Stone.and.Mortar Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 So as posted previously, my fiance and I are trying to muddle through the Puppet Wars rules without the actual rulebook. In our games this evening we stumbled across some rules interactions and random events that I wasn't sure how to cover. So here they are, I would greatly appreciate any help the community can provide. 1. Pokey Viktoria: this one is straight forward, does her reduction in AC apply to herself? I assume so as she would qualify as a friendly puppet unless I'm mistaken. We've been playing it as though it does so far. 2. December Acolyte: she's collected an upgrade from the enemy, the Executioner if I remember correctly. She is then killed triggering her other ability which sends upgrades to the scrap pile instead removed from play. Does the enemy upgrade go to the enemies scrap yard, or as it was attached to my model, does it go to my scrap yard. We played it as if it went to my scrap yard. 3. Animation Card: if both players play a card of equal value who goes first? We've already corrected the mistake of whoever has the highest card goes first. Now this comes up and Im not sure what procedure is. We've been rolling a die and whoever comes up highest goes. I had other questions but they slip my mind. As I run into more and as my previous questions come back to me I'll keep posting them here to be answered by the experts, and to hopefully benefit those who are trying to learn the game along with me. Thanks in advance for any help you can provide! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudders Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 1. Pokey Viktoria: this one is straight forward, does her reduction in AC apply to herself? I assume so as she would qualify as a friendly puppet unless I'm mistaken. We've been playing it as though it does so far. I have played as the AR reduction not applying to herself 2. December Acolyte: she's collected an upgrade from the enemy, the Executioner if I remember correctly. She is then killed triggering her other ability which sends upgrades to the scrap pile instead removed from play. Does the enemy upgrade go to the enemies scrap yard, or as it was attached to my model, does it go to my scrap yard. We played it as if it went to my scrap yard. The official word may be different but I would put them in the friendly scrap pile as you have. 3. Animation Card: if both players play a card of equal value who goes first? We've already corrected the mistake of whoever has the highest card goes first. Now this comes up and Im not sure what procedure is. We've been rolling a die and whoever comes up highest goes. In the rules it states that "If any players are tied, randomly determine among them who acts first.". What you've been doing sounds good - I weirdly haven't hit this but a dice, flip a card/coin I would have thought are all fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karn987 Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) 1) Rudders is Correct. The intention is that she does not reduce her own AR with that ability. 2) Checking on this for you. 3) Yup, you randomly determine who goes first. The rules say flip another card from your Puppet deck dirrectly into your discard pile, the highest card goes first. Note: This does not replace your animation card, the Animation card stays infront of you. This is only to break the tie and doesn't change it's value or suit. Also the rules for this appear in the Meet your Puppet Deck section. Random Determination Any time players must randomly determine anything during the game, all players involved Flip the top card of their Puppet Decks. The highest card wins, followed by the next highest, etc. In the event of a tie, the players who tied will again Flip a card to determine who wins among the tied players. @More Questions: Bring'm On! Edited August 17, 2011 by karn987 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cromusz Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 (edited) 1) 3) Yup, you randomly determine who goes first. The way we suggest is flipping another card from your Puppet deck dirrectly into your discard pile, the highest (or lowest) card goes first. Why do you say "or lowest"? Isn't it always the higher card on the flip that "wins" when people flip the same card initially? Bag of Goodies: If this Puppet is Torn Apart, move all Upgrades on this Puppet to the Scrap Heap instead of removing them from the game. I played this as the upgrade went into the scrap heap of the person controlling the Acolyte. I'm interested in hearing what Karn has to say though. Outcast Master: Reduce the Animation Requirement of friendly Puppets with no Suit printed in their AR by 2. I agree that the ability wouldn't lower her AR cost even though this would put her more in line with ther other masters. Edited August 17, 2011 by cromusz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karn987 Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cromusz Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 I would like to add a quick question in this thread as well extending the Acolyte question. Stay Dead: When this Puppet Tears Apart another puppet, it is removed from play instead of being placed in the Scrap Heap. If the Judge kills the Acolyte, are the Acolyte's upgrades that are attached get removed from play as well? And a nother question on the same idea: If the Judge kills a model adjacent to the Acolyte, does the Acolyte get the upgrade or is it removed from play? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karn987 Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 I would like to add a quick question in this thread as well extending the Acolyte question. If the Judge kills the Acolyte, are the Acolyte's upgrades that are attached get removed from play as well? No. The Judges ability says nothing about the Upgrades on the Puppets so they follow the normal rules for what happens to them. So in this case, because they are on the Acolyte they follow his special rule and go back to the Scrap Heap. And a nother question on the same idea: If the Judge kills a model adjacent to the Acolyte, does the Acolyte get the upgrade or is it removed from play? Acolyte gets nothing. The Judge just removes the Puppet from play, it never even has a chance of becoming it's upgrade for the Acolyte to take. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudders Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 If the Judge kills the Acolyte, are the Acolyte's upgrades that are attached get removed from play as well? If a puppet is ripped apart that puppet goes on the scrap heap, but the upgrades attached to that puppet are remove from play (destroyed). And a nother question on the same idea: If the Judge kills a model adjacent to the Acolyte, does the Acolyte get the upgrade or is it removed from play? I would say the acolyte doesnt get the upgrade. Edit - I was wrong on point one and Karn is a faster typer than me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cromusz Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Thanks for the clarifications! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 As for question 2: the upgrade would return to the scrap heap of the owning player (the one who selected it for their toy box) So it follows the normal rules for tearing apart an upgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stone.and.Mortar Posted August 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Wow awesome on the speed of response guys. Okay so everything was answered in about the way I thought it should be, so I don't feel soooo ignorant any more lol. The order is determined by card flip huh, well thats how we did it originally I just felt like we were wasting cards and I kept losing good ones heh. I still wonder on the Pokey Viktoria thing, I would make the case that she qualifies as a friendly puppet and so the ability should affect her. As per Death Marshalls ability that increases combat by 1 for all friendlies, that would affect him as well, he couldnt attack without multitasker but if he could it would be at combat +1 correct? So then I would only assume that hers would affect her as well, which would drop her to the 5 AR benchmark that most masters beside Seamus fall into. I suppose we'll just have to play it at AR 7 until I hear otherwise. Thank you all very much! I just started my work week back up so it wont be until the weekend for more games and more questions but if I come across any while theory crafting this will be where I take them. Thanks much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cromusz Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 It goes back to its original owner and they are able to attach it to another one of their models? Boo to that ruling lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karn987 Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Wow awesome on the speed of response guys. Okay so everything was answered in about the way I thought it should be, so I don't feel soooo ignorant any more lol. The order is determined by card flip huh, well thats how we did it originally I just felt like we were wasting cards and I kept losing good ones heh. I still wonder on the Pokey Viktoria thing, I would make the case that she qualifies as a friendly puppet and so the ability should affect her. As per Death Marshalls ability that increases combat by 1 for all friendlies, that would affect him as well, he couldnt attack without multitasker but if he could it would be at combat +1 correct? So then I would only assume that hers would affect her as well, which would drop her to the 5 AR benchmark that most masters beside Seamus fall into. I suppose we'll just have to play it at AR 7 until I hear otherwise. Thank you all very much! I just started my work week back up so it wont be until the weekend for more games and more questions but if I come across any while theory crafting this will be where I take them. Thanks much! I hear what your saying, but our intention is that it does not effect her. Our bad on the wording on it, should have been more explicit. You are right about the Death Marshal though! If it just says "Friendly Puppets" it includes the Puppet using it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 I hear what your saying, but our intention is that it does not effect her. Our bad on the wording on it, should have been more explicit. You are right about the Death Marshal though! If it just says "Friendly Puppets" it includes the Puppet using it. Yeah, just to elaborate a bit further: compare Vik's stats to those of the other masters and keep in mind that the AR is sort of the balancing act in puppet wars. Better stats means a higher AR. Also Vik has a lot of free actions, which you can use without paying her AR at all. But you're right: the wording on her is unclear. The word "other" was supposed to be in her ability. "other friendly puppets" but that edit slipped through the cracks. Perhaps we'll fix it later with an FAQ or maybe when she is printed en mass (since at the moment she is just a gencon promo). So, although you are technically correct on the rules as written, it was not our design intent with her. Sorry about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cromusz Posted August 17, 2011 Report Share Posted August 17, 2011 Sounds like the gencon one had special power Haha. Thanks for the clarifications Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stone.and.Mortar Posted August 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 Karn, Lalo (please don't hold the abbreviation against me! I have a terrible memory), thank you very much for your help and the clarification, I didn't realize at first that you guys had such an active role in the rules process, if thats the way its intended then thats the way we'll play! I'm glad that this thread has opened up a bit to multiple questioners I think it will be a valuable resource to new players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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