Whut

Problem with Seamus and deliver message is that after that move you are stuck in the enemy force and will get the message delivered back. Maybe if you do it on last turn, or get a belle to quickly pull him out.

So a thought came through my mind, is there any combination of models or schemes (perhaps against a particular faction) that you know if you take, they really can't do anything about? Or at least it will be difficult. For example, I've heard that taking Entourage and playing Seamus is basically a guaranteed 3 VP. Is there any faction which has none or very little Armor-ignoring attacks (I've heard neverborn)? Because then Izamu is VERY powerful, nigh unkillable. Nicodem with a Necropunk (Nurse optional) makes Deliver a message very hard to defend against. Fast necropunk: Move, leap (over terrain and enemy models even!), and deliver for 2 or 3 VP. Same thing goes for throwing a flesh construct into a ranged threat like Perdita. Stuff like this. Not really general strategies like nurse-chiaki, more like niche tricks) Do you guys have your own choices you like using often?

Condition Removal? Also what is this Preperations upgrade? Is there a new beta somewhere or am I missing something?

Well I'm not getting a reply so I guess I'll try again, anyone else hoping to get in a game tomorrow? Between 3 and 8:30pm on Wednesday, Eastern Time

Thought I'd give this a shot, I only have a couple games under my belt but more would be good Anyone available between 3 and 8:30pm on Wednesday, Eastern Time?

Can anyone attest to how much of a difference this makes? I know it really comes down to the amount of terrain, but is there any way we can make some sort of measurable estimate of the effect this has on certain strats/schemes/matchups?

Right, and that's fine, but when this style is used I tend to see less impassible walls and more "islands" of terrain, or cover barricades, but rarely harsh range-punishing terrain like I do in vassals' walled-off rooms, or that one map with the train car blocking most of the center. Maybe this is because my store has an abundance of Warhammer Fantasy terrain, but I'm sure others know what I'm talking about. Thanks for the replies everyone!!

So I haven't had any experience playing in person apart from a demo game, all my experience has been with Vassal. But I have seen games played in person, includng snapshots of tournament tables, and I have to say the difference in terrain is pretty huge. Tables in person rarely have the amount of dense terrain that some Vassal maps have, specifically the ones that look more like an asylum or crypt with a lot of rooms and walls. Do hobby shops not have enough terrain? Or do some Vassal maps have too much? Because the way I see it, shooting is INCREDIBLY powerful in malifaux and is mainly balanced by line of sight and cover, but that makes me think that guild, outcasts, and Arcanists are more powerful on the tabletop while ressers and neverborn gain an advantage in Vassal, and it seems like this fluctuation is is not insignificant.

Check out my thoughts on the Valedictorian in my long post here http://wyrd-games.net/community/topic/101621-nicodem-the-necrotic-king-of-turf-war/page-2#entry738206

If an undead model is within 6 inches of Nicodem, it is immune to slow. If an undead model within 6 inches of Nicodem activates within 3 inches of an alp and fails the test, what happens? 1) The model is immune to slow, so it neither gets slowed, nor takes the resulting 1 damage. 2) The model gains slow, and therefore immediately takes 1 damage from the alp, but is immune to slow so it immediately goes away.

Thoughts from the game so far: 1) Nicodem is AMAZING. The Bubble of +Ml and DF alone is incredible. So many times I flipped a weak card + a decent cardon DF and I thought "wow, I would be taking a positive damage flip if not for that aura! It saves tons of cards on trying to hit or not get hit. It's amazing. This adds tons of resilience to any model, but especially those with higher defence (as little of those as we have...). It also makes new summons that come in on 3 or 4 wounds deceptivly tanky 2) The Valedictorian. I love her right now. She is the tankiest model ever. 10 wounds, terror, and armor, and h2w. She is so hard to get rid of! She gets 3 attacks per turn if you charge, 4 if you flurry (fast from Nico) and the reason you need all those attacks is sadly because her damage sucks. It's 2/3/6, which isn't very good. But more attacks means more possibility for her ram trigger, which pretty much guarantees some kind of positive flip, so you can really try for that 6 damage! Luckily with how resilient she is, she is a great carrier of unnerving aura, giving you usually 2-6 extra damage output a turn depending on the circumstances. So far only 2, but hopefully if she survives next turn its going to do up to 8 damage potentially. 3) The Valedictorian. Again. This time about lecture notes. On paper this looked to me as pretty meh, but now while planning to use it, boy I can't wait. It's a CA of 7 which is super high, and it gets rid of all triggers. So not only will it neuter certain models' offense, but also their defensive triggers! Priming them for a full flurry. Furthermore, this ability will take any rider down 5 or 20 notches by removing both their offensive triggers, AND their massive damage reduction! 3) I like the Flesh construct. If your opponent knows what it does, just the fact that it stands on the table basically forces your opponent to hold a card in their hands at all times. And if they only hold one, it's probably a crappy low card, so cheat a Belle lure for the trigger and they either have to cheat, or discard their card anyway. Didn't happen this game, but I kept that idea in the back of my head. 4) Let's mix it up. A question. Does Nicodems immunity to slow aura mean models don't get slowed in the first place? Or what? Does it mean that alps are basically worthless? We played it as me taking the damage but ignoring the slow, but what is the correct way to play it?

I have some pictures of the end of turn 2 but I can't figure out how to post them from my phone. I'll leave this here as a placeholder in case I figure it out Edit: Okay I can't even figure it out from my computer. Is there any way to get it directly from my PC or do I have to post it on the internet first somehow? Can someone PM me? Thanks

Turn 2 So I was going to let Coppelius activate on his own and die, but my opponent was kind enough to let me know that his crew has ways to heal models. So I win initiative and charge the construct in to kill Coppelius successfully. I then chain a Belle to slow Lelu, but my opponent discard the two cards to keep Lelitu from getting slowed. He pushes Lelu up but he's not able to get into range. Mortimer moves up to get chatty across a decent area, and drops another corpse bloat. Nicodem moves up with 2 AP (could have saved one) to get his aura on all my models, and then gives fast to the Valedictorian, as well as summons a mindless zombie. The dreamer moves up and throws some alps into the center of the soon-to-be combat, and LCB comes out next to the Valedictorian. Also the Hooded Rider charges the flesh construct, and hits him. Along with a little damage from before, the Flesh construct is down to 3 wounds. I throw EVERYONE at LCB, trying to take him down before he activates. (He leaves LCB for last) I end up doing 7 wounds and leaving him with 4 poison, as well as drawing out two ss for damage prevention. In the end, LCB activates and hits Valedictorian for 7 damage before sacrificing and leaving the Dreamer at the edge of Valedictorian's melee range. We both score a point for Turf War. End of turn 2

Curses, forgot about that during the game! It's hard to remember height sometimes when on vassal. Oh well it would have been hard either way with Lilitu having 6 WP with a + to duels, along with having to move around the alps and everything. So I think between her and Coppelius either option was just as good. Currently at work, will write Turn 2 on my lunch break probably

So I played out the first two turns of our game last night (we have conflicting schedules so we don't get enough time to play full games) I'm gonna do a bit of a half-battle report and my thoughts. So we talked about the rough terrain on the board (there's a massive blood pool circle in the center) and decided we will treat it as half movement. So basically Izamu is out, he's too slow for that. I ended up going: Nicodem, undertaker, mwahaha, reaper grin Mortimer, corpsebloat Valedictorian, unnerving aura Flesh Construct Belle Necropunk Necropunk 7ss He had roughly: Dreamer, built for DF LCB (his words) Coppelius, pact Hooded Rider, pact Lelu Lilitu 2 or 3 day dreams 7ss Turn 1 Right away I saw Lelu or Lelitu as perfect targets for assassination, as if one is dead the other becomes much less scary. So when he moved Lilitu into a position from which she could be lured, I immediately tunnel visioned into trying to make that happen. But I was out of range. So I stalled. I moved up my construct and my necropunks got close but still behind walls. He moved Coppelius into a similar position as Lilitu, and did some daydream stuff, sacrificing one. My original plan at this point was to have Mortimer create two corpses and then have Nico summon two high ss models to give me an advantage. Instead I corpse bloated for one, and threw two rotten meats at the flesh construct, pulling the Belle and the Valedictorian closer. Then Nicodem activated, summoned an ashigaru (to try to keep my higher cards, and I figured brace would be useful) and put fast on the Belle and the Valedictorian. However I didn't companion the belle, thinking he would waste amother activation, which made me lose out because he summoned two alps, blocking my line of sight to Lilitu. Instead I decided to take the risk and pull Coppelius. I passed terror and pulled him on the first AP and then just in case, slowed him and pulled him some more. In hindsight I should have used the last AP or two to pull Nicodem closer to the action, saving him an AP next turn. The Valedictorian charged Coppelius and cut him down to 1 wound, and the turn ended. My opponent didn't use any SS to prevent damage on Coppelius, I don't know if he was just being conservative or forgot he could. Sorry if I'm going into too much detail Turn 2 coming soon!

Quick question, what are other models (including mercenaries) we have that can heavily benefit from getting some Chi passed from the soul porter? My first instinct is rotten Belles for a better slow (as you will already be in melee so the pull is situational) but I'm sure there must be better options out there

I never thought of expunge as very powerful cause it always seemed like it's very hard to get a transfusion off before you expunge... unless you rely on spells to naturally apply poison but that seems like it would take forever to rack up enough of it

Yea good input man but I'm looking for what to do with ressers. If I were to just copy what the neverborn are doing, I'm thinking off the top of my head something like Seamus CCK Valedictorian Izamu Sybelle 2 Belles 9 points left for upgrades and maybe another model

So I was talking to a buddy of mine about the different strats and making a loose sort of plan. He plays neverborn and he mentioned how in reckoning he takes basically Lilith and 4-5 beatsticks. I was just wondering if that's the sort of mindset you need for Reckoning, cause our normal game plan of summoning models at low wounds doesn't give an advantage in this strategy...

Yea I figured, forgot the first comma so I fixed it Sorry for weird capitalization, I'm on my phone so it's a bit of a pain to work with auto-capitalize

I have undertaker on him, I just took away reaper grin

Sorry for the double post!! Currently thinking of something like: Nico, Undertaker, mwahaha Mortimer, Corpsebloat Izamu, unnerving aura Belle Ashigaru Ashigaru Crooligan Crooligan 3 pool (6 total) 8 models starting on the board, 9-10 after first turn depending on card draw

Now I keep looking back and thinking if I'm taking Izamu anyway, would somehow fitting in 2 ashigaru be a good idea? They get the free push trigger if they are near Izamu, and with the abundance of cards Nicodem gets from undertaker (in theory) he can power their 1 AP charges all day, and 3-4 attacks per activation with possible infect and 2/3/4 is very strong! Plus they don't have hard to wound so firing the damage/heal spell at them (don't remember the name) will be easy to cheat for the AoE. I believe a Belle along with Mortimer and anything I summon will be enough to hold the flanks anyway, I don't need an entire flesh construct. What do you guys think? My only concerns are if Ashigaru are tanky enough, and what would I choose to take out to fit them? Also FYI I'm playing against Neverborn if I didn't mention that :3 Also for those that want a visual aid, we are playing on Vassal's charnel pit map Thanks again!

Well about the Valedictorian, I'm having a lot of trouble deciding between her and Izamu. Izamu has so much more damage unless Valedictorian uses SS or cards for triggers, but valedictorian has more mobility and can stop triggers which is pretty nice. Between the terror and h2w, and the 1 more armor and self heal, I'd say they are about equal in survivability. Idk, I just really don't like valedictorian's dependency on ss and cards for high damage, as without a severe card, she does 3 damage, compared to Izamu's 3/4/5 with a built in +flip to damage and card recycle trigger

So obviously the students are AMAZING when paired with a master that can bring them in on the fly, but for those that cannot summon them, are there any times when you can still be 100% safe in taking them? With most factions I expect to see a bit of a gamble, because if they use the wrong crew, your student's extra abilities go to waste. Against... Guild- As far as I know, this is a gamble between Steel or Sinew Ressers- You can be safe taking the student of sinew unless your opponent uses Kirai Arcanists-You can be safe using the student of Steel unless your opponent uses Marcus Neverborn-You can always be safe with the student of Viscera, as far as I know (but I really don't know that much) Outcasts- I know nothing about outcasts Gremlins- I know nothing about Gremlins, but I assume Viscera, since I assume everything they have is living... So how much effectivness do you lose from getting a bad matchup? You lose the students' terror, their damage++ trigger, and their ignore armor/hard to wound if your opponent doesn't have any of that. Actually it's honestly not the worst thing in the world, so taking that gamble against Arcanists or ressers may be worth it!