Question about suits in abilities that require AND add the same suit

[sir_ogrim]

I’m a complete beginner struggling a bit with suits in abilities.

I’ll use Lady Justice’s Restore Natural Order as an example:

(1) Restore Natural Order (Ca 5/ TN: 17 [...continued]

When using this ability I need to reach a target number of 17 rams. I understand that the value 5 and the suit of rams is added to my final duel total. If I only consider this action and nothing else, the following wording of the ability would have the same difficulty, wouldn’t it?

(1) Restore Natural Order (Ca 5 / TN: 17 [...continued]

So... What is the purpose of having rams in both the casting stat and in the target number? Is it because this ability is guaranteed to trigger a rams trigger in the target of the tactical action? Furthermore, are there models that can remove the suit from a casting stat, making it read:

(1) Restore Natural Order (Ca 5 / TN: 17 [...continued]

... instead (ie removing one of the rams), thus making the duel more difficult?

I hope my question makes sense. I have not yet aquired the proper Malifaux vocabulary. Sorrry!

[Adran]

There are 2 answers. Firstly you are right. There are some models that can remove suits from certain stats, so they could make it that justice needs the ram. Otherwise your changed wording would be the same difficulty. 

Secondly, whilst it doesn't apply to restore natural order, lots of actions are on multiple models, so some might have the suit built in while others would need to get it to succeed. 

The in the stat would only be used by justice for triggers, not anything that it targeted. 

[muraki]

Agree with Adran on everything.  I usually think the built in suit for an ability with a suit requirement in the TN is so the developers can give the ability to other models and make it harder / easier.  Leap and Obey are good examples of this.  There are a lot of models with slightly varying starting scores and built in suits / non-built in suits for those 2 actions.  Makes it so the devs can really toggle the difficulty.

A 3rd option (that also doesn't apply to this ability) is that some triggers can use multiple suits.  Critical Strike / puncture, for instance, get better for each Ram in the duel total up to a certain point.  A built in suit for these abilities start you at a better position.

[sir_ogrim]

Thank you for your clear and thorough answers! They were very helpful!

[santaclaws01]

There's also a third answer: flavor. Suits are generally associated with certain types of effects. It's not as rigid as it was in 1st edition but it still holds generally true, and models/actions will have suits in the stat or target number that aren't needed mechanically just for the fluff.