bsm86

I like the idea of the Trigger being "After failing". While that would not boost her defenses actively it makes for a huge decision the opponent has to make:

1. Either take their expensive beater (Ruthless or not, don't matter) and getting a slap across the face for each successful attack,

2. or going in there with less expensive and less capable models.

That would bring back some of the Pandora flavor of forcing decisions onto the opponent where none of which seems appealing.

As of right now, I think the best option is to just keep on healing KJ and when he finally dies and gets buried, just keep him that way.

Making some terrain hazardous is still a benefit since you did not need to pay for the upgrade in the first place.

On 2/4/2019 at 6:13 PM, darksoul281 said:

The bad juju with 9 wounds and df 3 its very squizy, 3 hits of a beater model kill the bad juju to easy, the demise not help to much because its only one time per turn and need a card from the hand

Really what are you trying to accomplish with all your threads? You provide zero data and seem to be just moaning...

1. Juju was always Df 3.

2. Juju is a Henchman; keep some stones to keep him alive vs. the enemy beater.

3. Juju is picking his fights with Ambush and a 7" threat range

4. As soon as Juju is in combat with the enemy beater, the enemy beater probably is not going to do that much; between Penetrating Stench and HtW, you're probably not taking that much damage. And then we're back at 2.

Please stop making those topics. Or keep making them if you seek advice on how to play your models. But please: Keep them constructive and take at least a little care of your grammar and sentence structure.

33 minutes ago, PeterParkerPlays said:

Isnt't Widow Weaver tax free for Collodi?

Nightmare Tailor: When hiring, this model is treated as having the Puppet Keyword.

Yup, I was still thinking in Closed Beta *facepalm*
You're absolutely right.

Making her Versatile would probably benefit Collodi too much. He was unable to hire her back when DMH still was a faction and now he needs to pay the +1. I'd probably pay the tax most of the time when playing Collodi but with no tax she'd be in almost any Collodi crew churning out Stitched that are then Puppet Master'd, die and get summoned again.

4 hours ago, Ming said:

In 2E Hannah's MI Rg was 3". Now it's only 1". Shouldn't it be 2"?

If that's your only reasoning you won't see any sort of reaction from Wyrd's end.

Post a battle report indicating that Hannah is particularly weak due to her reach being only 1" and how a 2" reach would fix the problem.

Sure, perspective-wise, 2" would make sense given that she's a large model and all. But there are other large models with the same issue and reach 2" should not be handed out to a whole lot of models as it allows for some really nasty stuff with charging "around a corner".

I relly don't see the issue with Sorrows here. The whole point of the Pandora crew is to force the opponent into doing things he does not want and then punish him for it. Or punish him for things he does want to do. Just punishing in general.

That said, Sorrows have something that amplifies the passive amount of damage a Pandora crew can dish out: Life Leech. Imagine: Model X activates with a Sorrow and Candy nearby. The simple fact of just activating causes:

• the model to get stunned,
• the opponent to have to discard a card,
• the model to suffer 1 damage

Aside of that a Sorrow is still a capable Scheme runner, a nice enhancement of the 4" Misery aura and can possibly render a model almost completely useless if you combine Staggered with Pandoras tentacle thingy.

Aversion and Lyssa are great though.

I agree with Nekima. There was never a point in Closed or now in Open where I actually wanted to try her. I'm not the "kill everything, scheme later" guy and therefore couldn't find anything that would suit my play style in her crew.

Titania is fine, I guess. Still, a mechanic similar to Royal Indignation would be very nice though not really needed for her overall survivability right now. Something probably would need to go and I sure don't want it to be Cruel Disappointment.

Aeslin does need some love or at the very least an option within the crew to boost her Defenses; like the Titania upgrade allowed for her to gain Armor +1 in 2E.

3 minutes ago, Euclid (#ScottishMeta) said:

can't wait for the first arguments around this then.... "you can't choose that one next we said we were doing it clockwise"  "yeah but you've just left the card on top, so I don't want to go with them anymore!"   😂

Yeah, that will definitely happen 😅

It's still up to the opponent to decide the order in which he resolves the simple duels. So at least he/she has some sort of influence on who fails and who won't.

Quote

p. 37 GRB:

Ability Timing
Most Abilities are passive and always in effect, but
some occur as a result of another game effect. In
these cases, the Ability will use the word “After.”
These Abilities happen after the effect in question
is resolved.

I'd assume the effect in question would be the WP duel. Therefore you'd look at the card after the first model completed its simple duel in which it cheated and then look at the card before any other WP duel is resolved.

Quite intrusive but should RAW be correct.

18 hours ago, katadder said:

It's fine though, she's just another master who will probably sit in a case (along with most my arcanists) through 3e.

Yes please. The fewer people playing Dora the more you can get out of her if you actually made an effort to work with her limitations since others dont know her strengths too well.

20 minutes ago, Fixxer said:

Not talking her Df trigger here. Simply talking positioning, target priority, and using her main attack action on models that would be a problem for her in melee. @10" away, most beaters are going to have to walk, charge, meaning they'll get one swing, unless they have flurry. In that case a stone or two could help keep her standing for a counter attack or support from other friendlies. Ultimately all masters can be killed by a nasty beater model, luckily Pandora doesnt even need to be close in order to deal with it.

BUT if she is close to a beater that's going to activate, use Mood Swings and buy yourself another activation to get away or send in another models to fight. Heck use it a few times, discarding low/mid cards is better than Pandora getting beat up. Mood Swings is extremely powerful in those exact situations. 

I tried exactly that for several games now and it works really well. Of course you need to be mindful of the attack stats of other models in order to use her trigger.

Mood Swings indeed help a lot with pressure on Dora; getting her into the fray, popping her aura for -2" enemy movement and then handing out Staggered with a Sorrow is an extremely good way to keep most of those beaters away from her. An Aversion at her side also helps as it forces another WP duel in order to stay within close range of Dora.

Take Teddy. +1 Armor and Reg +1. Serena does the rest.

4 minutes ago, kaintxu said:

Also, someone mentioned that after using the 3 daydreams for this, they would heal them with Coppelius. How do you achieve that?

His Unhinge Action

I'm sure the term "piece" of terrain refers to an actual, physical piece on the board. Therefore a marker is one piece and another marker is a different piece. The same goes for forests, buildings etc.

So... don't take Myranda?! Basically what you're saying is that she is utterly useless to the way you used to play Marcus. Take other options; take that Grootslang from the beginning.

@solkan said it best: It's all situational. Myranda is a model for certain situations but for every possible certain situation. You want to be prepared for anything? Take Myranda. You don't? Don't.

33 minutes ago, Tors said:

Did you played with the full new hiring process? You announce Pandora and your Opponent drops in some rutheless troops, so you are faced with them most of the Time?

Yes.

Even a ruthless model is far less dangerous when they‘re stunned.

Then there is still Kade and Doppelganger/Lilitu who can lure such models out of position.

I‘m not saying it is easy but Pandora feels okay to me.

Why do you think it should be on her card?

No model needs to be unkillable; Terrifying 13 is powerful enough in an environment of lower WP. Of course, Ruthless counters this pretty hard but not all models are Ruthless.
I tried Pandora a lot and think, she is in a fairly good place right now. Learn to live with her limitations and make the most use of her opportunities (semi-pun intended). 

19 minutes ago, Passenty said:

She indeed looks not too great. I think her terrify should be lowered and her stats made better so she is not countered easily by ruthless and high wp. Terrify is her oly defensive tech and if someone can bypass that she is made from paper. Her defensive trigger could be better imo, cant she just get a butterfly jump similiary to 2e?

Give her Inhuman Reflexes.

14 hours ago, Adran said:

Making her a henchman would potentially have a huge effect on her, as it would allow her to lead as well as use soulstone. If you just want her to use stones you could change the action, but speaking as someone that played before you could use stones to add suits, needing the right suited card is not impossible, it is just unreliable.

I really like Vasilisa as she is now. She is not terribly fragile but not impossible to kill in a focused attempt either. But what she brings to the table is simply awesome for a Collodi crew. Handing out Staggered like Halloween candy enhances Collodis ability to maneuver his own crew in the best possible way. Her movement shenanigans are not as strong as "A Friend To Talk To" but still situationally useful. Getting to probably summon in another spare Stitched given the proper card is the icing on the cake.

3 hours ago, Yajnho said:

I just meant Rougarou is a reasonable damage dealer at 2 points less than Killjoy.  The slightly diminished damage track is somewhat mitigated by the triggers. 

It's not only the triggers. The movability of Rougarou is way ahead of Killjoys which is only enhanced by adding Reflexes which also makes up for the slightly lower damage track as you could either charge through your target or probably some other models and hand out a bit of that Blade Rush.

I'm not totally against the new bury mechanic of Killjoy. But not having an "unimpeded"-like ability makes him almost completely useless in the ranks of the Fae. If there is no notion to give him back some movement help, I'd agree on making him Versatile.

Still doin' it. Now with 3rd Edition as well.

More importantly, he lost the ability to not be slowed down by Underbrush Markers. Not having this may severely (pun intended) hinder his movement options on a typical Fae battlefield.

Needs some testing though. 

Have you tested it for a couple of games before coming to this conclusion or are you just assuming because it appears weird?

4 hours ago, Dzsovi said:

She had gone through on several nerfs in closed beta (she had crazy things and too many flips on duels, it was annoying and slow to play), i still think she is not in a bad spot, try to play her a few times. With candy Pandora is able to shut down a whole section from the enemy team (slow, stun, aoe dmg), then comes a teddy/carver/hooded rider to finish the job.

This.

Don't write her off until you played her a couple of times. Pandora is still crazy annoying for an opponent und can buy you 2-3 turns to bring the rest of your crew in position.

With her tentacle thingy and a Sorrow to hand out Staggered she can cripple the most dangerous enemy Melee model to (almost) complete uselessness.