DarcXON Posted August 18, 2011 Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 So as I understand it it was ruled that you could temporarily gain Reactivate as an Ability. So my question is could you Assimilate Reactivate from a Construct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 marshimartian Posted August 18, 2011 Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 I'm sure this is being discussed, but also sure that the guys at Wyrd are still frantically trying to fill the gencon orders. Best thing to do is house rule it for now and keep an eye out for a ruling here: http://wyrd-games.net/forum/showthread.php?t=23258 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Calmdown Posted August 18, 2011 Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 I think most people are playing this as legal right now, and it was played like this at the masters at Gencon which was overlorded by Wyrd rules guys. FWIW I've played against it a couple of times and I don't feel that it's particularly broken to be honest, I think that ruling will stand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Jonas Albrecht Posted August 18, 2011 Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 Even though the Rules Manual puts Paralyzed and Reactivate in the same bucket as Slow and Fast, I'm sure the ruling is going to eventually place those two in a separate category. Namely because under the current ruling, Perdita can knock Paralyzed off of someone with Spellbreaker, which means that it is an effect, like Poison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DarcXON Posted August 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 Even though the Rules Manual puts Paralyzed and Reactivate in the same bucket as Slow and Fast, I'm sure the ruling is going to eventually place those two in a separate category. Namely because under the current ruling, Perdita can knock Paralyzed off of someone with Spellbreaker, which means that it is an effect, like Poison. Perdita can use Spellbreaker because it's an effect, but that doesn't mean that it isn't an Talent as well. An effect is anything that changes the "Natural State" of a model. Basically an effect can be a Talent, but a Talent doesn't have to be an effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Jonas Albrecht Posted August 18, 2011 Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 Perdita can use Spellbreaker because it's an effect, but that doesn't mean that it isn't an Talent as well. An effect is anything that changes the "Natural State" of a model. Basically an effect can be a Talent, but a Talent doesn't have to be an effect. We'll see. There's no precedent of a Talent being ruled an effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DarcXON Posted August 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 (edited) http://wyrd-games.net/forum/showpost.php?p=238667&postcount=26 Abilities are Talents. Abilities gained and not on your Card are Effects. Therefore anything gained that is an ability is also a talent. Edited August 18, 2011 by DarcXON Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 Jonas Albrecht Posted August 18, 2011 Report Share Posted August 18, 2011 (edited) http://wyrd-games.net/forum/showpost.php?p=238667&postcount=26 Abilities are Talents. Abilities gained and not on your Card are Effects. Therefore anything gained that is an ability is also a talent. That's not what that ruling is about, though. That one states that Action Modifiers are abilities, but that there are now two categories. One that can be ignored by Maintain Machines (Permanent), and one that can't (Temporary). Under this ruling, Perdita would not be able to Spellbreak Paralyze on another model, because it does not let you ignore Abilities, Permanent or Temporary. This ruling does cement Paralyze and Reactivate's status as action modifiers, but it may be ruled that temporary abilities cannot be Assimilated. EDIT: Actually, I'm wrong about that. Under Effects woefully vague entry in the RM, gaining Paralyze is something that changes a model's status. Edited August 18, 2011 by Jonas Albrecht Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 DarcXON Posted August 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 Actually, I'm wrong about that. Under Effects woefully vague entry in the RM, gaining Paralyze is something that changes a model's status. Thankfully there is not much of that in the RM. But if you read the description for Effects in the RM you can see where I pulled the rest of the information. Basically I just put the pieces together but wanted to confirm with the Marshalls if that was the intent on Assimilate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 sharpobjects Posted August 19, 2011 Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 It seems clear based on the RM that reactivate is a talent. Page 12 of the RM lists the four categories that are Talents; Abilities, Actions, Triggers and Weapons. Referring to page 32-34 of the RM, it explains Actions in detail as well as all subcategories of Actions. (1) Actions: Basic - (2) General Actions - (3) Specific Actions - (4) Action Modifiers. Under the last subcategory of Actions, Action Modifiers, page 34 of the RM lists four game abilities that increase or decrease the number of general AP a model receives during its activation. These four are; Fast, Slow, Paralyzed and Reactivate. It seems clear that RAW would allow Hoffman to assimilate reactivate after successfuly casting (2) override edict on a construct. Whether that was intended by the game makers is another issue. I have used this from time to time and I have not seen it as a game breaker. I have lost games where I have assimilated reactivate with Hoffman once or twice during a game and I have won a few games because of it. Casting the spell is not automatic, you need the mask. As I am sure all of us have experienced, I have had many turns where i didnt draw a single mask on the draw phase. Unless its the last round and I have nothing to lose, I am not about to spend (2) AP on the fate of a flip of a card off the deck and a stone to follow to find that mask. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 LoboStele Posted August 19, 2011 Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 Guys, there are only two sections on your cards. Talents and Spells. Anything that isn't a Spell is a Talent. Then, Talents are further broken down into additional categories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 findersbane Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 Override edict's wording does not state it receives 'Reactivate' it just says activate target construct regardless of if it has activated or not this turn so I don't think it can be assimilated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 bucket_boy101 Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 Read further buddy, the card actually has the word reactivate in bold text. This is because it can let you activate a construct that has not already activated or one that has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0 sharpobjects Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 The Book 2 description and Hoffmans actual card are a little different. He might be going by Book 2. Hoffman's card states "gains reactivate" in its description of Override Edict. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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DarcXON
So as I understand it it was ruled that you could temporarily gain Reactivate as an Ability.
So my question is could you Assimilate Reactivate from a Construct?
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