Guild Austringer vs Neverborn Silurid

[ShaddowKatt]

Raptor: This weapon ignores cover modifiers and line of sight.

Silent: Models cannot ignore cover when targeting this model.

Which trumps which? Fast reply needed.

[TimeLapse]

Silent wins since it ingores the ablity that would alow you to ingore cover, but you still dont need line of sight.

[Dezzo]

however, if u would to activate the Aussy to shoot the Silurid and ignore cover is taken away, does that mean the Silurid gets hard cover? after all... you are shooting the Silurid that is behind "hard cover"

[Turbodog]

@Timelapse: Should be pointed out that you still just make a straight up flip against the silurid with the austringer.

The austringer can't ignore the cover...which gives a negative twist to the attack.

But the austringer DOES use his "Bayou Raptor" ability which gives him a positive twist when attacking silurids (and gremlins).

So they cancel out and he ends up with no modifier to the attack flip.

But yes...the silurid does get cover from the Austringer.

Edited March 1, 2012 by Turbodog

[Dezzo]

hmm correct me if i am wrong but does hard cover also grant the target +1 armor?

[Turbodog]

however, if u would to activate the Aussy to shoot the Silurid and ignore cover is taken away, does that mean the Silurid gets hard cover? after all... you are shooting the Silurid that is behind "hard cover"

We play that the silurid gets cover only if he has activated his ability to give him cover - or if he has cover due to being in "area cover" - which is always soft cover for our table/effects. "intervening hard objects" that give cover - like a wall or building - offer no cover from an austringer because it ignores LoS.

I don't believe the rules manual makes a crystal clear distinction between these two kinds of cover - but in our game group, we do because it makes sense to us. It also makes the games much more fun.

Examples of "area cover"

Standing in Obscurring Auras

Standing in Obscurring Terrain

Abilities that simply grant a model cover...like Silurid or Alyce's

Examples of "intervening cover"

An object (hard or soft) between the models with height less than both models (e.g. a fence)

Any object between the models if LoS is not needed (e.g. a building)

Obscurring terrain that neither model is standing in but that would normally block LoS (e.g. a tree stand or smoke)

An object or terrain feature that blocks only some LoS to the model's base, but that the model is not standing in (e.g. peeking around the corner of a building)

The simplicity becomes that "intervening cover only happens when you check LoS". Models that ignore LoS don't do this check and so cover is never "generated" in the first place. If the silurid had cover, it would be unignorable (is that a word?) - but if the cover never happens in the first place, there's nothing to ignore.

---------- Post added at 11:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:15 PM ----------

hmm correct me if i am wrong but does hard cover also grant the target +1 armor?

Yes, Hard Cover also grants the target +1 armor in addition to the negative twist.

In the case of our Austringer attack, the silurid (if it somehow has hard cover) would get the +1 armor.

Edited March 1, 2012 by Turbodog