Is anything going to fit my playing style?

[CQQLGUY]

First time posting, and fairly new to the game. I purchased the Seamus/Red Chappel Gang box as my first set, and significantly before I even knew if any of my friends would pick it up. Since I wasn't sure if I was every going to play I based it on looks and what I thought would be fun to paint. Fast forward a couple months and most of my group has an army.

My problem now is that while Seamus' set has been largely unsuccessful for me, I believe the problem is a combination of not having the right figures or not having the right army for my playing style.

In miniature games I've played in the past I typically run with army's that are divided between fast light-to-medium range hitters and slower heavy melee strikers. I thought I could get Seamus to perform this way with the Belle's Lure and Sybelle's melee - not to mention Seamus's aptitude at both melee and close range - but I'm being torn through by my friends' armies with little damage done to them. They have a Sonnia, Perdita, Ramos, Collodi, Viktorias, Ophelia, and Lilith. Many of them have good ranged options, and strong melee skills as well. I'd like to not have the same set as someone (but would if it was perfect for me), but what would be the best set for some ranged hitters (damage and/or buff/debuff), with some powerful melee forces?

EDIT: I am current looking at the FREIKORPS Box or the Dreamer plus some other Nightmare figures. Thoughts?

[nilus]

The Dreamer and crew don't have any real ranged attacks. They are all about hit and run melee tactics.

Freikcorp sounds like a better choice for you but it should be noted that playing a Henchman as a master is a bit harder. You get less soul stones to work with and your crew selection is rather limited.

[Pipeline]

Colette, Coryphee Duet, and a pair of Gunsmiths?

[ProdigalPunk]

First, I would suggest getting a convict gunslinger for your Seamus Crew, and possibly a Hanged. I think your opponents crews seem like they would be decent match-ups for you, being that there are a lot of opportunities for them to take Wp duels.

Leveticus or Rasputina might be ok. Probably more Levi then Tina though. Also if you can wait a little bit I would think Kaeris might make for a good crew.

Watch do you tend to run with at the moment?

[ravenborne]

Maybe you should be playing guild?

[Dark Alleycat]

Light fast models,heavy hitting models.

Yeah go Friekorps

von Schill makes a good,mobile as hell,strong and deadly leader.

The librarian can keep everyone alive around her,and if near Von Schill will become near unkillable.

The Specialist and Trapper are both hellaciously fun.

The Friekorpsmen are some of the top 4pt models in the game.

Throw in Taelor for a magic weapon,heavy melee beatstick.

Or Johan or Convict Gunslinger.

they will give you a good way to deal with most things. They do have a bit of a low minimum damage,but great statlines,immunity to blasts and armor that prevents 1-2 damage against everything.

Alternately,get the Viktorias.Get Von Schill as a minion. Get some Ronin and maybe a boy named Sue when he is reelased and you are good to go.

[Q'iq'el]

I'll join voices suggesting you try to modify your Seamus crew first. Hire some Punk Zombies, add a Gunslinger, perhaps the Dead Rider. You have entire faction to choose heavy hitters from, and you can raise your Belles from corpse counters as the game progresses.

[CQQLGUY]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. It's awesome to hear so many options.

Colette, Coryphee Duet, and a pair of Gunsmiths?

I don't know much about any of those figures. I'll make a note to find some more out.

First, I would suggest getting a convict gunslinger for your Seamus Crew, and possibly a Hanged. I think your opponents crews seem like they would be decent match-ups for you, being that there are a lot of opportunities for them to take Wp duels.

Leveticus or Rasputina might be ok. Probably more Levi then Tina though. Also if you can wait a little bit I would think Kaeris might make for a good crew.

Watch do you tend to run with at the moment?

I was told originally that Leveticus had a steep learning curve. At the time I was just learning the game, but now that I've got a little under my belt I'll look in to him.

Right now my army consist of Seamus, Sybelle, 3 Rotten Belles, Copycat, and Bette. Bette has helped me slightly, but I don't have nearly as much control as I'd like.

I've tried dropping Copycat as I can't do much with him. Casting some of Seamus' spells did help me once, but imo I'd rather the SS. That 1 Wd from using his Flintlock is frustrating.

Light fast models,heavy hitting models.

Yeah go Friekorps

von Schill makes a good,mobile as hell,strong and deadly leader.

The librarian can keep everyone alive around her,and if near Von Schill will become near unkillable.

The Specialist and Trapper are both hellaciously fun.

The Friekorpsmen are some of the top 4pt models in the game.

Throw in Taelor for a magic weapon,heavy melee beatstick.

Or Johan or Convict Gunslinger.

they will give you a good way to deal with most things. They do have a bit of a low minimum damage,but great statlines,immunity to blasts and armor that prevents 1-2 damage against everything.

Alternately,get the Viktorias.Get Von Schill as a minion. Get some Ronin and maybe a boy named Sue when he is reelased and you are good to go.

Sounds like I have some other things to look in, but you basically confirmed what I felt about Von Schill. He's likely to be my next crew, but I'll look at everyone suggestions.

I'll join voices suggesting you try to modify your Seamus crew first. Hire some Punk Zombies' date=' add a Gunslinger, perhaps the Dead Rider. You have entire faction to choose heavy hitters from, and you can raise your Belles from corpse counters as the game progresses.[/quote']

I would be willing to modify Seamus and I'll take your advice and check out those pieces. Summoning the Rotten Belles has been unlucky for me. I seem to always get bad card flips when I try it, then I have to cheat it (if I can) which put me down a card for combat and wastes an AP for Seamus who is my heaviest hitter.

Also, Nilus mention that running a Henchman as Master causes some problems. If I heard my friends correctly, doesn't it just mean I recruit the Henchman for free but I don't get a cache?

[Q'iq'el]

Also, Nilus mention that running a Henchman as Master causes some problems. If I heard my friends correctly, doesn't it just mean I recruit the Henchman for free but I don't get a cache?

You don't get a cache per se, but you are allowed to go over the game SS limit by the amount on the Henchman card (it's called the "Resource Bonus"). If you don't use these extra SS, that's your cache. On the top of that your SS pool starting limit is lower - equal to the Henchman's Resource Bonus".

In other words, you can take larger crews than Masters, but your SS pool is generally lower.

[CannibalBob]

I would be willing to modify Seamus and I'll take your advice and check out those pieces. Summoning the Rotten Belles has been unlucky for me. I seem to always get bad card flips when I try it, then I have to cheat it (if I can) which put me down a card for combat and wastes an AP for Seamus who is my heaviest hitter.

You seem a bit heavily focused on combat - which might be the issue you have been having playing Seamus. Spending an AP to summon is not at all a waste. Seamus in general is best when being a giant damage sponge and scaring the bejeesus out of the enemy. Sure, he can kill stuff, and he is better at it than the rest of his crew, but his crew is built around control and durability much more than damage dealing - and that includes the Hatter himself.

Try teaming him up with some Hanged and possibly Jack Daw to start terrifying the enemy. Also, try using the Belles Lure ability in ways other than simply to drag an enemy in for you to kill. Use them to mess with the enemy and muck up their objectives, or to move your own models around the board quicker, etc.

[ProdigalPunk]

Von Schill and Seamus share play styles in some ways, so I think the Friekskorp might also be a little problematic to play. Both armies are best when soaking up damage. They take hits rather well, but are a little lackluster in returning them. You can take some hitters to counter that out, but at the end of the day, they shine best by outlasting your opponent more so then being able to put up bigger damage flips.

Lilith is probably the master you are most suited to play, she seems to have been nabbed by one of your friends already. Lady J is also similar in style, she has a big sword, and puts out lots of damage. Some death marshals, a judge, and an executioner seem like it would fit your style a good deal. I am almost tempted to also suggest McMourning, as he is a little more beat stick then Seamus is, and you could still use the belles, but I am not sure if he is quite what you have in mind. Rezzers lack some high end hitters compared to other factions. Killjoy might also be a nice addition to your army, as he can put up some serious damage.

In your current Seamus list I would say drop 2 Belles and the Copy Cat Killer. Then I would get either a Hanged or 2 Punk Zombies. At some point I would say drop Sybelle too, and put in a gunslinger.

I also am getting the impression your play style does not match Malifaux in general, so it might just take a little time adjusting. Seamus is best when firing his gun (as far as damage goes) which he can only do once, which leaves 2 ap for more utility style things. I would never even bother trying to attempt to cast Arise My Sweets unless I had a card in hand to do it. In Malifaux you should pretty much only cast spells if you can cheat it to win or if you have nothing better to do and hope to get lucky. You could also throw out a low crow and soulstone and hope that puts you over the top. It is better to waste 1 High Card making a new belle then it is throwing out a bunch to save an old one. Let your guys get hit a little (you can still make them work for it), you can take a pretty big beating. But most importantly, look into a gunslinger.

[Serigala]

Have you seen Seamus' avatar? That in itself is reason not to desert him just yet. Obviously noone really knows how the avatars are going to play, but it is clear Seamus' avatar will be a monster in melee.

[nilus]

Have you seen Seamus' avatar? That in itself is reason not to desert him just yet. Obviously noone really knows how the avatars are going to play, but it is clear Seamus' avatar will be a monster in melee.

Some do, He's been out for a few week now.

He is a monster in Melee but he loses a lot of his survivability. Thats actually kinda a trend with the Avatars, most seem to become easier to kill. Almost all of them grow to Ht 3. There is almost a uniform defense drop on all of them. And many of them lose there hard to wound abilities.

[CQQLGUY]

You seem a bit heavily focused on combat - which might be the issue you have been having playing Seamus. Spending an AP to summon is not at all a waste. Seamus in general is best when being a giant damage sponge and scaring the bejeesus out of the enemy. Sure, he can kill stuff, and he is better at it than the rest of his crew, but his crew is built around control and durability much more than damage dealing - and that includes the Hatter himself.

Try teaming him up with some Hanged and possibly Jack Daw to start terrifying the enemy. Also, try using the Belles Lure ability in ways other than simply to drag an enemy in for you to kill. Use them to mess with the enemy and muck up their objectives, or to move your own models around the board quicker, etc.

You know that makes a lot of sense. I guess with these big hitters coming at me I feel like I gotta take them out, but maybe I can just mess with the board/objectives. I will try that with my current army, especially since it'll be a bit before I invest in new pieces.

I also am getting the impression your play style does not match Malifaux in general, so it might just take a little time adjusting.

That's entirely possible. My last mini games were Mage Knight and Infinity which aren't objective orientated. Combat is just what come natural, but I'll have to refocus.

Have you seen Seamus' avatar? That in itself is reason not to desert him just yet. Obviously noone really knows how the avatars are going to play, but it is clear Seamus' avatar will be a monster in melee.

I have not actually. I'm guessing it's on this site somewhere, but I just came here and went straight to the forums really. I'll try to find him.

[mistercactus]

Use trail of fear 0 action most turns. Try to combine it with face of death or undead psychosis. I'm starting to think that this is the better way to play Seamus. (Admittedly I've only played with him twice!)

Belles are solid gold. Use lure to pull models out of melee, out of cover, and out of formation.

Between lure, undead psychosis, and the 6" reach of summoning you should be able to pick and choose what fights happen where.

I'm about to start experimenting with both hanged (for WP and terrifying tricks) and crooked men (handy ranged attack and shafted markers for extra board control).

Hope some of this is useful to you.

[Gensuke626]

I started with Seamus, though I've found a ton of Success with McMourning.

That said, one of the things that people have learned to HATE from my Seamus crew is the amount of Tabletop control I have. Using Lure to draw enemies in then using Undead Psychosis to lock them down has always proved to be a useful strategy when Combat looms. I like the Copycat because while taking that wound everytime he fires his gun is annoying, he does bring an extra .50 Flintlock to the table. If you want a totem with more casting versatility, I suggest taking a Grave spirit, maybe attaching it to Sybelle.

Between A totem and Seamus, you should be able to cast enough Undead Psychosis to keep melee enemies from doing too much damage and with the Belles and Sybelle you should be able to pull in dangerous ranged opponents to lock up in Melee.

Edit-

While I can't exactly help you find a Resser crew that has a good amount of Ranged hit ability (Crooked Men and hanged come to mind though) If you want something that has a bit of speed and a steamroller aspect, try out McMourning. His scalpel sling ability lets him get in and out of combat like nobody's business and the ability to summon Flesh Contstructs or Rogue Necromancies for Melee Hitting power is amazing. Also Nurses can turn Canine Remains into some amazing Cruise Missiles...

Also, as an ancedote...I once had an Undead Chihuahua magical Extend McMourning's Dissection. I Cheated a Red Joker on Damage then flipped a Moderate damage and One-shotted a full-health peacekeeper.

Edited August 11, 2011 by Gensuke626

[CQQLGUY]

So as far as my current crew goes it sounds like I should be running around with Seamus on the front, maybe with a totem and using him to Terrify everything while using his spell to prevent melee'ers from getting close to the belles/sybelle. Then Belle and the Sybelle's should be pulling range attackers into Seamus and Sybelle. Is that about it?

I'm still going to try tweaking this army and if I'm still frustrated after that I'm really looking at Freikorps.

[mistercactus]

Lure into range of Seamus's gun and Sybelle's shriek. Best use of seamus in melee is excessive bleeding autotrigger making defender insignificant for the rest of the game. I wouldn't recommend keeping him in melee against a proper beatstick model like lilith though.

I see Bette Noire as the assassination piece. Don't forget to cast her zero action before you attack though (l do forget this, and it costs me!). Always keep a 10 in your hand to bury her as her slow to die action too.

[Gensuke626]

So as far as my current crew goes it sounds like I should be running around with Seamus on the front, maybe with a totem and using him to Terrify everything while using his spell to prevent melee'ers from getting close to the belles/sybelle. Then Belle and the Sybelle's should be pulling range attackers into Seamus and Sybelle. Is that about it?

I'm still going to try tweaking this army and if I'm still frustrated after that I'm really looking at Freikorps.

That's almost it....Seamus is really most lethal at range...a focused shot from his pistol can put a serious dent into almost anything.

That isn't to say that he Can't kill in melee, he certainly has the triggers for it, but his bag of tools isn't nearly as outright killy as his gun.

Edited August 12, 2011 by Gensuke626

[Devon_v]

I've seen Seamus one shot the Judge. There's a reason you can only fire that gun once a turn.

He's one of my most frustrating opponents when he sits on an objective and just focuses on preventing me from doing what I have to. If I have to kill him, I have to try, but otherwise I find going around him to be a better idea. Undead Psychosis is seriously annoying when I have Taelor ready to beat something down, only she's terrified of it.

Definitely though play to your objectives, or deny your opponent. That's all that matters. Slaughter will come up, and sometimes you have to fight, but if all you have to do is stand in the middle and keep your opponent off your side of the table, then just do that.

Do check out the Dead Rider and Convict Gunslinger though. That Gunslinger would probably be broken if he didn't work for everybody.

[Uncle]

I actually really like Seamus as a mixed Master. With the right crew, there's really not anything he can't do.

He's Fast.

He's fast. With Belles luring him around, he's really fast. With No Escape, he's a little faster.

He's got a great big honkin' gun.

He's hard to kill. Link a Grave Spirit to him and he becomes the most survivable Master I've seen.

He has some darned nasty triggers on his melee weapon.

He's got his own built-in card draw.

I think just using him as a "stand back and shoot/summon" is missing out on a lot of his potential.

[Gensuke626]

I actually really like Seamus as a mixed Master. With the right crew, there's really not anything he can't do.

He's Fast.

He's fast. With Belles luring him around, he's really fast. With No Escape, he's a little faster.

He's got a great big honkin' gun.

He's hard to kill. Link a Grave Spirit to him and he becomes the most survivable Master I've seen.

He has some darned nasty triggers on his melee weapon.

He's got his own built-in card draw.

I think just using him as a "stand back and shoot/summon" is missing out on a lot of his potential.

I'm not sure how attaching a Grave Spirit to Seamus makes him more survivable...

Seamus isn't undead and Strength From Below only works on Undead.

[Uncle]

I'm not sure how attaching a Grave Spirit to Seamus makes him more survivable...

Seamus isn't undead and Strength From Below only works on Undead.

D'oh. I can make a mistake every now and then, right?

My other points remain.