are 10t boring?

[izikial]

hello ninja's

controversial one today, are 10 boring?

I have played a fair amount of each faction and still (after playing on and of since book 1 1st ed) havnt clicked with a faction, I have favourite masters (Lucius and Tara) but cant settle on a faction this has led me to 10t the faction with a bit of everything.

but I digress, the "boring" part. So i have played a little with most masters and theory crafted the poop out of them and ended up un thrilled, not about power just in general

the reasons being

tainted aesthetic: I dont know why i dont get this with outcasts, but the fact Tha 6 other aesthetic are leaking in makes for some very clashing visuals and there for the main Asian theme is dulled

to consistent; all there pushes and plus flips are lovely, its sort of there thing. But it dose lead to a game with less highs and lows.

no big weakness; this is owing to the consistency again, when 10t tend to lose its less about a gamble and more they just made the wrong decision, a good idea in theory but when othere factions have luck it shines, in 10t its just nice

lack combos; I'm a magic player, and my favourite concept is taking a weakness and making it a strength for extreme value, 10t dont have intresting modles to do this with

topsy tervie masters; every other faction in the game has a faction design and keywords to use that are fixed giving them a tighter pool allowing for strong/more intresting design angles, insted of having a master who integrates with there crew, 10t masters tend to feel like they exist outside there crew, and any 10t master could be given the same crew and achieve similar results

so I'm expecting some disagreement with this, but I just felt very blarzay about them after using them, I thought they would bring together differant dynamics from there respective faction and insted felt like the masters got hidden in a wave of focus and plus flips

[Nexus]

As far as the visuals of the faction, they are what drew me in.   Samurai, Ninjas, Giant Cleaver-swinging Turtles, hardcore Monks, Oni, I love it all!
So when it comes to visuals, I think 10 Thunders are top-notch.   But I can see how that would be a bit of a personal opinion.

As far as combos.   I actually think of 10 Thunders as THE combo faction.   Sensei Yu and Shen Long are so combo heavy that the options almost seem dizzying with those two in the same crew.   Jacob Lynch, plus some Samurai to burn through your deck fast, all the Ancestral/Undead shenanigans with Yan Lo and Toshiro, Brewmaster and anything dealing with poison, the list seems endless. 

I do agree that the themes aren't quite as defined as some other factions, but that's why I play Arcanists too.  Every master they have has a very specific theme they want to play with.   10 Thunders does have some themes though, Brewmaster's Poisonous Party, Lynch's Brilliant Darkness, and Yan Lo's Big Trouble in Little China for example.    But yeah, Shen Long, Misaki, etc will gladly play with anyone.   Which is also fun in it's own way, it allows you to really change up what you bring with them each time, searching for those oddball combos.

[daniello_s]

What would make me get into TT would be a Shogun-Master.

Good with melee with some nice Ca support actions to buff/push his crew. I would go wild with him, Samurais, Lone Sworsdman, Katanaka Snipers and other TT models  

[KuroTora]

I enjoy my TT very much ... tbh I sometimes change the style of models to fit the asian theme (converted Killjoy to something close to a Sumotai ... with a giant cleaver) but that's kinda  part of the fun.

I really enjoyed converting the giant kneeling Samurai into my Izamu ... now looking something like the Shredder. (and Genbu is just awesome, as Nexus pointed out)

My Masters are mainly Yan Lo, Mei Feng, and Brewmaster ... Misaki and Shenlong get slightly less tabletime, and I just started playing Jacob Lynch (picked up his box three weeks ago ... since I'm terrified that I get sucked into Neverborn - true, it's a little problem to get his crew in line with the asian theme, but I'm working on that). On the side I play Kirai (another asian-style) and Colette (effects of playing Yan Lo and Mei Feng ... already somewhat in the other factions) ... and very rarely Nicodem.

I quite enjoy the (slightly) different playstyles and would like to disagree with the statement that TT are boring ... at least they're not to me!

With combos I never had problems about too few ... most of the time I would like to hire more models than the SS-Pool allows, for more combos - normally I have to choose which combos I need/want, not how to get combos working in TT.

 

on the other hand I have to agree with daniello_s : I would really enjoy a Shogun/Samurai Style Master for my TT ... perhaps a bit too in your face for the Infiltration-faction, but would be soooooo cool nonetheless ... maybe in the future???

[Eclipse]

On 4/29/2016 at 7:19 PM, izikial said:

hello ninja's

controversial one today, are 10 boring?
...
tainted aesthetic: I dont know why i dont get this with outcasts, but the fact Tha 6 other aesthetic are leaking in makes for some very clashing visuals and there for the main Asian theme is dulled

to consistent; all there pushes and plus flips are lovely, its sort of there thing. But it dose lead to a game with less highs and lows.

no big weakness...

lack combos; I'm a magic player, and my favourite concept is taking a weakness and making it a strength for extreme value, 10t dont have intresting modles to do this with

topsy tervie masters; every other faction in the game has a faction design and keywords to use that are fixed giving them a tighter pool allowing for strong/more intresting design angles, insted of having a master who integrates with there crew, 10t masters tend to feel like they exist outside there crew, and any 10t master could be given the same crew and achieve similar results
...

As you expected, I disagree with some of the above. Surprise!
So let's get on with it!
- Tainted aesthetic: Ten Thunders have some access to models from their Masters' other faction and this dilutes the Asian stuff. If anything, the diversity makes them who they are. Still, if you don't like the way a model looks, don't buy it, don't play it. That's what I do, this is the reason why I'll never play the Tengu (despite loving the $h!t out of the other Oni). Not to mention that you can start converting models to suit your vision (if you have one);
- The pushes, +++ and healing are there to showcase proficiency (imo). The faction relies on capable operatives and rarely swarms the board, preferring elite crews (which require some additional movement and utility such as this to work well). In addition, there are so many unique and fun abilities that say "LOL, no" or "Oh, funky!" that I can hardly say TT are boring.
- The big weakness of the faction is mediocrity... Yes, so many models have ++, pushes, etc. However, basically all (or almost all) models from Wave 1 and some from Wave 2 suffer from the syndrome of "I must do everything" and end up doing nothing particularly well. Try a crew with two High River Monks, two Thunder Archers, two Oiran and Fuhatsu. When you learn to make THIS work, the satisfaction is... Immense.
- When I was starting with the faction I thought the same thing as you: There are no combos in TT. And it's easy to see why, I mean you yourself said that you can run any crew with any Master and still do well (mostly). Well, surprise, molder-muncher: There are combos, and they can get whacky. So I can try stuff I ended up from Jacob Lynch and crew (started with Neverborn) to five Masters in TT (and not seven simply because McGabe and Mei Feng and their crews really, REALLY don't fit my perception of the faction). If you read the above comments you can see that there are quite a few things to try out - particularly because you are not specifically tied down with a keyword. If you want to say that Focus is a TT thing - yes, but that is kinda true for Defensive, and Burning, and Poison, and Ruthless/Relentless.
- The Masters are interchangeable - yep, you got that right. So if you don't like this TT might not be for you. However, I suggest you look at this from another angle: It doesn't matter which Master you take so long as you like them visually, and you can convert them anyway. So if you want the Asian theme you can totally run with the Asian-looking stuff and call it a day.
- Did I mention that there are some models in the faction that you will start out wondering what the hell to do with? Well, when you do figure them out the feeling is great. Yeah, Fuhatsu sucks - if don't think about how you -really- should use him. What can improve him and make him a beast, or how you can give him a totally different role. I have challenged myself to play every Master with two Oiran, Fuhatsu and two Thunder Archers. Do these models have strengths of their own, something unique? Yes, certainly. Are they easy to mess up with? Well, duh. Still, this challenge made the last four games absolutely hilarious. I feel like my skill has grown as a player, and that, my fellow forum-dweller, is not boring at all.

[Lucidicide]

3 hours ago, izikial said:

controversial one today, are 10 boring?

No  I love the easy ones!

[Gort77]

I was kind of like you when i started.  I looked at every faction and tried to find the masters that fit the way i liked to play, while every faction had at least one Master i liked, the aesthetic never really thrilled me.  I chose 10T because of the Samurai, so bought them and the Misaki box and was a little board.  Misaki didn't really do anything for her crew other then kill stuff good.  Once i started playing McCabe and Shenlong i found 10T was the faction for me.  Both those masters have so many different combos it's crazy!

As for your complaint of tainted aesthetics, well i think the problem you might be running into is that the 10T have a strong Asian look to them, which is vastly different from the rest of the game, that when you put models from other factions down with 10T there is a BIG contrast.  Personally i love the mixture of aesthetics.  My favorite is running McCabe with Wastrels and ninjas!

[izikial]

love your reply eclipse.

I have bounced between all the factions and I always find something of putting and that's sort of why 10t makes sense to me so I can pseudo enter othere factions, I think I need to play shenlong as he is one I havnt touched and I think will let me unlock some more intresting facets of the faction

[valhallan42nd]

40 minutes ago, Aaron said:

No  I love the easy ones!

One of the reasons we're no longer using you as a ringer at Nova... ;P

[Eclipse]

12 hours ago, izikial said:

love your reply eclipse.

I have bounced between all the factions and I always find something of putting and that's sort of why 10t makes sense to me so I can pseudo enter othere factions, I think I need to play shenlong as he is one I havnt touched and I think will let me unlock some more intresting facets of the faction

Yeah, do that. Shenlong is as TT as is gets. In addition, he is awesomesause. You will have a lot of fun with his combos

[scarlett fever]

On 29/04/2016 at 4:19 AM, izikial said:

controversial one today, are 10 boring?

I have played a fair amount of each faction and still (after playing on and of since book 1 1st ed) havnt clicked with a faction, I have favourite masters (Lucius and Tara) but cant settle on a faction this has led me to 10t the faction with a bit of everything.

tainted aesthetic: I dont know why i dont get this with outcasts, but the fact Tha 6 other aesthetic are leaking in makes for some very clashing visuals and there for the main Asian theme is dulled

to consistent; all there pushes and plus flips are lovely, its sort of there thing. But it dose lead to a game with less highs and lows.

no big weakness; this is owing to the consistency again, when 10t tend to lose its less about a gamble and more they just made the wrong decision, a good idea in theory but when othere factions have luck it shines, in 10t its just nice

lack combos; I'm a magic player, and my favourite concept is taking a weakness and making it a strength for extreme value, 10t dont have intresting modles to do this with

topsy tervie masters; every other faction in the game has a faction design and keywords to use that are fixed giving them a tighter pool allowing for strong/more intresting design angles, insted of having a master who integrates with there crew, 10t masters tend to feel like they exist outside there crew, and any 10t master could be given the same crew and achieve similar results

So I'm Thunders through and through and I feel like I agree with much of the analysis but not necessarily with the judgement calls.

The aesthetic is a bit garbled, hence I don't play McCabe or Lynch much now, but no more so than many other factions, to my eye only Gremlins and Guild are consistent. I get the feeling you came to Thunders because you suddenly realised you had many Thunder Masters already from other factions, so you probably weren't thinking about how they went together to begin with. I started with Thunders so I've always been thinking about them as a whole as I painted and modeled.

Consistency is a draw for me, I loose to good players but very rarely by more than 1-2 VP, I'm not keen on randomness I like control. When I loose I can always see where I went wrong, there will be Black Jokers and Red Jokers but they shouldn't decide my game if I can help it.

I think Thunders have more combos than other factions, hence the following point in your analysis about swapping Masters in and out of crews, but their combos don't necessarily have the brute force and swing potential of other factions, they're more subtle and sometimes more complex (thinking Shenlong now). But there are so so many. In my opponents I frequently see certain combos from certain Masters again and again, whereas I feel like we get to mix it up ad infinitum. It's like all the different combinations have a purpose somewhere and you're never going to get to the bottom of it.

I can't say I've found Thunders boring.