Starting the game, thinking Nicodem or Ten Thunders.

[Kaptain_Konrad]

Hello all, I haven't bought any models yet, but will be soon. My and some friends are going to start with just a box set each, but I don't know who to go with. I really like the Idea (and Alt model) and zombie hoard of Nicodem, but then I saw the Ten Thunders box set on the webby and love those models. My question are:

Nicodem:

Besides the starter, what would you recommend I have handy for his summoning? How many MZ would be appropriate for starting and extras? Is Bete Noir really nice for him? How does he fare against Lady Justice and Lilith? Any advise I could get to avoid newbie mistakes with him?

Ten Thunders:

Is there anything known about the play style of the box set or the rules? The webby said available at GenCon, but is that only for GenCon or would I be able to order from my FLGS around that time also?

Thank You.

[011121]

I don't play nicodem so take with a grain of salt-

Seems like much like Hamelin and rats there's no such thing as too many MZ for nicodem. Bête Noir seems like a very solid model for just about any reassertion crew, except maybe kirai? I'd worry about Lady J as all your MZ can be nuked by her ability that gets rid of corpse counters. Seems like that would severely hamper your chances, but then I've had some nicodem players tell me it isn't that bad.

I haven't heard anything solid about the TT play style. If it's built to reflect Misaki then they'd probably have a number of optional buffs that you can choose from, but that pure speculation (although it is true of the TTB).

[Cornelious1424]

Hello and welcome to Malifaux!!

For Nicodem, I usually tell potential players to also pick up the Seamus box. You'll get 3 Rotten Belles which are one of the best 4ss models in the game, and another master to play around with when Nico becomes second nature. Sybelle isn't too shabby either, and I find my self including her in more non-Seamus lists lately. I'd pick up the Grave Spirit for a totem. Handing out armor +2 to key undead models is awesome. Nico can summon almost any undead model in the game, so you do want to have models to keep your options open, it's a huge part of what Nico does. So here is what I'd go with; Crooked Men, Canine Remains, Seamus Box, and the Grave Spirit to start. Gives you enough versatility to learn what he can do. For Mindless Zombies, I'd say 2 blisters is a good start. I've never had more than 6 on the board, unless I'm using his Avatar.

Nico is going to struggle a little bit against Lady J, because she can erase Corpse Counters from the board with relative ease. If you have the opportunity spam cast Rigor Mortis on her, do it! A paralyzed Lady J is a good one.

As for Ten Thunders, not much is known about the rules of the new stuff. You'll just have to wait and see with the rest of us! However, all things available at Gencon will be available in the online store during the weekend of the con. Wyrd has a cool policy where they don't want us unfortunate people who can't make it, to not be left out, it's pretty cool. Hope this helps!

[Dustcrusher]

Welcome aboard!

You can reduce or spread out your initial starting costs if you're willing to proxy- all of the Book 1 models Nicodem will likely use are in the Resurrectionist v2 stat cards available for download on Malifaux.com. I proxied a few games before I bought, and I still use Mantic models for my Mindless Zombies. There aren't many models he can summon from Books 2 and 3 if I remember right.

I'd say at a minimum, besides the starter, have about 6 MZs, a Flesh Construct, a Rotten Belle or two, and a pack of Necropunks or Night Terrors. Bete Noire is a classic glass cannon: fragile but she hits very hard, especially with Nicodem's Bolster Undead affecting her. If you take her, Necropunks become more of a problem for your foe as you can use their Slow to Die action to put Bete Noire right in a troublesome model's face. Many players use the Dead Rider as a hit-and-run piece and also to pull Nicodem forward for the cost of a couple of wounds.

One big mistake with Nicodem is to get caught up in Reanimator. Yes, it's awesome that you can summon up all sorts of nasties, but it's not easy. There are 6 cards that can do it without using a Soulstone first.

I think of Nicodem's summoning in an opportunistic way. If I have the needed :crows in hand to summon and one or more counters available, and I don't need to Paralyze or Decay anyone, then I'll go for it. A freshly-summoned Flesh Construct is a great way to give your opponent a hard time. Nicodem is better used as a support caster- Bolster Undead, Rigor Mortis, and Decay are his staples. I usually only use The Fog early on, and Arise when I need a couple of MZs for protection. Bolstered Punk Zombies with a Cb of 9 (better than Lilith, btw) are hard to pass up, and even Necropunks at bolstered Cb 7 are not easy to ignore.

Rigor Mortis is your friend. Denying a model an activation is absolutely killer. Sometimes it's worth burning a Soulstone- I've nailed Colette with Rigor Mortis a couple of times, and when she's depending on the ability to Reactivate in that turn, you're denying her two activations.

Now Avatar Nicodem is a different ballgame, and doing some of the killing your own model shenanigans can be good for getting the Avatar of Decay into play sooner, based on what I've been reading from people who have been using him. I will leave that to those who have experience getting the Avatar into play.

The Ten Thunders boxes will be available at Wyrd's booth at GenCon and on Wyrd's online store. If you don't buy from one of those that weekend, they will be released over the next several months (admittedly I have not found the exact schedule yet). The only things you will miss by not buying GenCon weekend are the Hanging Trees terrain/alt Hanged boxed set and (if you buy more than $100 worth of stuff) the exclusive alternate Death Marshal, Miss Terious.

---------- Post added at 10:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:57 AM ----------

Nico is going to struggle a little bit against Lady J, because she can erase Corpse Counters from the board with relative ease. If you have the opportunity spam cast Rigor Mortis on her, do it! A paralyzed Lady J is a good one.

Especially if you have a Bolstered Punk Zombie within Charge range *grin*

[Gruesome]

These have been mentioned, but I like list format.

This is about Nicodem, not Ten Thunders. Which seems like it will be pretty darn "Awesome"

Nicodem Boxset

Seamus Boxset

Mindless Zombies (At least 1 blister)

Canine Remains (At least 1 blister)

Flesh Construct

Grave Spirit

There are 80000000 more models you can get, all of which are awesome, but I think you will find that the above list is a core from which you will be regularly drawing and that with time you will discover what else you would like to grow with.

(I always include avatar, crooked men and dead rider are great... etc...)

I started with Nicodem and found that it is a blessing/curse depending upon your situation. His versatility and ability to hire or summon a LARGE variety of models for a given situation means that you can go in so many directions that "completing" him means owning almost all of the rezzers. (Aside from some specific Kirai spirits)

Whats nice is that you get so much utility out of the models in the Seamus box, that is is a very cost-effective purchase and now you get to bask in his awesomeness too!

As far as playstyles go, I leave that to you. I always hold out hopes that people will continue evolving and discovering things and hope that someday someone smarter than I am figures out a way to make Nicodem a 100% summoning beast that uses reanimator as his primary mechanism to overwhelm people rather than the current "paralyze-paralyze-decay" rinse and repeat with summoning as the occasional convenience... (There is a big difference in what is effective and what it is that drew me to Nicodem in the first place)

Like all gaming communities we tend to think that we have it "all figured out" and that there are "right" and "wrong" ways to play things...

Until someone proves that no one really knew anything...

(BE that "someone" )

Edited August 6, 2012 by Gruesome

[Kaptain_Konrad]

Thanks for the great advice guys, I really appreciate it. I'm going to take all this into consideration.