admiralvorkraft

1 hour ago, Dark Reaper said:

Didn't think about that, sorry. When he cheats the Red Joker, I'll just play my RJ+1 and be fine. 

If you're cheating Red to dodge an obey that's cool with me. Heck if you're holding cards to dodge obeys period then I'm fine with it. 

Sure, and if you over invest in beaters you're locking yourself into a bad gameplan. 

And I'm just not impressed with Phiona at 10ss. Bring It is an okay movement trick, but it's not great outside of Recover Evidence. Her attack is good once her grit turns on, or if she's got a scheme marker to power her up. She's good at 9ss of course and with it into RE at 10.

But when my master gives out a resource I don't really want 20% of my crew getting no benefit out of it. 

1 minute ago, Dark Reaper said:

The two biggest problems are going to be that the emissary still exists and can be relented against for min2 and that Archivist has wp6 against a stat5 obey.

You're playing Lucius, you have better cards. Your obey on the Emissary can just be to walk it out of Take the Hit and healing aura range. 

But again, if they stay clustered the whole game you just play the rest of the board and win that way. 

2 minutes ago, Adran said:

That sounds like a good model to be obeying. If I were facing Cadmus with Lucius I would be looking at trying to obey the Archivist. Since you are controlling it you can choose to Siphon power the Archivist for the crow for killer late fees, and then "we are legion" the damage back into the crew (whilst the Archivist still takes 1 because its irreducible) So you are looking at 5+ damage and a card draw/discard from the Obey if you can get it to land. 

Deafening silence needs to go up from the Cadmus crew fast to stop this sort of thing, which at least has forced the Archivist to activate (and if you have low cards, this is probably a good use for them)

 

Absolutely. And that's the threat if the Cadmus player breaks their bubble at all. I guess even in the bubble the Emissary isn't a bad Obey target either (Wp 5, good attack, or I just have it walk away...) so if they want to ditch a card it's all good.

Just now, 4thstringer said:

2 ideas do deal with jamming nests.  1. Obey them, tell them to go away. 2. Alan Reid seems particularly well suited for dealing with them.  

But yeah, I agree they are a problem.  But they are a problem I struggle with with every guild crew.

They are the single biggest issue with Cadmus. I think Void is pretty much the only keyword with an efficient response.

Just now, 4thstringer said:

I think taking out archivist is definitely lucius's biggest problem. Archy loves to see min 2 damage coming at him.   That being said, mitigating the other parts I wonder if luci could weather the storm.

Archivist has a 10" range. Play around it. It's not a perfect solution, but that's the Lucius game plan. 

If the Emissary is standing in its deployment zone next to important models all game you win. The end.

My plan for dealing with the Emissary is to...not attack it. Especially with Lucius. You go wide better than Cadmus can, pick your schemes accordingly. Put the Eyes and Ears down. Lean into your denial pieces.

Pathfinder has my favorite gun to copy - 14" ignores concealment and has a trigger for Slow. Plus he brings lots of free movement and generally good utility.

My problem with Lucius into Cadmus (and my biggest issue with Cadmus generally) is the Nests existing. I can't theoryfaux an efficient way to deal with them jamming up my crew. I guess Investigators and hoping I've got the cards for No Witnesses to 3-shot them. 

2 hours ago, belorey said:

If you really need Take the Hit, you have Phiona. You cannot spend 9ss only for Toss. But is my opinion. I prefer spend 10ss on Howard, Peacekeeper or Phiona than in the Guardian.

Except that Phiona can't use Power Tokens, costs more, doesn't have a 2" engagement range, doesn't have Scatter, doesn't have Toss.

I'm sorry that I keep going on about this, but I started this thread complaining about how one dimensional Hoffman is and the consistent argument from a number of folks here has been that to be successful you need to lean into that single dimension of play. Which is just completely contrary to my experience with the game. I have always found that you win by bringing a diversity of tools to the table that allow you to respond to different situations, that movement tech is very often what wins games.

The Peacekeeper is a never-take for me because all it brings to the table is murder, and I rarely need to kill more than a model or two all game (sure, I'll kill more if I have AP free as insurance). There are plenty of ways to do that. The Guardian on the other hand effectively frees up a ton of AP for scoring and unlocks otherwise impossible positioning. 

I will grant that Hoffman (with the Transfer Power pushes and access to lots of Fast) can cope without the Guardian's tech. But he also has a beastly damage track so I'd contend he doesn't need to spend all his stones on dedicated beaters either.

1 hour ago, Thatguy said:

I think both Howard and The Peacekeeper beat the Guardian out as a beater. 

I do want to try Tossing something with the Guardian then hitting it with slow via a Warden. 10" away and slow will leave just about anything in a bad spot, eating a turn or more getting back in position. 

So? I'm not taking it because I need a beater. I'm taking it because I need a toss bot with Take the Hit. 

I'll take him over Howard or the Peacekeeper any day. Toss is one of the best actions in the game. The rest of the model is gravy. 

3 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

Maybe playing with Tri-Chi has made me overvalue models with 2" engagement and easy pushes. Lol

No, I'm with you. 

The charge angles thing is huge, no doubt. 

18 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

The punishing bit comes when you're charged by someone else.

If you had equal engagement ranges, you'd get two attacks to respond with. If you have a smaller engagement range, you have to walk, then attack.

Less of an issue for Lucius than anyone else. Issue command to a false witness, they use false claim, you get two pushes from Stand Back and draw a card for following orders plus set up to draw a card from remove evidence. Issue command on the Investigator to attack, draw a card. Hit for 1 and Stagger. Issue command to a Lawyer to obey the Investigator, draw two cards, hit and cheat the decent crow that you almost certainly have now for 4/5/6 damage ignoring armor (your two pushes from false claim/Stand Back should facilitate the LoS fuckery).

I guess first you scooped on your opponent's hand so you never need to cheat higher than necessary. 

And you could always just push the Investigator out of combat and do something completely different. Because why be tied down to anything you don't want to be? 

We weren't the top of the kill pile last edition either 😛

Hoffman is great. 

You want to be able to isolate his models. I don't know 10T well enough to talk about tech to do that. 

He doesn't like lots of ping damage, so a sacrificial Waynudo or a focused Dawn Serpent can splash a few stacks of burning across the bubble which will tax them more than you expect.

Distracted (10T Brother) stops the Emergency Transfer pushes which can help with isolating a target. Not worth bringing a model just for that I think, but it's worth considering. 

Done

Right. The nests and OI make it virtually impossible to play a skirmish or control game - which is how you respond to a slow rolling beatdown crew. 

Like, my approach would be a Lucius crew with Jury teched in. Try and spam Ancient Words to get that Glimpse trigger but I'm not going to bury both of them efficiently, someone will get stuck with a parasite token and then I may as well just run them off to die...

The two problems I can't theoryfaux around are the totems and omnipresent influence. The rest of it seems manageable. Good of course, but manageable. 

You've got scheming, support, damage, and control all in keyword. I wouldn't bring anything ook without something specific in mind. 

On 3/14/2021 at 8:54 PM, ooshawn said:

I don't care what lucius crew you play, you have no chance versus this crew. it's literally impossible to win

New Leveticus Crew (Outcasts)
Size: 50 - Pool: 5
Leader:
  Leveticus
    Servant of Dark Powers
Totem(s):
  Hollow Waif
  Hollow Waif 2
Hires:
  Rusty Alyce
  Mad Dog Brackett
  Ashes and Dust
  Marlena Webster
  Prospector
References:
  Abomination
  Ashen Core
  Dust Storm

Sure, if you play badly. No one in that crew but Alyce can catch you. 

6 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

In general, yes, though, people overestimate the importance of controlling the centre in a lot of pools. There was a whole thread on it xD

I think it's more than overvaluing the center - though that's a huge THING in the current mindset - but assuming that there's going to be a big fight somewhere that you have to win. And you just don't. You may have to manage one or two hyper mobile, hyper aggressive models, or play around shooting but you really don't need to engage in a stand up fight if you don't want to. 

Idk.

1 hour ago, ooshawn said:

the way the game is played in this GG1, agent 46 will absolutely die if he engages the enemy team, and he's likely only able to take out dirt cheap models

Judging by the forums "the way gg1 is played" is mostly...poorly.

If you're having a scrum in the center of the board one of the two of you is playing bad Malifaux. You both think you're the beatdown and one of you is wrong. 

Lucius is bad in a head-on engagement so focus on fundamentals, work the terrain to your advantage, bully your opponent's schemers, win on points. 

Leeches are also occasionally still used, as are maggots. Both in very specific ways and instances but I'm not a doctor so don't quote me 😛

I don't know. Generally I prefer more neutral poses to the EXTREME movement of a lot of the 2e sculpts. I'll hold judgment until I see the actual models. 

50 minutes ago, NoisyAssassin said:

It's a pretty common rule in most other skirmish wargames, so pretty reasonable to get mixed up. 

And was the case in m2e.