Painting white on black primer

[McNs]

Howdy:

I'll preface this was a blunt assertion: my painting ability could be summarized as "sucktactular". I'd rank somewhere between a 5-6 on a CMON scale and I'd like to improve upon that.

That said, I've started work on my painting my Malifaux box sets so I can spread the good word to other locals. I'd like these models to look as good as possible for obvious reasons.

I've started work on my Rasputina box set and primed her in black, as every model I prime in white looks washed out for some reason. I'd like to keep her close to the studio color scheme, so white coat, white hat, etc. I've never had much luck painting white on black primer: I either ending up adding too many thin coats and giving the model a "caked" look (I've gotten better at this recently via thinning my paints further) or the whites look too dark.

So here's my questions:

1. Can I get a good looking white using black primer, or should I strip the models and reprime them in white?

2. Should I base-coat the white areas in white or in a light grey, then highlight the white areas?

Here's some general info that I've seen asked as initial questions in other "Help me paint better" threads:

- I'm using the P3 line of paints and paint brushes.

- I'm thinning my paints using the P3 Mixing Medium to a thin, milk like thickness. I've gotten OK at figuring out when paints too thick and too thin; gloppiness isn't a huge issue for me anymore.

- Two brush blending is a technique I'm still working on; any advice here would be much appreciated.

- I tend to work with a darker undercoat and add highlights. If this is backwards, I'd be happy to work the other direction.

Thanks in advance for any pointers; I hope to be able to paint half as good as some of you someday.

Edited August 18, 2009 by McNs

[U.S. Male]

I'm not necessarily the worlds best painter, but I've got a whole khador warmachine army done in white. For most of the models I used white primer, but on a couple I used black, and they came out quite well. The key is to build up from a smooth base color that has good coverage, I apply two thin coats of GW space wolves grey, and then blend/layer from there.

So really it sounds like you are on the right path.

[DangerousBeans]

White is a colour I generally try to avoid, especially on big spaces but I too wished my Rasputina to have white clothes so gave it a go and it turned out quite well. (you can see her in the "miniature showcase" section somewhere)

I used the GW foundation paints (honestly, pick up these and the washes. Expensive but oh so worth it!). Started with a light grey base and then went over that with 50/50 light grey (astronomican grey I think)/ white mix. Then worked up to white by layering the colours (I don't use two brush), just adding some white to every layer. When that was done I painted on a very watered down white making sure it didn't pool anywhere. This smooths out the layers somewhat. Then did some "darklining" with some very, very watered down Devlan Mud wash (dark brown, almost black)

The trick is to not overdo the shading, as if it's too dark it makes the white look muddy. Natural light is your friend to some degree with white.

I'd maybe suggest practicing on some spare models first, you don't want to jump straight into painting Rasputina! Let us know how you get on.

[AoM]

Well, you're looking at cooler whites for Rasuptina. I'd go with Greatcoat Grey over the black primer, working up to Frostbite. Then from there to white. Some Underbelly Blue might be appropriate as well, but I haven't messed with that color much. In fact, it might be sitting in my paint case unopened still. I know that a build of Greatcoat through Frostbite ending with Morrow White will work well. The transition from Frostbite to Morrow is pretty easy. I'd probably do the Greatcoat to Frostbite with a layer of Great coat, then a 2:1 Greatcoat to Frostbite, 1:1, 1:2 Greatcoat to Frostbite, then stragith Frostbite.

[Magno]

For an overall bright color scheme like Rasputina, I wouldn't prime her in black, but rather white.

But you could go with black. Wet blending is a bit trickier technique which I rarely use especially if you're going to clearly defined colors. Wet blending can be great when you are doing more chaotic or nuanced color blending and are not looking for particular control of the color blends. I too favor this approach, but save the final highlight till the end.

I use GW paints almost exclusively now and only thin down with water. P3 are pretty decent, but they do force the flow medium on occasion.

Vallejo Model color is good, but its a hit and miss with the paint consistency as the retardents and paint pigment easily seperate and don't flow out of the bottle as nicely as you would hope.

Whether you go from light to dark or dark to light is your preference really. The Europeans and more often the better American painters tend to go non-linear; bounce from highlighting and shadows to create some more interesting color blends.

If you don't reprime in white, DO NOT base coat with white. Build it up from cooler colors. Codex Grey, Space Wolves Grey and the above mentioned greys are great starters.

If you rerpime in white, you'll almost be painting in negative space; i.e. painting in only shadows and then doing the final highlights in white to cover up any mistakes. White is one of the harder colors to work with since it is the most sensitive to incoming lighting and reflects it the most as well, so if your work light is soft (i.e. yellowish) and you have cardboard and other non-white colors around your work area, it can trick your eye into seeing the colors blend differently onto the model. then you bring the model into a tungesten or day light and the colors all look different.

White is also a great color to challenge yourself with so looking forward to this one and good luck.

[McNs]

Thanks to all for the suggestions!

I'll add pictures of progress as they come; I'm going to give Angel_of_Menoth's method a try on a spare model (the CMON Dark Sword LE).

@ Mango: Thanks for the in-depth response. I've never been especially good at painting large, white surfaces, so I'll see how this one works out.

[McNs]

OK; I tried AoM's method on a spare miniature and really dig it. I need to work on the blending a bit, but the color progression worked well. I found that I can probably start with the 2:1 Greycoat to Frostbite mix and get good results; any hard shadows I can hit with dilute Greycoat.

Thanks a bunch guys; I'll get a good shot of the crew when its done!

[AoM]

glad you liked the recipe. can't wait for the pics!