The way I'd thought Molly Squidpiddge would be.

[Sandwich]

Better idea.

Seamus player here.

Can anyone give me a general idea of how Molly is supposed to be more useful? I try to get the best out of her, but she's just a 9 point sink.

Are two Belles and an extra soul stone more valuable than Molly?

Using her as a subbordinate.

Edited December 28, 2010 by Sandwich

[LastDinosaur]

Well obviously this is what you'd want as you're a Seamus player...

But really.. Your version of our dear Molly is severely imbalanced.

[Sandwich]

Tell me how, please.

I'm just bored and she doesn't really do much for anyone at my LGS currently.

[LastDinosaur]

Well..

For starters:

Wp 8 + Pitiful + Twisted Mind makes her unkillable by anyone but Perdita and models in Lady J's crew - the few other ways to damage her is then further mitigated by her Long Forgotten Knowledge. The Gorgon's Tear makes it even worse yet.

With this I fail to see why I'd ever even try to attack her if I were her opponent, however her support abilities are so damn good aswell that I pretty much have to.

Imbue Vigor for instance is stupidly strong, it's a very good spell already, even without the twists.. Why make it better?

It's also the balance between the usefulness of her different abilities that seem totally off..

[Sandwich]

I'd agree with you, really.

I'm just trying to improve her.

Because she really needs it.

[LastDinosaur]

I don't think she's that useless, but yeah, I can't really tell as I haven't actually seen her in action yet.. I know people have been complaining about her before (but that might've been you aswell..?), so maybe there's something.

Anyway, it could be that she'll only truly shine after the release of Book3.

Kaeris and Collodi have to wait aswell.

I don't have my book currently and don't remember her card in detail, so can't really suggest anything, but I trust you already tried out most of her abilities.

[Sandwich]

Well, I have asked for information about her before, more specifically, how she is to be used, but that's as far as I can remember.

I'm thinking I need to abuse her more.

I.e. make her terrifying and pitiful and stick her in the middle of a bunch of bad guys.

[cannonball]

With no games under my belt I'd use her as your sole high cost model in your crew and fill the rest out with cheap undead. Ala Belles, Crooked men and Punk Zombies.

[0]Impossible Knowledge looks great for chipping away when you've got a lot of other shambling dead taking the wounds for you.

[1]Terrible Secret looks handy when you run with Seamus and his -2Wp debuff. Double -ve flips aren't too bad for the rest of the game. And with a decent range you'll get better use out of it if you can pop it off early.

[0]Whispered Secret looks like a good way of getting a Belle's [1]Distract off as Molly has a better Ca than the girls. Also [1]Cave in and [1]Shafted aren't too bad either. And mix that in with [1]The Shocking Truth to begin with and hope for slow or at best a Paralysed and you'll trigger a shafted marker before you know it.

That said when more Horror units come out I'm sure she'll only get better and better.

[DangerousBeans]

I think she'll run much better leading a crew than being a henchman, unfortunately we have to wait (but hopefully not too long) for that.

When doing the field test for Rising Powers we were shown a snifter of what's to come, just be patient.....

[Stargazer]

Let me just say I always run Molly alongside Seamus usually in 30ss games and these are the things I have observed about her and her uses.

Molly is nigh on unkillable by anything short of a master and even then it's tricky, the Terrible Secret spell (one of her most useful to set Seamus up for an irresistible flintlock strike!) is brilliant, and either your opponent uses a decent card to stop it going off or their master/hard unit you just cast the spell on is in BIG trouble.

The Shocking Truth spell is pretty good as well, yes it might be low damage but when your opponent throws something hard at you and you can make it slow or even paralyzed it means that that big scary unit has been almost completely nullified for a turn (or hopefully longer). Use her to lock things in combat allowing Seamus continue to run around firing his flintlock at people etc, in the meantime molly should be fine and might even kill whatever she's in combat with. Her pitiful (btw always use the (0) action which reactivates this!!!) is incredible as again it means your opponent might have to burn their hand to even hit you, meaning less nasty cards to be used against you. Ally that with her defensive trigger (again let your opponent cheat to a positive flip and hopefully soulstone as well before informing him all of that does nothing!) and she is pretty hard.

If she dies then use her slow to die to cast philosophy of uncertainty on whatever has just killed her or another scary model nearby.

Basically dont look at her as a summoning factory or as an overtly offensive model. She is great at buffing, absorbing damage and doing little things behind the scenes boosting your belles making them far better in the process (Impossible Knowledge is great as is extraordinary dead!)

Hope that helped

Stargazer

Edited December 28, 2010 by Stargazer

[Natty]

If she dies then use her slow to die to cast philosophy of uncertainty on whatever has just killed her or another scary model nearby.

Don't forget that as a Henchmen she has use soulstone, so she can slow to die and use a soulstone to heal.

I have never played her but when I read her I kind of always thought of philosophy of uncertainty as the reason she can summon in more totems and then make the totems cast it and burn a soulstone to make it an irresistibly high cast. Using her totem and a soulstone to take out your opponent's biggest minion is pretty sexy.

Again, I've never played her or against her, and it seems situational, but it also seems REALLY nasty.

[Stargazer]

Yeah I'd agree that is another good use, of course heal if you have the soulstones spare but remember you still have Seamus to look after!!

The whole Totem thing is again great if you can manage it but remember you need 2 corpse counters to summon one in the first place which is equivalent to 2 belles when you have Seamus in the crew.

[M_Ruckuss]

Yeah I'd agree that is another good use, of course heal if you have the soulstones spare but remember you still have Seamus to look after!!

The whole Totem thing is again great if you can manage it but remember you need 2 corpse counters to summon one in the first place which is equivalent to 2 belles when you have Seamus in the crew.

I'd have to agree with Stargazer, shes amazing!!!

I always feel obliged to have 3 high cards when attacking her to avoid the fallout from her dying. The one time I managed to kill her was when I attacked her with like 4 Canine Remains, wounded her and reduced her willpower.

Plus rocket belles are filthy!!!!

As, (i believe the last dinosaur said, apologies if it was someone else) you either ignore her, which doesnt work, or kill her, in which case seamus and copy can broadside your crew, oh and then there is sybelle, who (i think) can be summoned back by Molly, which (if is so) is ridiculous as she is pretty hard for 1 6/7 ss model (I much prefer her to mortimer or sebastion-bar the bloody harvest spell) and is despensible and can just be repeatedlt summoned back.....

I have no problems when playing Seamus, I've pretty much drawn or won every game I played against him with McMourning and Lilith....unless Molly was included in the list.

Add to this the fact she will probably get a boost in book 3 with collodi, marcus and kaeris, for me she has to be the best non-master resse model along with datsue-ba....

At least thats my 2 cents...

[Sandwich]

(0)Impossible Knowledge has been completely worthless when I use it. Most models are either not living, or ranged, and it doesn't help one bit.

The only bout of usefulness I have ever had with Molly was when I treated her like a Rotten Belle and threw her into the Fray and left her to die.

(1)Terrible Secret has been nice to me, though.

My current plan is to go

35 Soul Stone Game led by Seamus

Molly Squidpiddge - 9 SS

Bete Noire - 9 SS

Convict Gunslinger - 6 SS

Copy Cat Killer - 2 SS

Rotten Belle - 4 SS

Rotten Belle - 4 SS

That leaves me with a Cache of 3.

I'll plant Molly in the back with the Convict and use her to spam (1)Terrible Secret and instead of using (1)The Shocking Truth, I'm going to steal the Convict's (1)Suppressing Fire.

I'll post with the results.

[M_Ruckuss]

(0)Impossible Knowledge has been completely worthless when I use it. Most models are either not living, or ranged, and it doesn't help one bit.

The only bout of usefulness I have ever had with Molly was when I treated her like a Rotten Belle and threw her into the Fray and left her to die.

(1)Terrible Secret has been nice to me, though.

My current plan is to go

35 Soul Stone Game led by Seamus

Molly Squidpiddge - 9 SS

Bete Noire - 9 SS

Convict Gunslinger - 6 SS

Copy Cat Killer - 2 SS

Rotten Belle - 4 SS

Rotten Belle - 4 SS

That leaves me with a Cache of 3.

I'll plant Molly in the back with the Convict and use her to spam (1)Terrible Secret and instead of using (1)The Shocking Truth, I'm going to steal the Convict's (1)Suppressing Fire.

I'll post with the results.

I'd go with:

Seamus(Cache2ss)

Copycat 2ss

Molly 9ss

sybelle 6ss

3 belles 12ss

You then have 6ss to play with.

Pitiful is wrong when you cheat it and trigger twisted mind-its like a mini version of Pandoras abilties.

Shes a belle so can companion. Necrotic spray is great for increasing damage of nearby models. Oh and all belles gain +2wk/cg and they ignore most movement penalties...

She cant be affected by spells which target undead (sorry lady J).

She is instictual so has the ability to ALWAYS have pitiful up

Check this one- when she gives other models necrotic spray, does each affected model make a model suffer wounds, so like it suffers 2wds then 4wds for 4 models within 1"?

Reveal philip- used correctly there is virtually no way at least 1 living model is not going to fall back....

Masterful dead- awesome/broken. great if you have a 1/2/3/4/5/6/7 crow played, in your hand.

Philosophy of uncertainty-great if you prepare for it-keep a high crow handy and you may well smack a master of high cost minion who is not prepared for this (oh yeah and ss...)

Terrible secrets followed up by the shocking truth= (when used correctly) a paralyzed model with a - to its flips...oh and reactivate pitiful.

Yeah sure, she requires skill to use but she is much better than bette, especially with Seamus. If used correctly she can hit, as I stated earlier, like a mini Pandora. Shes a pain in the arse and I HATE playing her. I would even consider her in A McMourning list with 1/2 belles.

I dont see how you dont get the best out of her: prepare her for taking out high cost minions and masters when/if she dies. if she doesnt she can ignore damage when you have a crap hand (if its good you can block anyway) is great at propelling belles forward, and is only likely to get better when the new book comes out. COuld you not also connect a grave spirit potentially as well?

Use her to tie up you opponents crew, stuff you arent ready to hit/dont want to engage AT ALL, use Seamus and copycat to take out other components (Molly and Seamus together are a terrifying prospect) and Belles can still move farther is they start within her walk to complete objectives quickly. Put sybelle next to her with maybe another belle or 2 and they really wont go ANYWHERE

Edited December 28, 2010 by McDoogle

[Stargazer]

I agree with everything McDoogle has said above, she works best when the other models in your crew aren't ridiculously expensive (Yes Bette I'm looking at you!) mainly because it's with the belles and sybelle where she has synergy boosting her effectiveness greatly.

I find using a 0 action on copying a spell pretty pointless as either gorgons tear or impossible knowledge is simply better (mainly due to the lack of draining a crow from your hand which is better used negating damage/twisted minding people) as well as the auto use uncontrolled crying.

Try using her to lead the main force ie. the belles. They will still be pretty fast moving and use them to achieve your scheme. This then frees up Seamus and Copycat to just cause mayhem/achieve schemes/stop your opponents strategies and schemes.

The cache you have of 3 really isnt going to be that useful when you have 2 models wanting to use the soulstones.

Stargazer

Edited December 29, 2010 by Stargazer

[cannonball]

Molly Squidpiddge - 9 SS

Bete Noire - 9 SS

Convict Gunslinger - 6 SS

Copy Cat Killer - 2 SS

Rotten Belle - 4 SS

Rotten Belle - 4 SS

If your using the Convict Gunslinger and Molly to spam [1]Suppressing Fire then why not try a ranged crew? What about swapping in 2 Crooked Men instead of Bete Noire? With them dropping cards to stop Paralysed I'm sure you'll get better use out of Shafted. Just an idea and you did mention you were facing more ranged crews.

[cannonball]

Also another aspect to think about is Molly casting Seamus's spells as well. With her casting away this can leave Seamus to spend his actions shooting things or casting as well.

I know there's always the totems to do this but Molly has a decent Ca stat and she has feathers plugged in already. [1]Undead Psychosis works great on anything and handy for scenario play to.

[edit] And when coupled with well placed Shafted markers you can deny a large part of the table to things that want to be in melee.

Edited December 29, 2010 by cannonball

[Sandwich]

There's no way in hell I would ever play a game without Bete, she's my HBIC.

I'm not a huge fan of Sybelle, but she is too valuable to not take, but with Molly, I really don't need to start with Sybelle because I can just summon her later on, and between Seamus, the CCK, and Molly, I'm guaranteed two Corpse Counters, even if its from my own Belles.

I will continue to play Molly until I can get her to work.

Keep the ideas coming, though, please.

[M_Ruckuss]

There's no way in hell I would ever play a game without Bete, she's my HBIC.

I'm not a huge fan of Sybelle, but she is too valuable to not take, but with Molly, I really don't need to start with Sybelle because I can just summon her later on, and between Seamus, the CCK, and Molly, I'm guaranteed two Corpse Counters, even if its from my own Belles.

I will continue to play Molly until I can get her to work.

Keep the ideas coming, though, please.

She def works- just keep practising and be aware of the fact she is an unconvential model in many respects by resse standards...

[cannonball]

There's no way in hell I would ever play a game without Bete, she's my HBIC.

I guess just different approaches to skinning a cat eh? For my money I'd like a few more numbers on the table to play the activation game. Then again if your having fun, who cares?

[cannonball]

Just throwing ideas out there but Seamus, Molly and Jack Daw could be rather handy. Throw Jack Daw up the table with Seamus and Molly following up behind. Get Jack to cast [0]Severed Ties and create a great debuff bubble. [1]Terrible Secret and [1]Undead Psychosis are going to be pretty handy when they can't cheat. Also [0]Doomed for -1 on resists and defending is just gravy.

That said it's a fair whack of Soulstones to bring them both together so scrimp where you can by taking lowbies. May not be that optimised but it looks fun.

[Sandwich]

Jack Daw seems that, at least in my list, he's a lot more detrimental than helpful.

I almost ALWAYS need to cheat the Pitiful duel or else Molly gets smacked around, and I don't like sacking two cards to stop her from getting punched.

I may try Jack Daw in a game or two to see how he fares, though.

I definately want to try the Molly / Convict duo.

[cannonball]

I almost ALWAYS need to cheat the Pitiful duel or else Molly gets smacked around, and I don't like sacking two cards to stop her from getting punched.

If they're attacking Molly I'm sure they'll cheat as well to make sure their action sticks no? If so your draining their hand as you'll usually have Seamus's [0]Trail of Fear up eh? And overall with undead lowbies dying around you at least Seamus gets a few more cards via Necrotic Ministrations. And if you need to heal Molly you've got soulstones/Slow to Die and Seamus's [1]Live for Pin via [0]Whisper Secrets.

And onto something completely different and not fluffy Seamus and Molly might like an Onryo in there? Good vs. Teddy but maybe a meta list you bring to an event rather than a usual choice for a pick up game.

Otherwise you could go crazy and add in a Shikome in there to? Molly's [1]Imbue Vigor works well with [1]Stalk Prey. Hmm pick a nasty melee based target for Single Minded, activate the Shikome after Molly and you could be 16" up the table before you've even activated the Shikome on the second turn. Yep, crazy antics but at least you're on the way to building a Kirai crew as well.

[tadaka]

I find her to be a lot of fun with levi. At least for the first turn when he walks 18 inches across the table shoot some one for half wounds +1 and then do his 12inch aoe effect. It is great for putting range attack players on tilt knowing I can hit them from much farther away then they can. This is probably my favorite tactic vs guild crews. After that you have a scarry terror effect and she is usefull for all the corpse counters. Other than makeing a waif I don't often spend levi actions summoning.