This came up again, so I thought I'd ask. My local henchman informed me how this should work and even pointed me to the right place in the FAQ, but until I have a thread to this effect and perhaps more evidence, it isn't flying with my other gaming groups:
So, my question is based on the Writhing Mass ability that Malifaux Rats have.
(0) Writhing Mass says the rat suffers 1 WD and moves into base contact with another rat within 5 inches. Fair enough. Rats have 2 wounds, so I figured this would be a one-time thing and then the rat can't do it any more unless it somehow healed.
But I've played opponents - more than one now - who informed me that because of the errata, Hamelin's rats cannot die on a friendly activation (to prevent endless activating). This would therefore mean the rats could use Writhing Mass endlessly while at 1 wd without ever dying. They referred to, from the FAQ:
Can a model kill or sacrifice itself?
Yes. Unless the Talent/Spell causes a fixed number of wounds and those wounds would drop the model to 0 Wounds
Now, according to the FAQ a model CANNOT do this thing. To me that means "performing the writhing mass action while you have 1 WD left would be an illegal action and therefore rats cannot perform an action that causes a fixed amount of wounds, if doing so would leave them at 0".
The other aspect is, the opposing players have informed me that the Just Rats ability would mean they couldn't die this way since Hamelin would resummon rats and the errata was made to counteract this, specifically: They're Just Rats, which says the model cannot die during a friendly model's activation. However, They're Just Rats says that a model CAN die during its own activation and just doesn't make any rats if it does.
Which of the following is correct?
A) Rats can perform Writhing Mass with 1 WD left, and cannot die as a result.
Rats can perform Writhing Mass with 1 WD left but would die as a result.
C) Rats cannot perform Writhing Mass when they have 1 WD left.
And:
A) Rats can die during their own activations and will not result in another rat being summoned.
or Rats cannot die during their own activation.
I think part of my opponent's confusions have come in when they did the Swarm-activation of the rats and didn't realize they still have to complete each activation in turn (so rat A has a whole activation which must be completed including his walk and writhing mass, then B has a whole activation, they just all happen in a row).
If anyone can clearly answer these, references to errata or past topics on this particular issue, especially the inability or ability to do Writhing Mass with 1 WD left, would be helpful. I was unable to find them other than that one reference in the errata.
Question
Mmacneil
This came up again, so I thought I'd ask. My local henchman informed me how this should work and even pointed me to the right place in the FAQ, but until I have a thread to this effect and perhaps more evidence, it isn't flying with my other gaming groups:
So, my question is based on the Writhing Mass ability that Malifaux Rats have.
(0) Writhing Mass says the rat suffers 1 WD and moves into base contact with another rat within 5 inches. Fair enough. Rats have 2 wounds, so I figured this would be a one-time thing and then the rat can't do it any more unless it somehow healed.
But I've played opponents - more than one now - who informed me that because of the errata, Hamelin's rats cannot die on a friendly activation (to prevent endless activating). This would therefore mean the rats could use Writhing Mass endlessly while at 1 wd without ever dying. They referred to, from the FAQ:
Can a model kill or sacrifice itself?
Yes. Unless the Talent/Spell causes a fixed number of wounds and those wounds would drop the model to 0 Wounds
Now, according to the FAQ a model CANNOT do this thing. To me that means "performing the writhing mass action while you have 1 WD left would be an illegal action and therefore rats cannot perform an action that causes a fixed amount of wounds, if doing so would leave them at 0".
The other aspect is, the opposing players have informed me that the Just Rats ability would mean they couldn't die this way since Hamelin would resummon rats and the errata was made to counteract this, specifically: They're Just Rats, which says the model cannot die during a friendly model's activation. However, They're Just Rats says that a model CAN die during its own activation and just doesn't make any rats if it does.
Which of the following is correct?
A) Rats can perform Writhing Mass with 1 WD left, and cannot die as a result.
Rats can perform Writhing Mass with 1 WD left but would die as a result.
C) Rats cannot perform Writhing Mass when they have 1 WD left.
And:
A) Rats can die during their own activations and will not result in another rat being summoned.
or Rats cannot die during their own activation.
I think part of my opponent's confusions have come in when they did the Swarm-activation of the rats and didn't realize they still have to complete each activation in turn (so rat A has a whole activation which must be completed including his walk and writhing mass, then B has a whole activation, they just all happen in a row).
If anyone can clearly answer these, references to errata or past topics on this particular issue, especially the inability or ability to do Writhing Mass with 1 WD left, would be helpful. I was unable to find them other than that one reference in the errata.
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