Grave Spirit - Strength From Below - Spell Targeting

[Gruesome]

I have searched for about 20 minutes and not been able to find something that specifically answers this, so I apologize in advance if its obvious and I fail at searching...

Situation:

Grave spirit linked to the greatest master ever, Nicodem.

The villain known as the Judge wants to cast Judgement on the grave spirit.

The wording of "Strength from below" says "...this model cannot be targeted by enemy ranged attacks and spells".

Question: Can Judgement target the Grave Spirit since the spell does not have the "ranged" icon?

Or is the wording supposed to mean that he cannot be targeted by:

a. Ranged Attacks

b. Spells

?

Thank you in advance for the answers. In particular if they support my desire to rid Malifaux of the pestilence that is the Guild.

[Mach_5]

A Ranged Spell is a Ranged Attack, so saying it only applies to Ranged Attacks and Ranged Spells makes no sense. IMO he can't be targetted by any spells while linked.

[Scurry]

Mach_5 is correct.

ruling on cassandra's celebrity which is a similar wording:

http://www.wyrd-games.net/showthread.php?21887-Cassandra-s-Celebrity-Wording&highlight=cassandra+celebrity

[Lucidicide]

The gun icon makes something a strike. It has nothing to do with what's an attack or not. An Attack is defined on page 18 of the Rules Manual. They can include the gun icon or not.

Basically, if a spell has a Rg and a Rst then it is a ranged attack. You could be targeted by a ranged spell that has no Rst (as that's not an attack).

[Mach_5]

Is a strike not always an attack? Don't have my book in front of me...

[Gruesome]

The gun icon makes something a strike. It has nothing to do with what's an attack or not. An Attack is defined on page 18 of the Rules Manual. They can include the gun icon or not.

Is that something that has been spelled out differently than my rules manual? the () description in my manual specifies that it makes a spell a "ranged attack" and as such have the targeting considerations attendant with ranged attacks.

The opposite of that would, in my mind, be true if there was NOT a (), namely that that spell was NOT considered a "ranged attack".

Be that as it may, the Rules marshall ruling in the Cassandra-Celebrity thread linked above seems very applicable as the wording is exactly the same as strength from below.

My only remaining question would be:

When a rules marshall makes a ruling on a spell like Celebrity, are they really ruling on that specific spell? Or are they ruling on the wording involved in that spell, so that that wording can be taken as law when it comes to other spells with the same wording?

[Mach_5]

The ability doesn't protect against Spells which are considered attacks. It protects against Spells, so whether or not there's a resist doesn't matter. So any Ranged Attack (ie gun icon) or any Spell cannot target the linked Grave Spirit.

[Lucidicide]

My bad, I thought it said ranged attacks -- should have looked at the ability first. It cannot be targeted by any type of spells.

As for the ranged icon -- yes, that is always defined as an attack. I was more saying that the gun icon makes it a strike.

Either way, I fumbled over myself a few times, so just pay attention to others :-P

[Q'iq'el]

The gun icon makes something a strike. It has nothing to do with what's an attack or not. An Attack is defined on page 18 of the Rules Manual. They can include the gun icon or not.

Basically, if a spell has a Rg and a Rst then it is a ranged attack. You could be targeted by a ranged spell that has no Rst (as that's not an attack).

Actually resist is only one of the criterions making it an attack. If it has the icon, it always is an attack (it is another criterion).

In other words, there are spells which are not attacks, but all the spells with or Rst: are attacks.

[Lucidicide]

Actually resist is only one of the criterions making it an attack. If it has the icon, it always is an attack (it is another criterion).

In other words, there are spells which are not attacks, but all the spells with or Rst: are attacks.

Yup -- already said I was fumbling over myself and not to listen to me.

[Q'iq'el]

Yup -- already said I was fumbling over myself and not to listen to me.

"Already" is a very abstract term in the internet, where time isn't exactly continuos. Especially when it comes to replying to the posts on the forums.