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Yore Huckleberry

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  1. I really like them, but they’re glass cannons that want to fight from mid range to be able to turn things undead and get their 10” shot off. They ignore friendly fire, which is nice when Lady J and possibly the judge or emissary are mixing it up: their best defense honestly is that people are trying desperately to focus down Lady J.
  2. Thanks guys - that all matches the intuitive answer, of course. Plus I think there’s literally a sentence in the rule book that says you resolve rules confusions in ways that don’t break the game, though I’m on a phone now and can’t look it up precisely. As for stat 7 vs size ... I mean, that’s the reason to do it in the first place right? ;D
  3. Suppose you have Agent 46 or a Doppelgänger use mimic on a Death Marshal Pine Box or Brutal Emissary’s Into the Cage. The mimic ability copies the ability until end of turn. What happens if the model is still buried at the end o the turn? The effect that buried it is no longer printed on the card that affected it. So: is the model permanently buried unless it has access to a different unbury effect? I see three cases: 1) the unbury condition becomes applied with the attack and endures: essentially it goes into the void with the model as a reference point. 2) the unbury condition is printed on the attacker’s card and only affects the timing window while the attacker card exists. 3) somehow the ability refers back to the figure whose ability was copied even after the mimic ability expires (I don’t see how this would work in the rules, but it would solve the problem). One big clue seems to be that on the death marshals and emissary, it notes that the buried target unburies if the thing that buried them is killed (or buried ... ) that seems to indicate that the figure and it’s text need to be in the game to have a reference point for the buried target to escape.
  4. It really is convuluted - I agree with @Starrius. But I think that’s how it was worded on the card. I wrote it out basically in case I ever have to argue the point in a tournament ... though hopefully the key point of “plus sign means it’s additive like focus or distracted” will be enough! What’s weird about the wording is that each ability gives it +1”, instead of the ability just saying “equal to X models with this trait” or something, but that’s how it’s worded!
  5. This is the key piece, and it’s why I was finally persuaded when I actually went to the attack steps. The trigger is based off of damage suffered (which equals damage dealt; there’s only one timing window for both and they’re identical). The definition that @solkanand @santaclaws01 keep using (damage suffered is after damage reduction) tells us when to get the damage: at the end of the reduction step. But the “damage beyond remaining health is ignored” rule applies when you’re doing step 4: lowering health by the damage suffered. SPECIFICALLY: you have not yet done this at the end of step 3, so the definition of damage suffered is established at the end of step 3, and AT THAT TIME, nothing has occurred causing you to ignore additional damage. The damage suffered = 5. (Then in step 4, you lower the health by the damage suffered: if this reduces it to zero, you ignore the remainder AT THIS TIME, because this is the only timing window that calls on you to compare them.) It’s tight timing, but it’s persuasive and holds solid when you review it step by step.
  6. Right, so this is an explicit naming of the fact that you carry the value after step 3 as your defined "damage suffered."
  7. Okay: I've changed my mind: HERE is the relevant rules issue: From page 34 of the Rulebook, the timing for damage dealing. 3. Apply damage reduction to incoming damage. Soulstone users can spend Soulstones to Reduce Damage. Any “when resolving” Triggers that reduce damage resolve at this point. 4. The model lowers its Health by an amount equal to the final damage amount. 5. Any effects that happen after a model is damaged or after a model is reduced to a specific Health, resolve at this point. Step 3 implies that you reduce the damage, and then carry forward a damage-suffered amount. Step 4 is a unique step in which the model lowers its health. Therefore the rule about ignoring additional damage applies narrowly here. Step 5 specifically notes that the steps in which "a model is damaged" and "a model is reduced to a specific health" can be separate. Given all of that, it's pretty clear that Drink Blood can use the adjusted value arrived at by step 3, while the "damage is ignored" rule only applies to the effect of lowering health. For the record, I appreciate that @solkan basically said that above -- I just wanted someone to actually put out the clear reference of where the separate things were taking place.
  8. Okay, this is helpful. In the Corrupted Idols description the literal text is "A model in base contact with a Strategy Marker can take the Interact Action and suffer up to three irreducible damage, ignoring Hard to Kill. A model may not suffer more damage than its current Health." So the question there is whether this is 1) a timely notification/reminder of a general game rule that applies here 2) a specific change to the general rules that only applies to Corrupted Idol interacts So, rules-as-written, it simply offers it as a game rule, not a contextualized one. On the other hand, it's literally part of a strategy, so it may simply be creating that rule for that strategy, and specifically applying it only to that particular interaction. It definitely seems like the intent in the CI example is to prevent a model from suffering damage beyond its health in order to achieve a greater benefit. On the one hand, this is when health is being used as a resource for an impact, and not when an extra benefit is being connected to dealing damage. On the other hand, it's a clear example of an effect being directly connected to the amount of damage suffered and that interaction being capped at the model's health. I had been somewhat on the fence, but I think if I were a TO and got the question cold, this would persuade me that models don't suffer damage beyond their health because that damage is ignored. Intriguingly, I think that if you DID target a Hard to Wound model with 2 health and deal 5, the model DOES actually suffer the full damage, since the effect changing the result is that Hard to Wound simply doesn't allow the damage to reduce the health below 1, rather than ignoring the damage directly.
  9. Yeah, I think it's covered by similarly worded items such as Distracted or Focused: anything that comes with a +X value stacks (as opposed to like Slow or an ability like Humiliation in the Field Reporters). I think the way it works is this: In the timing window in which you're about to deploy a model, you check all "When Deploying" effects. For example, if I had a crew with CBasse, BBasse, and a Frontiersman with Home on the Range, it goes like this: 1) I begin to deploy Cornelius Basse 2) "When Deploying Effects" alter the deployment of CBasse 2a) Cornelius's "Home on the Range" affects him, allowing him to deploy +1" beyond the zone 2b) Bernadette's HOTR affects him, allowing him to deploy +1" beyond the zone. Because it is a "+" ability, he is now at 2". 2c) the Frontiersman's HOTR affects him allowing him to deploy +1" beyond the zone. He is now at +3". 3) Cornelius is actually placed on the board. 4) I begin to place Bernadette Basse. Steps 2a-2c now apply to her. Etc.
  10. Like, if the rulebook said "if a model suffers damage greater than its remaining wounds, its wounds are set to 0," then I would read Drink Blood as recovering 5 instead of 2. But against a rule that says the "damage is ignored," I don't see how the model is suffering it. Edit: Hard to Kill, for example, simply says, "When this model suffers damage, if it has 2 or more health, it may not be reduced to below 1 Health." So in that circumstance, the damage is clearly all viewed as suffered at once, but the effect of receiving damage isn't able to reduce your Health below 1. But when a model receives damage equal to its Health, then the remaining damage is explicitly ignored. It seems to me that the damage comes in as a single, indivisible amount (5), and the model then suffers that hit, but 3 of it is ignored by the death rule that calls for damage beyond remaining health to be ignored. It seems to me there's only one timing window for the damage to be ignored in, and that's the one in which it's being dealt.
  11. So, I hear @santaclaws01 and @solkan saying the rule doesn't work this way, but I'd still really like to actually see a ruling or a page reference. I hear what Solkan wrote above that a model can "suffer" any amount of damage but sometimes another effect takes precedence, such as the restriction in going below wounds. But in the case of going below your wound count, the rules literally state that the damage is "ignored," and not that the damage "is not applied to wounds" or something like that. I'm still not seeing the case for damage being simultaneously ignored and suffered by the model. Again, if there's a parallel ruling or an illustrative similar example or a page reference, I'm happy to be made aware of it and shift my position.
  12. I agree with @solkan here -- the incorporeal rules don't allow you to stop your push, but you're okay because the ability itself doesn't require you to be stopped, just to have "come into base contact" during the push. The USUAL way for that is of course to get stopped by it, but you'll have come into base contact even if you charge right through the dreamer.
  13. It feels like Lady J is strong vs Outcasts, too: Tara is hit hard by Jury and Death Marshal Recruiters Lady J can keep up with Zipp to focus him down You can alpha strike Hamlin before he gets going The Lone Marshal and Exorcists have Ruthless to oppose Daw's terrifying, and death marshals are cheap long guns to simply sink shots into Daw's DF 5 to burn out his hand Lone Marshal and Pale Rider can chase down Leveticus's Hollow Waifs before you kill him You can get your melee pieces to Parker quickly You can stand toe-to-toe with Von Schill You can stand toe-to-toe with Viktorias
  14. On a related note, I've had occasion to be grateful for the release schedule recently: I'm a new player and the Guild masters I'm most curious about (Lucius, Perdita, Dashel) aren't out yet, but that's given me the opportunity to really learn and enjoy Nellie and Basse's crews. Nellie I would have got into regardless (I love playing pacifist leaders in conflict games!) but Basse I probably would have passed on ... and TOTALLY MISSED the crazy hijinks of Home on the Range stacking from its "+X" factor! I'm not sure it's super good for tournaments, but it's a blast for casual games, especially early on right now when more people are playing in-keyword and a build with synergies like that can stand up well enough.
  15. Aha! Then yes, hit him from every side with your mountain-sized beef ogres!
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