Vermin Lord Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 I've got a question for all my fellow NB players, namely how do you make competitive lists without alienating/ticking off your playing group? We're just rebuilding our local community, and I chose NB for our inaugural Steamfitter League, and am running into an issue of players thinking what I use is broken/unfun. (granted the "broken" comment was pre-league and when I used a LaCroix crew, but I can do that in NB and is was more of a companion issue) My problem is that NB as a faction is generally based on screwing with your opponent, but don't know how to do that without upsetting them. Case in point, tonight I did Pandora vs Criid (not the best matchup I grant you, but his other 2 masters were Lady J and Perdita whom I could've cleaned up on). My opponent wound up winning, but said Pandora was one of the reasons he stopped playing in Mk I because with her it was less playing a game, and more "flipping cards to see what I could do". My problem is every NB master has "annoying" tendancies, both Collodi and Lilith can have somewhat nasty companion chains (and Lilith has several other ways to make opponent's pull out their hair) Lady Z is a toolbox of annoyance with up to 4 Obeys a turn with her, a Voodoo Doll, and a Doppelganger and her access to out of faction 4wp minions (Nurses, Papa and Pere chief amongst them in my book) Pandora can kill crews while barely lifting a finger with a little luck, and the Dreamer is well, the Dreamer. So what do I do? Any suggestions are appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnternalVoid Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 I have tried several things, mainly education. But to be honest, you have an uphill battle at the best. There are always going to be those people that see the grass as greener on the other side, feel that the abilities of another group are stronger then they are. You have keyed into one of the big issues right there, Neverborn masters tend to have tendances that take options away from their opponents. There are two things in a game that people will get frustrated over the most, unkillable thing and restricted options. Bouncing off a target you threw resources at can be frustrating if you do not see a gain from your efforts. Debuff tend to frustrate people more then buffing. At the same time I have rarely had a master that has one hit killed models with out a red joker. Or blasted through a whole wave of models in a single activation *Lilith had the chance once but could not quite get close enough*. The sheer destructive power of some other masters is fearsome in itself, or the sheer option some of their low soulstone models bring. I have offered before during one campaign mirror matches, and a few times just strait offered it so they could see for themselves what playing Neverborn was like and let me show them how scary a Lady J, Hoffman brick, or Vic bomb can be on the otherside. But I did not get taken up on it. Honestly I suspect it will not go away for several people in our group, the sun will set on the world before they say otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blog Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 >Competitive list >Ticking off opponent Its unavoidable with NB IMHO, but.. If the opponent isn't ready for the competitive list, then they WILL get ticked off. If the opponent is ready, then the list isn't really seen as a competitive list. I hope I'm making sense.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermin Lord Posted October 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 you are, my list tonight was Pandora 2 x Sorrows Insidious Madness 2 x Stiched Together He had Criid Samael Hopkins 2 x Witchling Stalkers Miss Terious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blog Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 you are, my list tonight was Pandora 2 x Sorrows Insidious Madness 2 x Stiched Together He had Criid Samael Hopkins 2 x Witchling Stalkers Miss Terious Yea, already, Pandora, IM, and 2 stitched. Those are all REALLY good. Sorrows just layer pandora's abilities even more. NB as a whole rely on the tricks and the speed and messing with the opponent. They have layers of control too. Being able to say, "No" and "You have 2 less AP" is just how NB plays, its unavoidable, Its how the faction plays. Believe me, when in a game, being told my heavy hitter, takes a wound for being by pandora, another wound for being by a sorrow, and losing 2 gamble your life Wp duels, it can get pretty frustrating. to alleviate some "teh borken" stress, try playing some underplayed NB minions the boards say suck. You may find something cool that isnt overtly OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 My own take on this is fairly simple 1) I not often use pandora - love her fluff and models but I found that games with her felt like I was doing a lot and that my opponent didn't get o participate as much. People want to enjoy playing games, and that means getting to have a fair turn to move their men about and do stuff. Both pandora and Hamelin are "greedy". 2) theme crews. You can do this and still be competative - but remember, you are not in an event, no pile of money will be dropped for the winner to swim in, nor will the sun cease to rise if you lose. Example themes: Zoraida "the good, the bad and the ugly" featuring sue, tuco and rami Dreamer "toybox" featuring multiple teddies and baby kade 3) enjoy the game. Win or lose against you, the more enthusiasm you bring to the table, the more you laugh when things go wrong when you could have sulked, the more cool stories you Mae up about the action happening on the tabletop, the more people won't care about your crew - they'll play you because you make playing fun, win or lose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetaphoricDragn Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 Zoraida "the good, the bad and the ugly" featuring sue, tuco and rami I've absolutely no idea how that would play, but sounds really cool. On topic, as a new player, it still really helps me to talk out my games. Within a league maybe that would be more difficult, but at least in casual, offer advice to your frustrated opponent on their options, and if their willing to, have them mull over what options they are considering out loud, so maybe you can suggest which is the best and why, or at least tell them which won't work so they don't try to set something up only to fizzle. Otherwise, offer a post game analysis. I know after I lose a game of Warmachine, I like to discuss what I could have done differently, and found where my strategy failed so I can improve next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 off topic: the GBU crew plays great its killy at 3 ranges - up-close on opponent's board half with tuco, middle ground supportive with sue and sniper with rami - any of which can benefit from having zoraida near to obey. there are still pleny of points spare to talior the crew up, but its a fun little core team. would love to have added brutal effigy in for healing flips on Sue and middle-ground support - but rami is a different special force Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korrosion Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 I try to take difficult to do schemes, such as Zoriada's personal one. I also let the other player choose the strat if they wish to, both mine and theirs. Then I pick a decently tough/quick crew and try to win while at those disadvantages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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