RuneGrey

I'm looking to get back into Malifaux now that more of the older models are supported, but I'm unable to find any of the first wave of Arsenel decks to update my old models. I was wondering if someone knew where to get any of them?

I gotta say, I've not been terribly thrilled with this new edition. Just too much shakeup, and generally not seeing everything in the beta thus far has been really discouraging. The feeling of 'you can't use most of your collection' isn't a good one, and it basically feels like to keep playing with the current rules that I'm going to have to fork out a good chunk of change sight unseen for what's actually going to end up in the final product... ...and I still won't be able to use any of the Avatars or later book models that I've purchased. The big reason the other tabletop betas I've seen worked out were that we got to see everything at once, and you roughly knew what was coming when the final product was released. I've not seen the rules since the early june release, and with a new computer I don't even have access to them any longer. It's just discouraging, and I wonder if I'll just get better utility selling my stuff at this point.

A good lure chain will blow out your hand in very short order - even 7 cards can go by the wayside within a few bad flips. Leltu's damage doesn't need to be cheated that much once you get someone below half health, but you still need to get them down to that point. The real question is how much can you cuddle Nekima until you need to start bumping points off of her cost. There's about six or seven different things she contributes to a lot of lists that people dislike or complain about, but you're also paying for each and every one of those advantages. 13 SS is still a LOT to drop, and you can easily swarm a list using Nekima - Lelu - Liltu without much trouble. If that swarming works - that depends. Dropping cuddles on all 3 of those models at once would probably end up being a bit much, and would just push grow lists a bit harder than they are already, I suspect.

My biggest complaint, especially for the Sewers set, is the lack of walls available in the set. I can see why they said that the promo shots needed to use 2 boxes - the 'extra parts' are all the walls to help bound things in and make them look really good. I've seen a few setups that I think might be a better use of space, so I expect that the layouts will improve as time passes, but still. MORE WALLS. Booster packs with individual sheets would be really cool.

Indeed. Primordial Magic is pretty brute force, but doesn't do much for you outside of giving you an extra card. The Cherub on the other hand is a nasty little biter who can harass the enemy and shut down a unit or two each turn without much trouble. The extra CB loss from Love makes Lilith almost unhittable, and the ability to just outright shut down a low WP model shouldn't be underestimated Personally, I'd get both if you plan on running Pandora at all - the option to run both PM and Cherub in a Brawl is very nice.

And we people have said in the past - dead does not mean out in this game. If you're just playing Guild, Dreamer, or one of the Masters who relies on heavy alpha strikes to get the job done, then generally yes you can cripple their force by removing models from it. Other Masters actually expand their options by losing models, as counters are much, much more usable in this game than in Warmachine (or 40k, but they barely even exist in 40k) due to the fact that they persist in the game world, and are not 'claim at generation or lose em'. Claiming that dead models don't counterattack is focusing on an offensive way of thinking that assumes the best option is not to leave anything standing to oppose you. This doesn't always work - take a good summoner Master or a Lilith grow list and hitting the non-essential parts of the list (the stuff you'd need to engage first to reach the essential parts further in) means that you're giving your opponent an advantage in soul stones and resources. Heck, look at Pandora, who is considered a powerhouse model. And this is mainly due to the fact that fighting Pandora is counter productive - you're more likely to have taken damage from than she is. Or wipe out all of Hoffman's crew but he and watch a bunch of your own vanish in a giant scrap explosion. Dreamer's real strength is not necessarily his alpha strike (which is good) but the fact that his mobility and place effects allow him to access the key parts of your opponent's crew who are behind their front line.

We also need to see what Lilith's Manifestation clock looks like as well. It could be that she's able to manifest faster than Sonnia can, once she's hit a requirement, or she may even be able to do it without a requirement late in the game. Remember, they'd not put the 0 requirement in if they didn't plan to use it - I expect that it will actually be Pandora of all our casters who has a 0 requirement automatic manifestation... and may actually want to burn soul stones to put off an auto-manifest if she's not in a good position for it. So lets learn more. Really looking forward to Twisting Fates coming in next week.

Sounds like we're going to be seeing more Waldgeists showing up with Lilith now. The possibility of a large piece of forest terrain becoming horrific death on the field for enemy models inside of it is a nice one. The nature of Malifaux itself coming alive to kill the enemy is a nice image for Avatar Lilith. Especially when you think you can play it safe and keep away from them, only to have the foliage come to you instead. Sweetness.

There's a number of situations where killing enemy models can give your enemy an advantage. Killing a terror tot for instance might end up giving one of their models with Blood Sense the last counter they need to create a mature Nephelim. So you just killed a 3 soulstone model and your opponent upgraded to a 10 soulstone model instead. In practical terms, he traded a weaker model to create a stronger one. Any master that uses grow upgrades or summoning can turn an offensive assault into a disadvantage by using the resources created by your attacks into stronger creatures that were not on the field before. While you can say that generally they are operating at a loss, recklessly attacking in hopes of eliminating enemy models is not always the best option. Which says a lot given that its virtually always the best option in a lot of other systems. A dead model in most games is dead, and few models in Warmachine or Warhammer benefit from friendly models dying nearby. In Malifaux, a model may be dead, but it provides blood, corpses, or scrap for other models to use when it goes down. For some masters, the loss of a minion is a blow. To others, it simply opens up other options via summoning or evolution.

Alright, I'll toss another one in. Thank you for the responses, everyone!

Well, I'm new to the game and have recently been picking up a few pieces to get started in our new local league for Malifaux (10 players so far and counting!). I picked up the Lilith starter box, and... sadly did not get Lilith with it. I got a Lilitu instead. Well, I figured I'd want one of these later, so I went ahead and just ordered another Lilith blister so I have all the models for the starter and could get started in the league. But I've yet to receive any word back from Wyrd about the mispack, and it's been over a week at this point. I'd like to get the proper card for the Lilitu model, but the shipping cost is pretty crippling for a 50 cent card - is there anyplace else I might be able to snag a card for this model, or is it best to just wait for Wyrd to get back to me?