35ss Lilith List for a Newb.

[Falhurk]

Good Evening All,

I bought some Malifaux stuff and have yet to put it to good use. I was hoping to remedy this by actually playing. In my area 35 points seems to be the standard and although there are other Neverborn models I really like (Baby Kade + Teddy among others) I currently have the following:

Lilith, Mother of Monsters

Mature Nephelim

3x Terror Tot Nephelim

2x Young Nephelim

Cherub

I was considering adding Lelu and Lilitu for an exact 35 points. Is this a good idea? Is it viable?

Eventually, once I know how to play properly, I'd like to pick up the dreamer, LCB along with Baby Kade, Stitched Together, Teddy, Doppleganger, and Coppelius. For now, I want to play, have fun, and learn the game.

[Rameses]

Welcome to Malifaux. You have the start of a decent crew. My suggestion instead of the cherub get a puking snake or arcane effigy.

[Malersatz]

If you get the Blood Shaman and a Desperate Mercenary you can pull some shinnanigans to mature your lesser tots into the larger ones and free up some points for your list by not taking the Mature out the gate. Tuco is really a nice addition and so are Lelu/Lilitu. Though the twins are spendy on points, you will find few who would argue them being definately worth their cost. Make sure you check out the tactics on PullMyFinger for more ideas and a model by model breakdown.

[Falhurk]

I'll put the Black Blood Shaman and the Desperate Mercenary on my to-buy list.

I was thinking that I could run with the following list to learn the game a bit better:

Lilith, Mother of Monsters

Mature Nephelim

3x Terror Tot Nephelim

Cherub

Lelu

Lilitu

With the obvious plan of growing the terror tot's if possible. My impression is that with Lelu and Lilitu requiring a fair amount of fire power to deal with (along with the mature nephalim) the tots will have a reasonable chance of growing and becomming an a potent threat.

Does anyone ever start on the board with young nephalim?

[Ozz]

That list looks like it could be effective, though low on stones, Lilith has a good defence but still likes to have stones just in case

And also, with that list, you may not want to be growing your tots to quickly as they are potentially better objective grabbers whilst they are small if you have a 5 ish of masks or two in your hand they really move:)

[JisaacT]

Lelu and Lilitu are great for competitive play. Very strong ad fun! Ozz is correct she needs

Stones for all sorts of random fun. I start with young nephilims if I have the stones for it. For them to grow is easier than the terror tots because they do not need an extra mask. Just a high card. I prefer the young over the mature just because the potential to grow and a lower SS cost to help keep the cache decent

[Falhurk]

I don't actually own Lelu or Lilitu yet but assuming I did (as they seem like great models to have), how would you change the list to afford more soulstones for Lilith?

Would it be wise to run only 2 tots?

[Mournafein]

In my opinion drop the mature nephilim to a young. Should do it. Young are good, themselves... And 2 blood counters later he's a mature anyways.

[Falhurk]

Hmmm, that would free up a ton of points. Although, I'm a little concerned that I don't have much of a beatstick in the list at that point (does Lelu count?).

Contemporary internet wisdom has been saying it's not worth growing the Young into the Mature when I can grow tots into youngs. Although the extra SS this frees up would be nice (something like 4 right?).

Might be a pretty awesome idea. Couldn't hurt to try it in a couple games anyways. I think I'll be acquiring the rest of my crew this weekend if it's in stock at my FLGS. I'll try to get in a couple low-point games if I can't get ahold of those.

I'm open to other purchase ideas, or thoughts on the crew if anyone else has some ideas. Helpful community here

[Malersatz]

If you can keep it in range, the arcane effigy can pass an extra AP to Lilith for the purpose of casting spells. I don't remember the exact comp of the list, as I'm not at home and don't have my cards on me, but something like the following works well for a grow list;

Lilith

Tots x2

Young x1

Primordial Magic

Black Blood Shaman

Desperate Mercenary

You have the Shaman stab himself to make a B-Counter; kill the merc w/ Lilith to make two more (one on shaman from ability, one one Lilith for killing); heal the Shaman from the Merc's ability; grow a tot; grow a young; enjoy your points advantage over your opponent.

[FoolWithTheFez]

I'm going to cast another vote for the Prime. Magic. I've been using it with Lilith recently myself and there is nothing quite as satisfying as drawing 8 cards to discard down to 7.

[Sybaris]

Welcome to malifaux (ok i was a bit late to the party )

Still, i think you're going down a good path for Lilith, and the previous advice here were nice. For future crew development, you could look at the Waldgeist as well. They work very well with Lilith thanks to her Illusionary forest, plus if you ever grab her Avatar, they work even better. They also bring in a rare Armor +2 to the crew...which, combined with their camouflage, make them harder to kill than many neverborn, especially nephilim.

Edited August 9, 2012 by Sybaris

[Falhurk]

Soo, I've got a good deal from a former Neverborn player which will alter what I'm going to do with my collection a bit. I will be acquiring:

Zoraida Alternate

Voodoo Doll

Collodi

4x Marionettes

Teddy

I'm not sure of the synergy possibilities with what I currently have so it'll be interesting figuring that out..

[011121]

With that I'd highly recommed getting stitched and especially wicked dolls. Zoraida can summon the WD and Collodi loves them.

Teddy is a nice model and he's a bear (no pun intended) in combat but he's a little pokey and can't be obeyed due to immune to influence. He's the odd man out in the group because the rest all work together ridiculously well.

[Falhurk]

So I guess the big question is...

What would you use in a 35ss game if you owned the following models:

Zoraida Alternate

Voodoo Doll

Collodi

4x Marionettes

Teddy

Lilith

3x Terror Tots

2x Young Nephalim

1x Mature Nephalim

1x Cherub

+2 blisters, possibly Lelu and Lilitu (not owned yet)

*edit*

I was also kind of thinking to pick up Baby Kade and make a very mobile list.. I figure between Kade + Teddy, Lilith, and the Cherub, there's potential for shenaniganz... maybe.

[011121]

I haven't used nephilim much so this may not be ideal but:

Neverborn Crew - 35 - Scrap

Zoraida, the Hag

--

5 Pool

Collodi

[8ss]

• Marionette
  [2ss]
  
  
• Marionette
  [2ss]
  
  
• Marionette
  [2ss]
  
  
• Marionette
  [2ss]
  
  
• Mature Nephilim
  [10ss]
  
  
• Terror Tot Nephilim
  [3ss]
  
  
• Young Nephilim
  [6ss]
  
  

The Mature is definitely better than teddy for a Zoraida list since it can be obey'd. The smaller nephilim are there to give you extra activations and threaten to grow up. You only have 5ss but Zoraida isn't a voracious user so she can leave most of them for collodi if he gets in trouble.

An arcane effigy would do wonders for you. Doppelgangers are ridiculously useful as well. And as above stitched and wicked dolls.

[Ozz]

35ss list

Lilith - 8 Cache

Cherub 2 (replace with arcane effigy if you have some spare money in my opinion)

Lelu 7

Lilitu 7

Terror tot x3 9

Young Nephilim 6

For this game you dont want to aim for a standard list for everything, but i think the list above should be able to do well. You have a big hitter in Lelu, and the young. (potentially 2 young if you swap a couple of tots) You have lots of objective grabbers in the tots + lots of activations, and with flay they can still do some damage.

The totem is just for extra spells that you want from Lilith so she can use her AP for more useful things And Lilitu gives some board control.

35 ss

Zoraida 8 stones

Collodi 8

4x Marionettes 8

Lelu 7

Lilitu 7

Desperate merc 2 (ether go desperate merc or avatar for 2 stones, but avatar is more costly so listed the merc instead)

Or if you decide you are not bothered about Zoraida and her cache being full, you can have 6 stones and get an arcane effigy (i am told it is great with her) Or take a terror tot and 7 stones. In non avatar form, Zoraida does not tend to need a huge amount of stones but some is always useful.

This list again has lots of objective grabbers, but less big hitters and more control. As Zoraida will just steal your opponents big hitters when she can for an action. Again you have Lilitu for moving your opponent again. lelu as your only beat stick.

Then you have Collodi and the marionettes. These are very fast, but if positioned poorly, fairly fragile for the most part.

But they are great objective grabbers, and hit and run models with potentially (if you do everything right) 5 attacks each. (Mele expert, flurry and fast) But that requires starting in b2b with the model you attack almost. They have low damage but lots of them with lots of attacks so it adds up fast.

Again this crew is not for everything but is capable of doing a lot.

---------- Post added at 11:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:36 PM ----------

Or the Zoraida crew above looks very good, for some reason i didn't think of not using the twins in ether list

[Falhurk]

Thanks for the excellent information folks!

I think I will try that Collodi list (although I haven't the foggiest notion on how to play Collodi).

How do marionettes compare to terror tots anyways? I imagine at 2ss they're more or less disposable?

[011121]

Or the Zoraida crew above looks very good, for some reason i didn't think of not using the twins in ether list

Sometimes I think I'm the only neverborn player who doesn't use them. Personally I just don't like them model or playwise. Obviously most people do. Like in abundance.

[Ozz]

I dont actually use them to often now with the change to thee dreamer, but i dis like the Lelu model, and love the Lilitu model myself what's not to like about a 4 ft chain whip? But with Zoraida they really are great

[Falhurk]

So, I did acquire Collodi, the marionettes, zoraida, and Teddy.

I don't have Lelu or Lelitu yet. Also, I need to apply paint.

Teddy is quite a bit smaller than I thought he'd be.

Think you'd ever run both Teddy and a Mature Nephalim in the same 35 ss list?

[Ozz]

Depends if you put them in together? It's a lot if damage but also a lot of points in 2 models, I would say not likely a common team but could be fun for you to try if you get them both?

[Falhurk]

I was thinking of something like using Lilith, teddy, mature neph, young nephs, and a cherub to get the second teleport spell off. If I could run up a couple of young nephs and swap them with the heavies for an alpha strike, I figure it might work.

Maybe...

[EnternalVoid]

I was thinking of something like using Lilith, teddy, mature neph, young nephs, and a cherub to get the second teleport spell off. If I could run up a couple of young nephs and swap them with the heavies for an alpha strike, I figure it might work.

Maybe...

Word of warning, you can't teleport Teddy under normal circumstances. he is Immune to Influence meaning that he is immune to the the Wp duel on Transposition. So he is stuck hoofing it in a Lilith list unless you take something that can strip his immune to influence.

Also I would suggest trying out the Primorial magic rather than the cherub a few times and see how it works for you. The extra card in your hand is pretty handy.

[011121]

Can a mature Neph pick up and fly a teddy, or is he too big for that?