Guy in Suit Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Chompy was definitely in attendance... I spent the majority of round 3 running the hell away from him! The worst part about VP is that even if you don't know your opponent, you still have a huge disincentive to actually play once you complete your schemes. On the table next to me during the shared destroy the evidence round, one player completed all his objectives after only a few turns, so he simple ran to the corners and let the other guy earn 7 VPs. What should have been an 8-2 win became 8-7, so the next round I was at a lower table than the guy who lost, meh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrabbit37 Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Were the rules all set ahead of time? I know I'd play a tournament differently if I knew VPs were the key than if I knew victories were the key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 But seriously though, straight VP scoring is FUBAR. By any reasonable standard, Dixon beat me fair and square by both VP and differential, but those should be tie-breakers, not the absolute score. Coming in fourth after winning every single game, and the guys in 2nd and 3rd having LOST games just doesn't make any sense. And your complaints have been heard. When the rules were drafted way back last year we modelled our rules after what was ran at Official tournaments at Gencon. Which was the VP scoring system. Now that the Gaining Ground tourney rules have been released we have 3 official scoring methods Domination TP/DIFF/VP Disparity DIFF/VP/TP Accumulation VP/TP/DIFF Expect to see events at Adepticon next year featuring each of these scoring methods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WUWU Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Yeah, that's pretty weak Guy in Suit. I think the tournament winners should be decided on point differential, just for that very reason, and it encompasses win/loss by default. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PicklesGrr Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Those were both available at the show... Does that count as "released to the general public" as per Gaining Ground page 2, proxies? How general is general I guess. Sounds like decent event. The VP as first decider is possibly odd if you don't know about it but if you do then you can plan. I suppose it's odd if people start colluding to score as many as possible - losing 8-7 is better than winning 6-0 (unless your opponent wins overall of course). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Were the rules all set ahead of time? I know I'd play a tournament differently if I knew VPs were the key than if I knew victories were the key. Yep. Draft rules were up in November, Finalized rules with tie breaker scoring were up several weeks ago. Also the rules packet provided at the start of the tourney included all the scoring details. Again I understand peoples complains on the method and have actually changed my personal opinion on my preferred scoring method do in part to these debates. I am actually looking forward to what Nix does at NOVA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrabbit37 Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Again I understand peoples complains on the method and have actually changed my personal opinion on my preferred scoring method do in part to these debates. How have you changed your personal stance on preferred scoring, if you don't mind my asking. It was a short debate we had back home (with Dixon and Nix, no less) a few weeks back when we did the Adepticon Primer and I'm just curious what your thoughts were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Does that count as "released to the general public" as per Gaining Ground page 2, proxies? How general is general I guess. This was discussed at the con and got direction straight from Wyrd. They were also released on the online store that same time so they were out. Adepticon has all models painted rule for all tourneys regardless of system so you could have bought stuff at the con but it needed to be painted. Which meant the only new model I saw on the board for the most part were insidious madness' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WEiRD sKeTCH Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Does that count as "released to the general public" as per Gaining Ground page 2, proxies? How general is general I guess. As far as I know. They were shipped to the distributors. Hence released as far as we were concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrabbit37 Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Were VPs awarded if you stopped your opponent's announced schemes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy in Suit Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Yes, I also should complement that the TO's busted their asses to run this event and did a great job. :grouphug: I was aware of the scoring, I just didn't like it, as posted. I could have shown up with a much harder crew, but I love playin' my girls and just accepted it'd be impossible to get big wins in some match-ups. I honestly expected to get stomped all over as I've never played outside my local meta, but hey, pleasant surprises are always welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrabbit37 Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Regardless, well played, Guy in Suit. Not easy to make it near the top of a pile like that. And with Freik-less Vikis, no less. Kudos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 (edited) How have you changed your personal stance on preferred scoring, if you don't mind my asking. It was a short debate we had back home (with Dixon and Nix, no less) a few weeks back when we did the Adepticon Primer and I'm just curious what your thoughts were. I use to be purely a VP is king guy. I liked the system because it encouraged players to actually care about their Strategies and schemes. In many other competitive miniature games players considered objectives to be that thing they worried about after they tabled there opponent. Basically kill the other guy then make sure you score that point so you are the winner. I liked the fact that a tabled Malifaux crew could win or at the vary least could not consider the game a total loss because they did what they set out to do(at least partially). Now that I have ran a lot of tournies I see that VP can be troublesome mostly from a players perspective. They see each game as a separate battle and feel they should be judged separately and as a TO I need to respect that. What really changed is I realised that my personal preference shouldn't always dictate how I run events. I don't dislike the other scoring methods and if thats what the players want then why should I argue. After all I am not even playing in it So for next years A-con the Hardcore/experience players only tourney will probably be Domination. Now you guys just have to clue me in on when the most Hard core A list Malifaux players want me to run it because apparently Hangover Sunday doesn't work so well(we ended up with about 8 no shows) Edited April 4, 2011 by nilus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy in Suit Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Also forgot to mention: Kevin was a top opponent and deserved Best Sports fo sho. Pretty sure the thematic top hat sealed the deal on that one He even very craftily had Seamus die before I could set up my frame-for-murder, denying me 2 VPs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Nilus did you have Hamelin the plagued at all in the events? Mainly want to know about the scrap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugwhan Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 It's great to see the faction breakdown for the stats. Would it be possible to see a breakdown by Masters? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Yeah Kevin deserved it, as did LeShawn the day before. Honestly with a few minor exceptions I can't complain about any players sportsmanship. People played well and fairly for the most part. The experienced guys were patient with the newer guys(at the cost of there own game in some cases....Sorry Bill). Biggest SNAFU was the software having issues leading to an almost hour delay of round 3 and even then no one complained(at least not directly to me) Again I am thankful for everyone who came out. The Adepticon guys really can't believe how much Malifaux took off at the con. I was told that most new games sell a dozen tickets to maybe one event. We sold over 50 to three events and had, as Rich put it, groupies hanging around all weekend playing pickup games and demos. So next year guys expect more goodness. Maybe we can kick the old men playing Flames of War out of the Harry Carey room and get Malifaux events ran in the only convention room at the con with its own bar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 It's great to see the faction breakdown for the stats. Would it be possible to see a breakdown by Masters? We played Single Faction so they were allowed to draft each round and we didn't track crews per round(we had enough paperwork to deal with as it was). I need to shoot an email off to the players letting them know the results are up, I can ask them to send me what masters they played each round if they remember. Most people stuck to one master, or two on Sunday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Nilus did you have Hamelin the plagued at all in the events? Mainly want to know about the scrap. Nope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tadaka Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Cool thanks for the info. Sounds like you all had a blast so wish I could have gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darguth Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Out of the 23 players: 5 Outcasts (average place 6, highest place 1) 6 Neverborn (average place 10.5, highest place 2) 4 Guild (average place 11.75, highest place 3) 4 Arcanists (average place 16.25, highest place 8) 4 Resurrectionists (average place 17.75, highest place 13) This is a pretty great cross-section of factions, though it's somewhat disparing that the spread seemed to be pretty wide amongst them (4 Res players averaged nearly 18th out of 23? Yikes!). Would love to see some pics of the "Best Painted" crews too, if anyone has some Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PicklesGrr Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 As far as I know. They were shipped to the distributors. Hence released as far as we were concerned. Ah cool - I dozily thought they were future releases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattbirdoff Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 (edited) Thanks to all the guys who ran the tourny, and all those who showed up to play. I had a great time, easily the best event of the week for myself and my club mates. Definitely look forward to attending next year! I have some suggestions on things that could be done for next years events, but for a a game that is so new to tournament play, I thought it turned out well. - I agree the scoring needs work. Ideally I would say a W/L/D system, with maybe 10/5/0 points, then add your strategy and scheme points to that, would work out much better in the future. That would help ensure that players with the best records finished at the top. - I would love to see soft scores included in scoring to some degree. No comp, but sports and painting, even if in a limited way. Then give out a separate "Best General" type award to whoever gets the most gaming points. -also would love for you guys to run a team event next year. - I like the idea of having a separate "newb" event, but would NOT have it on the same day as the main tourney. 28 people was already pretty small, I'd hate to see it divided further by 2 brackets or events on the same day. I played Pandora straight through, as that was all I had painted. Special thanks to Kevin and Bill, for patiently walking me through how their respective crews worked as we played. Edited April 4, 2011 by mattbirdoff extra stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted April 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 Would love to see some pics of the "Best Painted" crews too, if anyone has some Link added to the first post Here are some shots of the winning best painted 35 Stone scrap crew And yes I realize that one of my goals for next year is to get a better camera and learn how to take better pictures of minis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattbirdoff Posted April 4, 2011 Report Share Posted April 4, 2011 (edited) Link added to the first post Here are some shots of the winning best painted 35 Stone scrap crew And yes I realize that one of my goals for next year is to get a better camera and learn how to take better pictures of minis I can try to get some pics and post them up. There were a bunch of really nice crews there. Overall the painting at this event was the best of the 3 systems I played in that weekend. I think the hobby aspect is more important to some Malifaux players than other games? Edited April 4, 2011 by mattbirdoff stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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