CrazyCatLadeh

There is a market for that for sure! I would love to see some content around TtB - gameplay, tips, updates, etc. It would be awesome to see the community create such a show - perhaps through an online game! You would have a listener here!!

I'm stringing a bunch of one shots together so that we can get the hang of the game before starting a longer adventure. A lot of the free downloaded one-shots provide Fate ties, and so I used those to start helping with which ones I'd like to bring together for my players first steps. That method might help!

54 minutes ago, spooky_squirrel said:

Fudging/changing stats has a couple of thoughts from me:

1. You're the FM, it's your game. What you decide the stats are, they are. If your group has one or more rules lawyers who are looking up bestiary information and trying to contradict you, refer to the first sentence.
   1. It's easier to defend this stance if the stats are modified before the game starts, and you've got an opportunity to draft story-based reasons that will placate the rules lawyers without having to pull the FM card.
   2. If you're improvising and changing stats in the middle of the game session it's a little harder to defend because you're improvising. Prepare a cheat sheet ahead of time for why it is NPC X might have a different set of skills and traits than their template--it helps you remember what their motivators are as well as providing other story bits that flesh it out. Malifaux is a strange place, and people find themselves with latent powers and other oddities. Earthside scholars who studied under Marcus would not recognize the man he is now.
   3. If the only stat you're changing is their Rank value, that modifies all TNs the Fated have to meet. It's a difficulty setting. Similarly, if you're adjusting the NPC's Station, it changes how they can affect a challenge without changing any other information (Enforcers can modify two flips in an Encounter, where Minions can only do one without needing to use tactical actions). These are easy changes that require no real justification (other than adjusting difficulty).
2. Be internally consistent if you're modifying how things work/interact. Rules lawyers will be rules lawyers. That's how they end up generating negative play (and social) experiences. If you have one in the group, it's a good idea to preemptively handle them. It can be nice sometimes to have someone remind you of a mechanic or trick you can use (there's webcomics dedicated to this), but it can be derailing at the same time if they disrupt story flow to 'correct' the FM because there's stuff the FM fudged to make their story work. They'll have no traction with the rest of the group if you're being consistent as the FM and the story sessions are interesting and enjoyable. The consistency part is why I've isolated out some points above; notes from you to yourself guiding you on your liberties taken allow you to be consistent with those liberties.

This is great advice! And I agree about rule lawyers! Our second session went MUCH smoother. I altered the stats of all NPCs in the same way - but I just realized that the issue we were having was me reading the TN of NPCs in correctly. I was adding Will AND Def plus rank - so no wonder they could never hit.....I feel so silly! But thank goodness for everyone on here!

The entire group LOVED the feel and story of Ghost House! We made it half way through! I added in a few additional elements (e.g., recordings of ghosts! Letters! Puzzles!) and really worked out the maps so it was similar to our D&D play. I felt this would be a good session to really focus on the combat mechanics, as well as situations where they had to utilize their talents rather than fight. I was so pleased and impressed by my players! They did great - and they all said afterwards that they really are starting to see how things are coming together in TtB and how they're nicely different than D&D.

I'm glad we made it over the hump, and we're all accepting that we need to work out some wrinkles (myself majorly!!) but also accept how it's NOT going to be D&D 5e!! I think we're also really liking the guided nature of the adventures. We're use to playing a very open world in our RPGs, and the layout of the story and session allows for some exploration, but also it's a nice guided story!

I have to say that we are all enjoying TtB - and I can see it being a staple in our RPG rotation once we all learn the mechanics a bit better.

Next session will be focused more on flushing out the magic/spellcasting in the game. We are getting there!

4 minutes ago, Le gob said:

Def OR Will +rank, otherwise your minions start to be reall y powerful. 

THIS EXPLAINS SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO MUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Le gob....you have no idea how much I need to thank you right now!! ((I'm not going to tell my players...but you seriously have helped them!!))

Thank you for this! I used this as a quick cheatsheet for my players and it has helped SO much!!

I also added this text, not sure if it would be useful to others:

Combat
1) Determine Initiative :Make an initiative flip from the Fate Deck and Add your Speed Aspect and Notice Skill
2) Start Turn Effects (Resolve any effects)
3) Determine General Action Points (AP)
         Each character receives 2 AP
         Some game effects may increase or decrease AP
4) Take Actions
          Spend AP and resolve action
          Every action requires a number of AP (Appear in parenthesis by the number of AP)
          Some talents grant additional AP, and can be spent only on Actions associated with the description
5) End Turn Effects (Resolve any effects)

Combat Actions

Charge (2 AP): Charge directly towards the target, then take two strike Actions. Each  Action must have an AP cost of 1.

Strike (1 AP): Performs a single attack (either ranged or melee).

Tactical Actions

Defensive Stance (#): The character may discard a card to gain +Def (equal to the AP spent on this Action) until the start of its next.

Focus (1 AP): Gain +Card to next (non-Focus) Action and any resulting Damage Flip. Action stacks (up to a total of +++). 

Impose (1 AP): Draw attention of target. Make Social Test (usually Intimidate) against target's (Tenacity + Scrutiny). Successful, the target suffers “-” (plus an additional ”-” for every Margin of Success). 

Trick (1 AP): Deception or misdirection to gain an advantage. Make skill Challenge (such as Deceive or Sleight of Hand) against target's Cunning + Awareness. Success, gain a + to  melee or ranged attack Actions and Damage Flips until the start of the your next turn. You gain + to Defense against  target until next turn. 

Reload (#): Reload is listed as a value for AP. A reload Action may take more AP than the character has, in which case they may wish to take another Reload Action during their next turn. 

Movement Actions

Drop Prone (1 AP): Gain + to Defense challenges against Ranged and - to Defense  against Melee. 

Run (2 AP): Move up to twice Walk speed plus his Athletics skill (in yards)

ATTACKING
TN of target = Def + Will + Rank (Fatemaster Reveals TN)
ACTING VALUE -> Attackers Aspect + Weapon/SP Skill
Modifiers: Calculate by adding any “+” or “-” (These will determine how many cards you take, and which values you can choose)
Flip cards & apply modifiers
RESULTS: If hit, perform Damage Flip

DEFENDING
TN of attack = Aspect + Combat Skill + Rank (Fatemaster Reveals)
ACTING VALUE -> Defense (Melee/Range), Willpower (Magic)
Modifiers: Calculate by adding any “+” or “-” (These will determine how many cards you take, and which values you can choose)
Flip cards & apply modifiers
RESULTS: If Defense fails, perform Damage Flip
[Note: Horror Duel: Against Will Power, see p 219 for effects]

DAMAGE
When damage is done it’s presented as a 1/2/3 (Weak/Moderate/Severe damage). How much damage is dealt is determined with a Damage Flip.

Each character has a Wounds Aspect (total damage taken before serious consequences). When suffering damage, Wounds Aspect is lowered by a value of damage. 0 or fewer current Wounds & character suffers a Critical Effect. Damage can be healed.

Modifiers: Margins of Success + Damage + Accuracy
Flip cards & apply modifiers (+, Fated picks damage; - Defender, Black Joker is always chosen)
Cheat Fate (Optional)
Apply Damage

4 hours ago, Mason said:

Just as a note, it's "Twist Deck" and not "Twisted Deck." 

Thank you!! I can easily make that change!

I haven't come across one, but I will mention that the FM Kit really isn't worth it, given the screen has the stats for 1E. I've taken to cut out and tape the needed stats and changes to my old one, and that works. The positive of the screen is that it is...BEAUTIFUL- the artwork is stunning!

I know this isn't much help - but I would suggest pulling out some of the key stats, and then just taping them to a screen from another RPG!

Based on threads here, and other player creations, I decided to create a play mat for my players. I know many of you have posted images of your own playmats, so thank you! I take no credit for the design- it's all thanks to this community!

I'm not sure if it would be useful for anything here, but I thought I would post it on the off chance that others might be able to use it! 

My players have found it really helpful, and I think we're going to laminate them! I'm wondering though, if there are any additional pieces of information that could be put on there!

On 10/5/2017 at 1:24 PM, solkan said:

There are enough improvements to justify switching over.  But there are enough differences in the skills and core book professions that you'd be better off redoing any characters if you switch over to 2nd.

So it probably depends on how far along you are,  If you're still only one or two sessions in, I would switch over. If you're five or so sessions in, I'd probably finish the campaign under 1st.  But it's ultimately your call.

This is great! It's nice to know! Given that the majority is 2nd Ed might as well! I wasn't sure if it were possible to play between the two, but that'd create way too much confusion! Thanks!

Thank you for the help!!

Tonight was a no-go, so we play tomorrow! 

I enjoyed making the maps, and I think it's going to be fun. What are peoples' thoughts on fudging or changing stats or conditions in an adventure? 

On 9/21/2017 at 10:23 PM, solkan said:

This is a fairly big change from 1st edition, but note that 2nd edition removed the rule about the Fatemaster touching the deck.  You don't to draw twist cards because the Fatemaster character hit you and the Fatemaster flipped some cards.  

We started session 0 using 2 of the 1st edition books. We not have 4 of the 2nd edition, so that most players (except 1) has the new rules. Would you recommend using the 1st or 2nd edition for this?

Tomorrow night I do my second session of TtB! I'm so looking forward to it! I've given it much thought, and I'm going to run Ghost House. I think that'll be a great introduction to combat, really demonstrate the nastiness of the world, and is the perfect tie to the larger story I'm doing. 

I know some of you have mentioned it's a tough adventure, and there's been some GREAT feedback on why. My players are super new, we did a session 0 last time, so I'm wondering if you have any advice or specific tweaks to the adventure! 

I'm so excited!

12 hours ago, gamefreak180 said:

How hard would it be to homebrew pursuits? Just because I may want to make anything dealing with the dolls ( including marionette and the one that looks like oogie boogie) a pursuit. Or patiently wait for the nightmare book and hope it has stuff for it in there and if not allow me to do so accurately. 

Please share if you do! That sounds amazing!

4 hours ago, solkan said:

From page 301:  "If this damage would reduce the target to 0 Wounds or lower, then the target suffers a Critical Effect (ref) and must check for unconsciousness (ref)."

Note the important implication:  A character can be reduced to negative Wounds, and can remain conscious in that state.  But if an attack does enough damage to take the character's wounds to 0 or less (even if it was already 0 or less), then it causes a critical.

For instance, say Bob has 4 Wounds.  Sue attacks Bob with a great sword, succeeds, and flips Severe damage.  That's 6 damage, putting Bob at -2.  Since Bob's negative, that's a critical effect and it's a Severe critical effect because it was Severe damage, whether or not Bob passed his Unsciousness check.  So Sue flips a card and adds 2 to it to see which Severe effect happens, getting a result from 2 to 16.

Let's say instead that Bob had been wounded, reducing him to 1 wound.  Then he gets hit for Severe damage of 8.  That takes Bob to -7, and the flip for the Severe critical effect is going to be at +7.  It only takes a 12 or better at that point to get Amputated, and or  is going to be instantly fatal.

But let's say that Bob survives, and then takes a weak damage flip of 2 points.  That puts Bob at -9, so the Weak Critical is at +9.  If you flip a 6 or better on that Weak Critical, you get a 15 and reflip on the Moderate chart.  If you flip a 6 or better on Moderate, that gets you a 15 or better and you reflip on the Severe chart.  And once you're on the Severe chart, you're flipping at +9, so you only need a 10 or better for Amputated or worse.  Take away point:  At a few points negative, Weak and Moderate crits start getting re flipped onto the Severe chart.  And it becomes pretty easy to push Bleeding Out up to 10  from the Severe chart and kill the character that way.  Especially since amputating an arm or leg is 5 points of Bleeding Out.

And then it continues.  But the important thing is that being at negative wounds doesn't automatically make the character unconscious.  Boring peons and minions might automatically fail their Unconscious check, but Fated with a positive AV for Toughness could stay standing and die from Bleeding Out.

The math exercise for the reader is working out how many points of Poison it takes to kill a 6 wound character.

This is fantastic!! Thank you so much! 

11 hours ago, Sernus said:

You seem to have a penchant for wicked tough adventures, CCL... I like that!    

Ghost House and Night of the Carver can both be really hard on Fated crews... especially if there are players who don't get that there are definitely times when one needs to just turn and run away!  There are some tough opponents,  and tough situations, in both of them... folks who tend to just dig in and fight might get significantly damaged.  In my view the Carver is the (relatively) easier of the two.

Organ Donors is also a little easier than Ghost House... or would be, if it weren't for everyone starting out stark naked, unarmed, and with no idea where they are...    This one falls into the "most times, probably best to just run away" category, too, I think!

The above being said, if you feel like Ghost House is the best fit for your plans, then Ghost House it should be!  It might teach your D&D-indoctrinated folks to embrace the Breachside saying: "This is Malifaux... Bad Things Happen..."

Thank you for the smile! I think I've unknowingly set my Fated down a hard (but fun!) path! They did ask for a difficult game, so I guess I'm giving it to them! 

I believe I am experiencing FM FOMO - I want to do ALL the adventures! I have just become so engrossed with the world and stories of Malifaux! I was never like this with D&D - and to be honest, I might have a bit of regret that I didn't force my partner to FM so that I could play  ((However, we did just order Into the Steam, which I outright said - "This is for you, so I can play next time!" )) I am just so impressed by the writing and richness of the world! I love it! And Ghost House and Night of the Carver are just thematically up my alley!!

It's good to know that there are potential bumps that I should watch out for, and that I'll stress to my players! I've already heard them chattering about what they could have done in the dramatic time during our last game to avoid combat! I might have done an internal "hurray" when I heard it!

1 hour ago, Sernus said:

On the subject of Ghost House: that adventure can be a tough one for some parties!  Not only is the chief adversary a very strong opponent, the Fated can come out of that place being significantly Haunted...!

Oh! This is good info - Do you think it might be too difficult? I'm reluctant to move right into In Defence of Innocence, and thought that might be a good one! I have Night of the Carver that I was also considering, but thought Ghost House fit better with the arch I'm building. It was either that or Organ Donors. I have time to think about how it'll all fit in, but knowing that there might be some difficulties with GH is really helpful!

Thank you to all to the help! I feel as though the feedback is certainly giving me more confidence with how I structure the encounters, and knowing that I need to give the party some time to adapt and get out the wrinkles. I really like the idea of how to make it harder or easier - especially a "good guy"...who might actually turn on them! I also like the idea of using the NPCs as ways to demonstrate combat and triggers - I've been so focused on making sure the story and the lore are okay, and less focused on actually teaching (and learning!!) the mechanics. As a new DM/FM, I really appreciate all the help and things to consider/focus on!

I just pre-ordered a bunch for my group! I know they don't "need" them for TtB...but these are too gorgeous not to have!!

@spooky_squirrel

Thank you so much for the tips and advice! I've added the "Pursuit Talent" draw to my list of things to remind my players for the next game. They certainly weren't using their Fate deck to their advantage, and I'm going to have to go through how they can trigger attacks with their lower cards. I know they were getting frustrated without really understanding that mechanic. I do wonder if there is some sort of gauge to know how many and at what level NPCs should be.

For a group of 4 Fated that are just starting out, is there a good range? A Minon and 2 Peons seems like a good balance, but I'm wondering if that would be too much! I know there's a bunch of contextual factors in play, but I'm wondering if there is some sort of typical mix for creating attack parties!

I've just been reading through Ghost House, and I'm so excited to tie that into our next session! I think it'll be a great next step and prep for the Innocence adventure! 

I'm wondering if any Ttb or Malifaux players will be attending HalCon this weekend! My hopes aren't high that there'll be any play tables for Wyrd games (or merch!), but thought I would reach out!

23 hours ago, spooky_squirrel said:

With regards to time spent looking up stats: you'll end up wanting to have a crib sheet with their specific weapons baseline stats on it. That way you'll know at a glance what the damage spread is. It falls on your players to keep track of their triggers during the game (if they have any, you'll also want to know what they are, but you'll be using that information for planning encounters). It's also not a bad idea to have their base AV for each attack type on the crib sheet.

Your players should have this information as well, and I'd be sorely tempted to figure out ways to motivate them to keep track of this kind of information (especially since they asked for combat).

It sounds like your Session 1 ended up doing something that I would normally put into a Session 0 (pre-campaign session where characters are generated and Fatemaster/Fated talk about what they'd like out of the campaign): sample combat. That being said, now that they've gotten a taste of it, they'll be better prepared to take advantage of "okay crew, you're about to head into your area of operations and your contact has forwarded you X script apiece (or otherwise opened their armory). Any last minute shopping trips?" hints from you. If there's some redesign/redistribution of starting stats going on, they'll be better able to handle a straight-forward fight.

D&D (and other similar systems) don't really have a taking cover or focusing your efforts mechanism that's native to their system. You have concealment spells/abilities that make it harder to hit in the first place by adjusting your target number and buffing spells/abilities that make members of your group do more with their turn, but there's nothing that is available to nearly everyone that can put other people on negatives/positives to do things. Years of *Ming in other systems can get in the way of merely playing, especially if people are used to the idea of level 1 encounters being "rat problem in the basement, go knock them out and build up some reputation and experience towards real challenges" or similar kinds of encounters (though, to be honest, Malifaux Rats in the basement are a serious problem, expect missing children and small adults). Part of that is because of something I mentioned in another thread: D&D (and similar) systems are meant to be epic-type campaign systems where the Heroes (PCs) are noticeably more powerful than the average person, even at level 1. In TtB, Malifaux is populated by very capable denizens, and often the only edge a Fated person has over a non-Fated peer is being Fated.

 

That all being said: why were they having trouble hitting? Were their hands terrible for cheating fate with? A peon has a a TN of 6-8 to hit normally, and if your Fated crew divided up their Ranged/Close Combat focus according to who would be most successful with each mode, then they should have AV of 1-3 (if not better, depends on their stats spread and whether or not they put at least one rank of (weapon) in). This means that they should be hitting on an average of 5 (3 best case, 7 worst case). It could be that they need to rethink how they break their group down for combat. The Fated with a -3 Grace should probably not be shooting at things, even if their Df seems too low to be on the front line as a melee fighter. Once your Fated and you are more used to the system, you'll find that using the expected average flip of 7 to determine how difficult something might be becomes easier and more reliable. That is: something that has a TN of roughly 7 above the AV of the people doing it is going to be roughly a 50-50 thing for them to be able to do.
In combat, this means that if the attack value of their opponent is Fated Df + 7 and defense value is Fated AV + 7, then the match is roughly even (except for weapons, toughness, and triggers) between the Fated and their opponent. Of course, one of the survival-oriented rules of combat is to never get into a fair fight. That's where the Fated will need to figure out how to work together to reduce/remove threats even as you use various tools as mentioned by @explorator and @EnternalVoid to keep the encounter both challenging and memorable.

Thank you for this excellent advice! I had planned on this being a small dip into the combat during Session 0 - but Session 0 took more time than expected. Mostly because we were working out of 1 book, and my players didn't come prepared with pursuits and potential skills. I know I will struggle with prep every session with this group - we're all juggling a lot, and we are all very casual players, but I am finding it frustrating that some people are equating the groups unpreparedness to issues with gameplay. I think this will be minimal once we get the hang of the combat, and we get our hands on more books (we now have 2! And I'm ordering 2 more!). 

Do you mind if I quote you on this to my players? I think this situates the system so well, and would really make things more beneficial to them: "D&D (and similar) systems are meant to be epic-type campaign systems where the Heroes (PCs) are noticeably more powerful than the average person, even at level 1. In TtB, Malifaux is populated by very capable denizens, and often the only edge a Fated person has over a non-Fated peer is being Fated."

As for combat - 2 of my players had really poor hands, and were drawing poorly. The other two really capitalized on their hands, draws, and also their skills - they were clearly looking to find creative solutions to combat. I think my other two players, while creative with non-combat play, were relying on this being more of a D&D roll/flip combat play. I think they realize now that it's not, and will approach things differently. 

I also suggested that in both dramatic and narrative time, they should be using skills and working their way through the fate deck so that I have to shuffle and they get more cards. After playing a round, I also suggested considering skills or actions that'll allow them to draw from their fate deck. These two players were relying mostly on the communal deck and adding any advantages to their combat flips, rather than thinking about how to incorporate cheating fate into play.

For the next round, I'm preparing a "Things to Consider" and will be distributing this before hand, and also going to be having a brief chat before the session to get the idea of how they'd like to play their character and how the group will work with that. I think the group dynamic conversation needs to be had. 

I'm also going to say that my own lack of knowledge with the game likely contributed to a few hiccups - but we're all learning! 

Thank you all again for your advice! The feedback has put the excitement back in me! I'm looking forward to planning our next session! And I'll admit, I was really disheartened after the last one!

Thank you both for the wonderful advice! I am just quickly dropping by at work - but will respond in full! My apologies for the delay - I have to say, I REALLY enjoyed reading and greatly appreciate the help! 

I've been lurking on this forum for some time, and am always so impressed by the community and helpfulness!

8 hours ago, Sernus said:

Firstly, tell those experienced D&D players and DMs: "One cannot add to one's cup if the cup is already full, Grasshopper!"

(I've been a [Whatever]master for 40 years - since 1977... this is the best advice I can give to anyone: toss out your old preconceptions and open up to learning this game!)

More to follow later, when I'm not sitting at work...!

That is such a great perspective - and I will say that to them!!

I'm not sure they've experienced being a "newb" in a game for quite some time! Thank you for taking the time to respond! I can use all the help I can get

This weekend I hosted Session 1 of our TtB game. It was a simple narrative of the group getting together on the train to travel through the breach, with just a bit of combat. I spent SOO long coming up with a session that involved notes from secret compartments, blackjack, conversations with important NPCs who were drunk, and a neat encounter with some prisoners being transported. The group was doing great, having fun, and enjoying themselves - until....combat.

Now, I had stressed - over and over and over - that it was important for the group to know their Fated. I provided them with extra script (via the storyline) to ensure they had armour and items to make their trip into Malifaux easier. Only one of them had taken advantage of that. So when it came to combat, we spent 45 minutes going through the book looking at weapon and armour stats. It was clear that my players were not prepared. But, I said that's fine, that we would do what we could for the session, and then they could return to their Fated and figure out items/skills (because they then wanted to change things) after Session 1. Since this is all new to us, I wanted to make sure they were playing characters they liked.

I had designed a fight with 2 peons and 1 minion. The peons were all meele, and the minion was range. This, I felt, matched well with my 2 melee Fated, and 2 ranged Fated. But the ranged could not hit for the life of them. The two melee decimated all three, and I had to rework damage because the 2 range decided to run in, and would have been squashed.

Aside from maybe making an encounter a bit too hard (which, when I asked them to provide feedback on the type of game they want, they ALL said, hard, threat of death, and combat with consequences), I'm not sure how to move forward. I stressed to them all that they need to use this experience to understand the steps of combat (which, baby jesus help me - was painful, even though I had sent a video and provided step-by-step cheat instructions to them) and the dynamics of their group/character. 

In fact, I had set it up so that they could have potentially avoided combat by using their environment and skills...but I think they're so use to the structure of D&D, that they jumped right in thinking that a level 1 encounter would be easy. 

Aside from this vent - I had a few questions.

I've read a lot and combat early seems mixed - that it can be extremely difficult, but sometimes super easy. Any tips on preparing combat encounters as well as preparing your players for the intensity/danger of the Malifaux combat? I really stressed that combat should be the last resort, and that NPC will be dangerous. 

How do you help people get outside of the "D&D" comparison. All my players are experienced D&D players and 3 of the 4 are vets in DM'ing (this is posing a bit of a "back seat driving" for my first time GM'ing ....but I can luckily tell my partner to 'shhh' or give him the 'not impressed eyes')...but after the combat the two most experienced DM's were quite critical of combat system (they were the two ranged who acted as melee and basically did no damage by were squashed). I want to get them out of thinking that the game needs to be similar to D&D...

Anyways - any help for a lonely and new FM who is in love with the game and wants to make a fun session for her players?

Thank you in advance!

I'm FM'ing my first session (ever!) of TtB with players who are also new to the universe and mechanics. I'm enjoying the process of creating a story for my players to run, but I love the content and vibe of the game so much, that I'm having some envy and would love to play. I'm wondering if there are any online groups looking for new players! I'd love to get some inspiration, and me like minded TtB enthusiasts!