Daniel Walker

Here are some lists that I really like 

But also there are a bit very strong single-master lists like: Nekima + Angel Eyes + two shamans, Lucius +Angel Eyes + two shamans + Agent, Savage is very strong keyword. 

Also, I want to summon @Domin and @karukame here.

6 hours ago, Scoffer said:

Multiple masters are allowed on most events here, DMH masters are usualy allowed as a single-master option. 

TT is the least popular faction here and it lacks high skilled players. 

We just have two very skilled NVB, as you know) xD

But the one is Dreamer main player (shame on you)

But we really have mostly multimaster meta.

Titania + Euripid

Zoraida + Marcus

Pandora + Nekima + Titania

Dreamer + Pandora

Zoraida + Euripid

6 minutes ago, Yew Arcane said:

You're not wrong. But that doesn't mean that we shouldn't have the conversation. Ignoring and dismissing what others find make them uncomfortable makes the game something that they can still enjoy. Just because the setting isn't sunshine and daisies doesn't mean that we have to treat the people who play the game like they're unwelcome unless they don't see issues. I find the concept of reanimating corpses detestable onna fundamental level. My solution is to not play characters who do that (with one exception for personal reasons). Does that mean I don't think Resurrectionists shouldn't be in the game? No, just let people express their opinions about the game and its lore without dismissing them because you disagree. 

The option not to play or play with is good. But option cut it from the game  because it hurt my feelings is totally bad

9 hours ago, Yew Arcane said:

If someone with a trauma finds something that triggers a response in the game, that is something that should be talked about.  You are misusing the term 'Trigger' in this light. it makes light of people who have responses to things related to traumas (fireworks are a trigger for people who have combat related PTSD). One does not choose to be triggered by something. This is absolutely a place to discuss things about the game and its lore that make people uncomfortable on any level, including such subjects as cultural appropriation, and possibly triggers. You aren't the only one who plays the game to escape from reality, and discussing ways that it might make people uncomfortable and thus, unable to do so.

Wait a second. World of Malifaux is not safespace for everyone. It’s the world of guild terror, dead children that are trying to kill you, and savage neverborns, who hates humanity at all. World of cruel necromancers, and cunning criminals. Any of that things can trigger a lot of people. One should not come and ruin the whole magical world by trying to explain that it can hurt to someone. There is no rainbows and unicorns (only bloody Ulix unicorns) in this world. Bad things happens.

16 minutes ago, Hagisman said:

The problem is that Master is indicative of slave ownership, because he has the whip (In m2e, he used to hurt his men to get extra actions as well) he looks more like a slave master.

See above. Queeg is a fine character to reference, but his implementation made him look like a slave master. If he didn't have the whip and just threatened to shot his men I think it would have been better. But "cracking the whip" got into the game.

So due to his background and keyword in m2e maybe it was okey to him to treat his people like a slaves? As I think it is common in near-criminal organisations. He was described and looked very sadistic, so he could be a slavemaster. May be it can hurt someones feeling, but its very natural for a guy who is reffered as "bad guy"

10 minutes ago, Myyrä said:

I'm guessing the fact that it can refer to slave owners.

What is the problem with it? it is historical fact, and no one can argue that in that historical period slavery exists. Even Fae in Malifaux are evil undeads, why we should hide other bad sides of that world?

50 minutes ago, Hagisman said:

I'm glad Queeg has lost the "Master" title to his name. Originally "Master Queeg", he carries a whip. 

For those who don't know who Queeg is a reference to check out the Caine Mutiny:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Caine_Mutiny

If he was just Queeg it would have been fine. But calling him Master really crossed the line. Additionally having a Henchman model called "Master' is kind of confusing.

Whats wrong with Master reference? 

4 hours ago, trikk said:

This looks like you're playing way overaggresive. With good amounts of slow/staggered and Twisting Their Ideals and it's trigger (remember you can spend focus if you're controlling the charge) you should delay/remove most threats.

If you get attacked by focused attacks and hit you should most likely spend a stone for the  to dmg as with moderate spikes it's worth more than the reduction stone (especially when you can't cheat SS reduction now).

I have no idea how Agent or Nekima can kill you. They have 1 attack that costs you 1-2 stones and then you Squeel and then should get severely damage in return.

The ignore resist triggers is painful but it's not really that many models outside of TT and you should most likely slow/staggere/charge them away 

 

The biggest threat I see to her is actually Levi but it's a matchup I didn't play so it might not be that bad.

 

As for Headlines: 1) if Nellie is engaged but your other reporters are not within 2" of other models then she is too far forward. She's a midline master, which means all the Reporters/Phionas/Judges/Emissaries should at least be on the same line as her.

You wrote a lot of text about her evasion skills and forget only one word. That word is “Obey”. Your can’t declare sqeel against Phiona or Executioner. I can hit you with agent four  times) during three different activations. Nellie if far less playable as she were in M2E. 

1 minute ago, trikk said:

I think we agree in general.

 

The issue with Zoraida could be fixed with enemy only. It wouldn't create more issues but it wouldn't solve any other., correct?

I was reading this thread for a while and don’t see any problems?Why you think all potential cool interactions should be fixed. Pandora was always very tricky master with a lot of possibilities, and they just fixed her. And now you think that she must be nerfed and become unplayable again?)

I played some games using Lilith and Nekima and realized that i have no reasons to use Lilith. She is much worse than Nekima and have a 6 stat greatsword. Is here anybody who tested her and think than she needs some improvements?

4 hours ago, Erik1978 said:

I played 4 games with Thoon in the closed beta.

WIthout Frosen Trophy he is not worth taking at all. But I had a game where I buried 3 models.

After that I suggested to Wyrd that he should need a double Tome to bury people, or make it once per turn.

However if you play against Euripides, you know he's there and you bring Mad Dog, Sidir or similar to destroy those pillars. I can see the issue with Zoraida where you might not know he shows up.

You really thought that hard-to-use mechanic should become used-once-in-M3E mechanic? Toon is totally useless without Trophy)

4 hours ago, Angelshard said:

@Daniel Walker didn't mean to sound offensive and indeed any list or secondary master is a valid point when discussing a master. I simply didn't want the discussion of a specific list to spill over into a general discussion of Collodi, but I apologise if I sounded harsh. 

It’s okey, I also sorry if I sound offensive) If you will find something interesting for collodi text me please) I will do the same if you want.

1 hour ago, Gnomezilla said:

I’ll just note that we have a wildly differing view of acceptable power level in the game (and that may help to explain the thrust of my last few battle reports arguing against similar tactics). 😕

That’s a bit funny, Because I see here very big power potential. Not that particular list but the idea. The idea of power playing and making best tools is very popular in Moscow community, and we made awfully powerful lists in M2E. So some people like Ming just don’t want to give neverborn more broken mechanics that are not found already

30 minutes ago, Angelshard said:

I've seen the list in the other thread and I'd say it's more of a Zoraida list than a Collodi list, so I'll continue the discussion in that thread.

Every neverborn model can be in neverborn list, sir. The game allow’s us to use. best combos we can find, and Zoraida can be second master in every list)  But for me the best in mono Collodi are Widow and Vasilisa, who can make stitches from marionette ‘s, as it was told previously 

3 minutes ago, Angelshard said:

@Daniel Walker Noone is saying obey isn't strong. I'm saying that a list with a single beater, 3 stones in cache and 5 stones spent on OOK isn't strong. One of the strong things about obey is getting additional use out of your own high value models and maybe one or two important obeys on the opponent. 11 obeys is overkill. 

Also, how the eff did you win a duel against Pride several times!? after he's activated you always cheat first. Unless your opponent has used all his good cards I cannot for the life of me see how you could get him to empty the opponents hand and kill Sue. 

 

If you have 13,12, and Zoraida&Collodi you will obey him at least three times)

Guys, the point was to show our understanding of situation. If you think different it’s okey. But my experience in M2E says that Obey is one of the most gamebreaking mechanic) And in M3E it becomes much better. Of cause we can say that obey need 2 cards to deal damage. But tell it to Sue, who kill its one Doc, or to Pride, how killed Sue, took all cards from opponent hand, and the died)

1 hour ago, Angelshard said:

@Jwinks 11 stones for Teddy is a lot, I will give that he can heal by using consume on marionettes, but I don't think he has enough synergy to justify him over Hinamatsu or duet, especially after OOK tax. Hinamatsu can use stones and duet can start turn two with 5 fcous.

@Daniel Walker I haven't tried him with zoraida, but I imagine it gets very card and stone intensive. I can see how it could be really disgusting, if you just obey charge the opponents models around. Personally I find that a single offensive obey model requires a lot of high cards and the card draw in this crew is limited to threads of fate from Zoraida. 

You have a very good card manipulation. Zoraida, chagelings, bokor. You always have a prioriti targets for obey using your cards and other targets for luck and stones)

13 hours ago, Angelshard said:

He's quite strong, but he does have some weakneses. He loses initiative every turn. His only two beaters are hinamatsu and duet (maybe stitched now, haven't tried the devil version) kill them and the crew does very little damage. He dies to blasts and shock waves. 

But yes he's strong, flexible and fun to play with a never ending army of thrw away puppets. 

What effegies do people use with him? Which emissary seems best for him? I've considered hodgepodge. 

Whole enemy crew are his beaters. I really don’t now how you people play collodi. Take him, and Zoraida, some Versatile beaters and just kill everything using opponents models.

Just now, Chris Garstan said:

I thought they nerfed most breaking mechanics... 

They did it. I think its not bug) It’s unique feature as it were in M2E. Single master obey)

3 minutes ago, Ming said:

You just take Zoraida as Leader, add Collodi, three Changelings and a Bokkor. 11 Obeys with additional Ensorcel. Please note that Thoon has Old Ways and can flip cards from Discard. He also has Intuition.

I told you, nobody sees the problem) It’s just fun mechanic that can help you to win the game on turn two)

26 minutes ago, Ming said:

Sure, when you're prepared for it, you can have countermeasures. However, it's clearly a stronger model removal ability than the rest. It needs a bit nerf. Have you tried Doppelganger the Frozen Trophy yet?

Yep, but eleven obeys in turn makes it much better then Doppelgänger . I really don’t sure that Trophy need nerf, because it’s ability of a single guy with 10 health, that can be easily killed or countered by any unbury or terrain destruction mechanic.

19 minutes ago, Ming said:

Yesterday we played with a Neverborn opponent, who managed to win two games in a row by simply burying the opponent's Crew with Frozen Trophy. There was no way to unbury the frozen models.

Just a reminder, what I'm talking about:

Enhanced Fists y1" 6 Df -
Target suffers 2/4/6 damage.
tFrozen Trophy:Enemy only.Create a Ht 4, Blocking, Destructible, Impassable Ice Pillar Marker in base contact with the target. Then, if a marker was Dropped this way, Bury the target. If the Ice Pillar Marker is removed, Unbury the target into base contact with the Marker before it is removed.

Unless you have Blow it to hell or a similar action, you probably won't be able to destroy the pillar easily. And please note, that you can take Obey models like Zoraida or copy the Attack with Doppelganger. Now just by hitting a target you bury it without any flips (hello, Glimpse the Void) and they won't unbury automatically. E.g. Colette has a bonus action with automatic bury, but it's a bonus action and the target unburies when activates. Frozen Trophy usually stays buried forever, unless you have an extra model, that can get there and destroy the pillar, which would be rare.

Please give this trigger another unbury condition, so that the target won't leave the game automatically. E.g. unbury it at the start of its Activation next to any Pillar. And give a resistance flip similar to Glimpse the Void or Pinebox.

Yes, I did yesterday, but as you seen it is a bit hard to bury everything if your opponent knows how to deal with it) I think than you must have one specific combo to do that things, so it is not so powerful as you are saying)

4 minutes ago, Adran said:

But 10 damage from a single duel that has taken a whole master activation to set up is much less of a problem. (at least for me. Several masters can do more damage in that activation, so I wouldn't see that damage all from that 1 duel, its actually from 4 + duels prior to the wretches activation).

I'm not the person you need to convince. I would suggest trying it and seeing how effective you think it is. If you have done it several times and still feel it is over the top, then feed it back to the developers with the evidence.

I think you underestimate the possibility of destroying any model of your choice. Just try and see how powerful it is)

7 minutes ago, Scoffer said:

10 damage from a single duel without any damage flip is a trouble too. I've heared people call such stuff NPE.

Let’s play with me, show me that combo) I really want to start playing Hamelin) If it will be no nerfs I will change my fraction for 2-3 tournaments)