaper to make plastic otherwise 'They who should not be named' would have carried on with metal.

Part of the shift was blamed on the ability to forge their material. I know personally about three people with the capacity to make models using straight from the blister minis.

Personally, I love plastic over metal, but at the end of the day, any miniature producing company has to do what's right by them. If metal is the way to go for Wyrd, I'll cop it and continue playing. If they decide to go with plastic, expect some conversions coming from me... (oh, and I'll still continue playing...)

[carbon]

I my experience plastic is weightless and no sense of quality to it

No offence, but I do not agree with the weight = quality argument. Personally, I like some weight to them, but I would much rather weight my bases than have models that can be rather top heavy. If the materials used were up to me, I would have them in resin, cause while I have not seen Malifaux's current resin minis, I know that a lot of detail can be put into them, from seeing games like Firestorm Armadas minis, or custom minis like those from Sciborg.

[Sliver Chocobo]

No offence, but I do not agree with the weight = quality argument. Personally, I like some weight to them, but I would much rather weight my bases than have models that can be rather top heavy. If the materials used were up to me, I would have them in resin, cause while I have not seen Malifaux's current resin minis, I know that a lot of detail can be put into them, from seeing games like Firestorm Armadas minis, or custom minis like those from Sciborg.

Wait I didn't say that. I said it is weightless and has no sense of quality. I like the resin snow storm it might have weighed less than metal, but still felt like there was some quality to it

[Punchausen]

I would absolutly love it if the figures were converted to plastic... but it's a moot point.

The cost in creating the plastic moulds is staggering - you really have to be manufacturing vast quantities/volume of plastic to get a ROI; hence vehicles and squads being plastic, and characters being FineCast.

Also bear in mind that about 85% or whatever of the wargaming market is GW, and even then they're slective about what is moulded in plastic...

[Eisenhorn]

Overall I agree that plastic is much easier to work with and I have had a blast converting numerous 40k armies in the past to make them more appealing and interesting. I would like to say that this argument applies to the Malifaux range but in the end it doesn't. This is because I have yet to pick a Malifaux figure and say wow I wish I could make this better. The figure range (IMO) is so damn good I honestly couldn't make them better even if they were plastic. Also one of the main reason to do a custom pose on a 40k figure is to make it different from the other 60 + similar models that you just dropped on the table. Instead of a change to plastic or resin I would rather see an expansion of the existing ranges. For instance create approximately 3 - 6 more sculpts for mindless zombies, SP Abominations, and gremlins. Same goes for guild guard, death marshals and other minions that could be taken in mass... Except alps... don't give people any more reason to buy them.

[candiedwhiskey]

It comes down to cost. Plastic minis require a lot of upfront cost to manufacture the molds. Once you get the molds, casting is cheap as chips (well, not literally).

Metal molds don't cost a lot, but casting in the long run is more expensive than plastic. However you can still cast a certain low-quantity amount and still have your total cost be cheaper than plastic.

This is why if you're going to do low-quantity casting, metal is better than plastic. If you want to make a lot of models cheap, plastic. This isn't always the case, though, but is best a rule of thumb to understand why some things are plastic and some in metal.

[Ratty]

Originally Posted by Smokey616

I concur! Keep up the good word Wyrd!! Must be cheaper to make plastic otherwise 'They who should not be named' would have carried on with metal.

It's not quite that simple, it's down to scales of economy. (Note all numbers are made up, but demonstrate what actually is going on) A plastic mold might cost $100,000 but practically lasts for ever, each turn might cost $1 in materials. A metal mold might cost $100 and last 100 models, but the materials cost $6 per batch.

So to make 5,000 models. plastic would cost $105,000

to make metal would cost $8000

now make 100,000 models. plastic would cost. $200,000

to make metal would cost $700,000

There is a point where your sales are high enough that plastic is cheaper.

[Smokey616]

Part of the shift was blamed on the ability to forge their material. I know personally about three people with the capacity to make models using straight from the blister minis

Not too well up on the actual production of miniatures, metal or otherwise to be honest, but I think I was just being cynical "The nameless ones" products just seemed to morph from a fun loving cheesy romp, into a coin producing cash cow. Which in turn lead me to believe everything they did had some lucrative agenda to it (which,with them, it does! Hence multimedia entertainment corporation) It took years but even White dwarf changed from a hobby periodical to a catalogue. I'm running sorry. I suppose, looking at it from a different vista, the change from metal to plastic was the least of their worries. As long as the cool mofos at Wyrd keep doing as they are doing with the most inventive piece of intellectual property I have seen in years, and the hardworking, most helpful, rules marshals continue their work within the community to make this game a living thing, then I have nothing to worry about really

Thank you dude for helping me toward this conclusion I didn't quite understand what you said about the blister pack minis. You only know three people who just use stock miniatures and don't convert?

[Smokey616]

It's not quite that simple, it's down to scales of economy. (Note all numbers are made up, but demonstrate what actually is going on) A plastic mold might cost $100,000 but practically lasts for ever, each turn might cost $1 in materials. A metal mold might cost $100 and last 100 models, but the materials cost $6 per batch.

So to make 5,000 models. plastic would cost $105,000

to make metal would cost $8000

now make 100,000 models. plastic would cost. $200,000

to make metal would cost $700,000

There is a point where your sales are high enough that plastic is cheaper.

Managed to completely miss this post before eagerly hurling the last one in! I am thick at times!

Thank you ratty dude! Makes sense, never had it explained before. And I suppose following the logical progression, and the economic model; this being such a peach of a system, coupled with the absorbing fluff and imagery, it can only grow with it's renown. Therefore, needing to replace with more cost effective plazzies.

[Smokey616]

Speculational

[011121]

I really don;t get the weight as a positive thing. The last thing I want is my minis to weight a lot, for a number of reasons- it makes them that much more of a pain to transport, makes them more likely to tip over in general, and puts extra stress on the joints. It also makes converting a pain in some cases.

Case in point I want to change my LCB so that instead of being vertical he's leaping out nearly horizontal at the enemy. It makes the model seem vastly more dynamic. The problem is the huge weight of the mini means I need something quite strong and heavy to counterbalance it once it's no longer vertical. If LCB were plastic I would have had him finished long ago. But because he's metal I'm still scratching my head and thinking about insane ideas like using a hammer drill to drill post holes into a chunk of heavy rock.

[hakoMike]

Resin I can see, and would have no issues with. If it's cheaper to manufacture then I would be all for it, even at the current price point. Same sales + better margin = healthier company. Yay for healthy companies making things I love.

Injection molded plastic has a challenge above even the tooling cost. The sculpts can have exactly zero undercuts, meaning every model would have to be completely redesigned. Check out Steve Buddle's discontinued blog for lots more info on that. It may be defunct now that he's working for GW but it's still great reading.