Roadhouse

Z is definitely a master that requires you to be very familiar with everything on the table to get the most out of her. Its also easy to get stuck in "Stat 7 Obey is always the best option" when she also has Hex with 2 very useful triggers.

Z is a very strong second master due to the utility she brings. She can funnel AP through whatever model needs it and she refills your hand. If you're going the AP funnel route you only need 7s too so she only competes for severes if you want to offensively Obey.

4 hours ago, 74legion said:

Rebalancing is to raise its price to 10 and remove versatile .

And this is a breakdown.

Thats a bigger nerf than what they did.

She was better than very good. She was imbalanced. Def 6, can't be charged, 12wd model, that could potentially heal a single target 6 with a bonus action, had a Stat 6 2" 2/4/6, and a FF Arm ignoring gun with one of the strongest disruptive triggers in the game, Hole in the World. For 8ss.

She lost a Def, 2wds, and has to target a different thing with her bonus trigger but now her attack stays stat 6 and can heal. Her healing potential actually went up and she still has a ridiculous gun.

The nigh invulnerability and ease of her single target healing got nerfed *becuase they needed to be*

The damage of her melee was nerfed while its utility was buffed.

The fact that some players are saying her changes spell the end of Neverborn are indicative of their over reliance on her *becuase she was too good*

I've played her in GG2, she is still very strong.

7 hours ago, Nagi21 said:

The main issue I don't see people running Marcus in NVB aside from it being a better ARC crew, is that it plays so very similar to Zoraida, and Zoraida is better by a loooooong barrel.

I'd say Marcus is different enough. Z's outright strength though does rain on NVB's weaker masters' parades though.

Cache kitties don't happen with NVB Marcus and that makes a world of difference. Not being able to stone for Onslaught means having to pitch an upgrade for it, and without the defensive upgrades they die.

NVB Marcus runs a more schemey crew using Adze, Bandersnatch, and Wisps. It is a very different playstyle but so so fun.

On 4/26/2021 at 10:30 AM, SEV said:

@Ogid I totally agree she's worst than before... But she was OP before.

I applauded to her rebalance specifically  because it makes her worst but still playable (and keep her even more relevant in keyword).

This 100%. She needed to be toned down. She is still playable and in keyword is the best way to play her, as it should be.

People also need to realize that of the models that got touched, Serena got a rebalance, most got outright nerfed. Yan Lo, Schtook, Leve, Somer: they all got a firm shove down in power level. 

Does taking the suit off Necropunk Leap open up new list building options or table strategies? Lol no

How bout an attack that can be Mimic'd that draws LoS through friendly models and has dope triggers? Yes, this is very cool, this is worth exploring.

It also only heals Feed on Fear models, is Stat 5, requires engagement instead of 3" and is rng 8. If you Horrificing through Teddy it's 8"+50mm+1". 

There's alot of potential there, imo, its just going to take figuring out lists.

2" 2/4/6 was a bit strange on a model that was such a good healer. 

And yea, she'll totally see the table, just requires a bit more thought than it once did outside of the Nightmare keyword.

22 minutes ago, santaclaws01 said:

So you switched from neverborn because you think they only have 1 viable keyword(which is so demonstrably false it's just willful ignorance at this point)

...to outcasts?

Haven't you seen the Talos buff?

The amount of whining I've seen about Serena is pretty ridiculous. She was severely overtuned before and now she is at a point where you take her when she is needed, instead of crutching on her.

Now that's out of the way let's turn our attention to the new possibilities that come out of Horrific Reality. 

Previously, being able to take the melee out of a friendly Nightmare was a front of card ability that also lowered the stat. Now it is part of the new action that has 2 very powerful triggers and keeps it stat 6.

My Loyal Servant means Serena has more healing potential than she did previously. SHE CAN HEAL MORE THAN SHE USED TO. If you've got the Rams you're looking at 2 more heal flips. Can't get to within 3" of the thing needing healing? Well if its a nightmare just punch through him to heal him.

Pulled Here and There is less straightforward but also very powerful. Being able to move your opponents stuff around, like off a Leyline or Symbol of Authority, or having additional movement to get Serena with 3" for Painkillers can be huge. There are alot of applications that only time on the table can demonstrate how good this is.

Instead of focusing on the nerfed aspects, look at all the changes as a whole. I wouldn't even call it a nerf, I think its more of a rebalance and I believe her application on the table is going to change dramatically.

The sauce: MIMIC CAN COPY HORRIFIC REALITY AND DRAW RANGE AND LOS THROUGH NIGHTMARES BECUASE ITS PART OF THE ACTION NOW.

Mimic'd Reality (Neverborn)
Size: 50 - Pool: 6
Leader:
  Lucius Mattheson
Totem(s):
  The Scribe
Hires:
  Serena Bowman
  Teddy
  Doppleganger
  Agent 46
  Guild Lawyer
    Ancient Pact
 

Forget what was and imagine what can be.

6 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

Depends on how good you are at the ol' Bayou Two Card.

I like the idea of Wicked Dolls making schemes for the sow to summon off of lol

Spawn mother converts to killing much better, IMO than the Sow. Stat 6 vs 5, Severe 6 vs 5 and the really, really big one 1" over 0". How bad 0" melee is cannot be understated, and the possibility that you have to end your activation on a Tome negates the amazing Grit ability, IMO. It should also be pointed out that the Sow is only suitless if you spend another AP on it while Spawn Mother's is a bonus.

NVB Z cant take the Sow lol

IR on Spawn Mother shouldn't be over looked. The ability to charge through models to smack something when they kill one of your guys is huge. Severe 6 is also no joke, especially on a model that can stone for Puncture.

Not a Juju fan at all. Would much rather funnel AP through Emissary in NVB.

Franc Toss (Bayou)
Size: 50 - Pool: 10
Leader:
  Zoraida
Hires:
  Gautraeux Bokor
  Gautraeux Bokor 2
  Lucky Effigy
    Effigy of Fate
  Alphonse LeBlanc
    Two Gremlins in a Ghillie Suit
  Francois LaCroix
References:
  Voodoo Doll
  Wanga Mojo Curse

So this was my thought for a Z Bayou list. You can give Alphonse a huge stack of Glowy T1, give Franc fast and a walk with Burn Out Obey, then have Alphonse yeet him up the table. Franc is an absolute murder machine and being 15" from where he started and Fast is quite the threat, then he's backed up by Alphonse with 6 Glowy. 

Z has lots of options because she enables a ton of stuff by multiplying AP. 

5 hours ago, extremor said:

Well if I‘m not mistaken you need 3x  of wich one has to be 9(+) because you need the blood sacrifice trigger twice, right? But yes this synergies are awesome and you get a huge benefit from this. Bokor are nuts. 

Wicked Doll giving the Bokors Adversary goes a long way there

Bayou vs NVB hands down goes to NVB. This is from several nested synergies.

Voodoo scrap gets turned into a Stitched by Vasilisa(requires 9Mask)

Vasilisa can make a BBS grow on T1

Black Blood, from BBS, takes Bokors to the next level

Bokors with Fast and tons of Glowy draw lots of cards (>=9Mask being the key).

With the above youre pulsing Focus twice, replacing for a 4ss gain, and summoning a 6ss, likely undercosted, model and that doesn't cover what else Vasi or the Bokor do the rest of the game. Z allows for an amazing engine in NVB that doesn't have a parallel in Bayou

In Dreamer he competes with Teddy, IMO, and in that there is no competition, Teddy is a hoss. Carver has a niche though. He has Ruthless which is only on one other NVB model (Titania and Luci can both access out of faction keyword models with Ruthless though), and anti Focus stack. He's probably worth it VS Daw and Hamelin, probably not in any other match ups.

Model is lit though.

Nah nah, I like the all dual faction box

8 minutes ago, touchdown said:

The Bayou starter box has a swampfiend model in it, so I don't think they're shying away from "complex" crews for the boxes. Also maybe evidence they're favoring dual faction keywords if you're looking for that. In neverborn (and removing swampfiend since it's in the bayou box) that could mean Elite/Mimic, Chimera, Nephilim and Qi and Gong? The last option would be funny.

And we know the Outcast box is all Syndicate so even another option is a hench that doesn't have any current Neverborn keywords.

So Puppet, Chimera, Mimic... and Neph? Barbaros is Outcast after all

IDK that I would call Neph or Woe popular, Nightmare and Fae certainly are as they're top 3 of NVB. Nightmare is already large in the faction and Fae got Rex from EXS release. Neph is missing a second hench and has no enforcers so I could see it.

They could buff Luci via dope ass starter Mimic models

I think more Mimic would be cool. Right now we just have Dopple and Changelings. A NVB Mimic hench would be an interesting design space to explore

There's alot that makes 0" melee bad.

Can't control an area to prevent interacts.

Lose an AP to fight the thing that is engaging you already.

Extremely limits charge angles(this is the biggest one IMO). Guy is just around the corner of some impassable? No charge. Another model? No charge. Base to base is almost as bad as having to go directly towards and to keep viable charge lanes you can't take advantage of cover or your own models to stop their charge in the event you need to activate the 0" melee guy first. Go into vassal and set up a couple models to see how big of a difference in possible charge lanes there are between 1" and 0" melee