Sunspotter

I've heard someone call that methodology in making a feature "hydraulic" so now all I can think of is a Hydraulic eye, and I'm giggling like crazy It can definitely happen. a certain Mr. Langston has one, so It by all means has prescience in the Malifaux universe. I'll be looking over some lore and stat cards to see if there's any kind of construct vision similarities that I can pick up on. I have a dumb little thread in on the fated creations (Giant robot fists for non-robots) board that I occasionally update with my augment homebrew, and I actually have to thank you. I've only really been focusing on arms really, this has reminded me to focus on some other stuff, eyes included. I'll probably have about two eye augments if you'd want to use them in my next post. as a side note, I would like to mention in googling this, I figured out Howard Langston shares a name with the MC of a certain Christmas themed Arnold Schwarzenegger star vehicle. I'd be inclined to say it's coincidence, but I know it's not. as I've said to my friends, Everything in Malifaux is a reference, even if you don't realize it. I'd bet you anything the M&SU has the market cornered on turboman dolls I'd end with my regular catchphrase, but It feels out of place between a fated losing an eye and my Jingle all the way themed revelation. if whoever named HL happens to read this or become notified thereof, my only question is why.

I assume for this you're talking about both limb "enlargements" as far as hindrance, that's primarily what the grace checks are for (which I'm considering alternate penalties for, negative flips to grace all the time seems a tad harsh though) . while the weight would be an issue in a more realistic sense, from what I've seen so would the weight from more standard pneumatic limbs, along the same parameters. i'd assume some degree of bracing would be added to prevent spinal problems, though I'd imagine they'd pop up over the course of years/decades, not the relatively short "Career" of most melee fated I've seen. as far as hindrance during a potential fight, the primary issue would be maintaining proper balance with the upwards shift in momentum, though that would become muscle memory in due time. once they've adapted to balance, the system of enlarged limbs would be powerful enough to propel themselves as swiftly as a normal limb would, so similar motions would still be possible. otherwise, I have a few ideas for prostetics/augments lined up that would come to think of it, address the issue to a degree. they'll probably end up in a near-future post

Hey, I hope the thread hasn't gotten too off-topic for such, but I had a few ideas for custom weapon enhancements, Price unknown, (I'll try to extrapolate) but for now, they're formative Venomous (~17?) hidden flutes or concealed chambers meant to hold liquid can hold any number of deadly toxins to bring down an opponent Option 1: When this weapon deals damage, the target gains the following condition: Poison +1 Option 2:This weapon gains the following trigger; Serpent's Bite: after succeeding an attack, For each in the final duel total, the enemy gains the following condition: Poison +1 This is clearly a black market upgrade, possibly even "Faction Specific" insofar as such a weapon might be a closely kept secret of the Ten Thunders, and they might now want it getting out. Not sure how much of a balancing factor it would be, but I was possibly thinking of the poison being a (1) tactical action to re-apply in battle, with other posibilities of poisions coming to mind, like knockout serums or hallucinogenics Duelist's(~20) This weapon, being made both light and strong by alloys and specialized forging may not have the striking force of some weapons of it's type, but it's balance is beyond compare This Weapon's damage reduced by -0/-0/-1, and the MI value of any attacks made with this weapon are increased by +1 This is about half of the weapon that Immediately sprung to mind when I read through the earlier discussion on rapiers. their primary advantage (as long as I've worked with them) his been that their design allows for quicker manipulation. in certain cases, a small nudge in a certain direction can allow strikes that would have otherwise been parried to hit their intended target (Another reason this was made is because it slightly irked me that Lady J's O-datchi was almost entirely correct save for the fact that being what would assuredly be a folded steel sword, it was missing 1 severe damage. however, while this one weapon suggests a near perfect replica mechanically, it also suggests Lady J's native MI is 6, which might be even more offensive) Piercing(~12) This weapon has been specially forged to taper down to a point, and to keep that point no matter what resistance may come. in doing so, this weapon excels at finding the gaps in otherwise implacable defenses when this weapon deals moderate or severe damage with a attack, that damage ignores Armor This of course being the other half of that formula. A glancing (weak damage) blow from a rapier/Epee really doesn't have a habit of piercing from what I've seen, it's generally good hits that pierce armor. this could also represent weapons like war picks, pikes, or Stiletto daggers. Melee is specified because such weapons tend to have vastly less armor piercing qualities when thrown (Though if anyone can find/produce a video of them throwing a war pick or pike, feel free to post it and I'll totally rescind that part of the idea) Incinerating(~25) through means as simple as being wrapped in an oil soaked rag, to a complex pump system that ferries fuel the length of the blade, to enchantments in some rare cases, this weapon has a habit of setting things ablaze whenever it hits home this weapon has a 3Sc per month upkeep cost to be able to activate. When activated, this weapon will burn for a total time of Two minutes [length?] on one pint of fuel (specialty, sold 1Sc/Gallon at Chemist's, specialty colored fuel can be ordered at a higher price) and will cast light as a torch, as well as the ability to be used as a torch for the purpose of lighting fires. when active, This weapon gains the following Trigger; Light them Up: For each in the final duel total, after damaging, the target gains the following condition: Burning +1 Another Probably black market weapon. One thing I've been slightly apprehensive to do so far with these weapons is reduce the amount of base damage the weapon deals. partially, this is because of the situation with Critical strike and specialized, that allows the addition of free extra damage to weapons. granted it may cost talents, but it still very much adds to the minimum damage on the track unless fighting an enemy with counterspell. while this does negate a needed talent, it also requires some degree of financial investment. the other is with the question of employing triggers in TtB. Arguably, it's combat is both similar and different to Malifaux's combat in ways that really bring out the individual side of combat, and the choices such a situation belies, personally, to me, that is the difference between this upgrade and the poison one presented above. for this one, sometimes the key in combat is knowing when to light up and ​lay down some righteous fury. the fact that your sword is covered in a weird substance? debatable. the fact that your sword looks like something out of a mad scientist's workshop? also debatable. nobody is going to buy the mass hysteria causing your sword to look like it was on fire angle, because no less than fifteen people saw it, five of them lit on fire (and if I remembered my Malifaux wording right, this weapon can apply the condition in swathes, while the poison one is single target) Serrated Blades (~9) Often times, the creatures of malifaux can seem to have a flesh absolutely resistant to any kind of damage. if you want a weapon that can tear through pesky zombies as efficiently as it would a freshly hunted hog, grab a weapon that puts the "Rip" back into "Rip and Tear" This weapon gains the following trigger Rending blow: this model ignores hard to wound This weapon I have a degree of difficulty on. this is one of the few I believe really needs a trigger to balance out ignoring HtW, but I'm not 100% on what exactly that trigger should be, or how it should be implemented. Also having a difficult time deciding whether or not this would be a black market weapon, seeing as while it would cause major damage to humans, it could also hold utility purposes (serrated knives are a thing after all) and even still, the guild would probably see a citizen seeking a solution of his own to a local zombie problem as both a lucrative customer, and a potential end to a problem they didn't want to deal with.

Alright, I've been sketching out some of the thoughts on the custom limb upgrades, and wanted to submit them for some public veiwership; As a Key; Denotes something sold and officially licensed by the Guild, and licensed for sale Denotes a guild issued upgrade, but not something usually sold on the open market Denotes an Quasi-legal upgrade that can be argued for either way (after all, it might not be in the guild catalogue, but it's been seen in the guild before) Denotes an upgrade that's Union backed, and while it may get you harassed, actual legal repercussions will be few and far-between Denotes a wild invention, possibly a very unique one. reactions to the item will be unpredictable Denotes an upgrade that's Nigh-unquestionably illegal, and would need to be hidden or remian unused, unless you want to be slapped with amalgamation charges Denotes an aftermarket alteration to the part Augment: Combat Ready Limb(20Sc): With Sufficient training, this particular piece of prosthesis was built specifically to REPLICATE the muscle structure of the HUMAN ANATOMY along with re-enforced joints and striking surfaces, allowing prize fighting victims of unfortunate dismemberment to hop BACK IN THE RING in as little as TWO WEEKS! This upgrade treats this augment as a Weapon, but allows the user to use their original Martial Arts or Pugilism skill, as long as they Have 1 rank in Pneumatics. Further augmentations are allowed, but require the user to have an additional rank in Pneumatics for each successive upgrade Knuckle Plating: +10Sc (Gives the limb the Handload special rule [as if using brass knuckles] Giving a to the Damage flip) Augment: Enlarged Limb(30Sc): Need that Extra Oomph lifting palates, moving mine-carts or tossing gremlins? Then an enlarged limb is for you! CARRY the WEIGHT OF THE WORLD on your shoulders with our revolutionary design, with more room for the things YOU need on the job! This upgrade gives an additional Augmentation to the limb, and does not count towards the total number of augmentation on a limb. in addition, this limb gives on grace checks unless properly balanced by some method. Combat Integration +20 Sc, Requires Combat Ready Limb Augmentation (Gives +1/+1/+2 damage to all attacks made with the fist, as if it were effected by the Enlarged weapon enhancement, and were wielded by two hands) Augment: Second-Stage Pneumatics (35 Sc) Don't worry Union member! Your damaged form need not stay idle and away from the mines, with a bit of extra scrip, you can get a better pair! the earth is like loose sand before your mighty hands, and with our very own pressure regulation system, you'll be the one to make sure the next cart full of soulstones is a FULL one! This upgrade gives a to all non-attack might flips, Including during Dramatic Time. Streamlined Integration 0Sc, Requires Combat Ready Limb Augmentation (This model gains to it's damage flip from fist attacks, as if it had the pneumatic weapon characteristic) Re-enforced Joints +20Sc, (This model Gains a on it's attack flip with a weapon, Weapon may break or shatter if not custom made to be weilded as such) Augment: Pneumatic Hammer (20 Sc) The union has your back when it comes to your employment! After all, why carry bulky equipment like a rail hammer or pick when you can simply use your newly acquired prosthesis? just a quick flip from the hand and presto, you're on the job with all the tools you need! YOU! This model extends it's unarmed by one yard. in addition this limb may be used in substitution for a Rail Hammer or Pickaxe. Gift from the Steamworkers (Special, must know the worker making the limb) (The limb becomes illegal if modifications are noticed or otherwise rectified. User gains 0/0/+1 to damage, and to the damage flip as if effected by the folded steel weapon modification) Augment: Knuckledraggers (25 Sc) we both know why you're here. they don't make'em like this anymore. after all, this baby is a symbol of power, and while it's a part of ya, Ain't nobody gonna mess with you. This model extends it's reach, range, and the range of all weapons it weilds by 1 yard. This upgrade gives an additional Augmentation to the limb, and does not count towards the total number of augmentation on a limb. in addition, this limb gives on grace checks unless properly balanced by some method. activities with the modified limb become awkward until sufficiently retrained. This modification will immediately attract the eye and ire of guild authorities if noticed. Augment: Tax Stamp (100 Sc) Hmm... I can make it happen The limb is inspected (sometimes with little regard to the protcol of passing, though such discression may cost extra), and given the full endorsement of the guild with a visible stamp of approval. said stamp may be renewed in visibility or re-applied for a 1Sc charge. this augment does not count towards the total number of augments for the limb And there we go. more is sure to come (once I get some rest of course) but for now, here are my initial thoughts on what can be done to add more options to the limbs of malifaux. on the off chance someone has an idea and would for what ever reason want me to stat said idea, post it and I'll give it my best shot Until then, may all your craziest metal dreams come true.

the giant steam hammer thing got me thinking about something, and that is that it seems like there isn't anything in the book to represent the rail worker's very particular replacement limbs, granted, that's probably something forthcoming, but that also made me realize something. TTB doesn't seem to have much as far as the damage of work tools (save for the rail hammer) which I find a tad odd seeing as a TTB campaign going through the mines/coming across a rail team seems like a DnD campaign going through the city sewers. not technically required, it's just one of those in setting things it feels like you can set your watch by. But yeah, Pretty soon, I'm gonna start posting some of my homebrew content, Feel free to use it in your campaign if you enjoy it, but yeah, it'll probably be some mixture of various ways to turn your fated's lemon of a dismemberment into the sweet lemonade of an awesome prostesis

Hey, thanks for the input AD1! I really haven't been in full campaign mode for TTB yet, so I can't especially say what my FM's judgement would be/What my judgement would be as an FM would be for all this, as this falls in the realm between rules question and home-brew opportunity. I do understand what you're saying in all reality. Fist isn't listed as a custom on the weapons chart, therefore as per the book, everything would have to be done through modifying the limb as just that, a limb. i totally get the rules citation to, I'd agree on the skill check, though I believe I'd be correct in stating that the damage track on a pugilism attack would be based on what rank of pugilism the fated has, not the lowest rank in the skill check. In a scenario where the FM allows one add-on per custom weapon, I admit, pneumatic would be a confusing option, however I believe it's costed as it is because it becomes a very powerful upgrade in concert with other upgrades. I do admit however your take on pneumatic as a standalone is very interesting. I've been considering dipping my toes into the stabby bits thread for a little while now, and the 1 enhancement method has given me an interesting litmus test for custom upgrade ideas, as to whether or not I'd ever want to take the upgrade as a stand alone. However, for the time being, I've decided to sit around in this little thread. In that regard I'll compare myself to a certain Albus, for now, I believe my rantings on combining steel and flesh deserve some degree of containment. But since you're still here an reading this, then I bid you Welcome back to the horror show. to get a tad metagame heavy for a moment, my core belief in the whole "augmented fist" deal originates with a certain quandary from dungeons and dragons known as the "Monastic Fist" debate. to make a long story short, A monk's fists were counted as weapons for attacks, so many believed they should be, like almost all other weapons, enchantable. however, proponents of the opposite side believed that since they were made of flesh and blood and were very much attached to the monk, they shouldn't be able to be counted for the sake of enchantment. it was hard to pin down which side was the majority beleif, but not which side won out, with the enchantability of fists being explicitly stated as something possible in earlier additions, and the addition of Ki focuses conferring their enchantment bonus to said unarmed attacks in later editions. So, This, to a degree, is the impetus, that the augmented fist mirrors the monastic fist in enough regard that it be granted enough of an exception to be granted upgrades like a weapon, partially because they are easily explained as experimental limbs fluff wise, and because it makes very entertaining numbers in the crunch. Now first, I'd like to address some unintended consequences when it comes to my whole extrapolation exercise of treating the forearm like a weapon for the sake of the enlarged characteristic. yes, using that model, it would be possible to postulate using pneumatics, a great-sword could be attached in place of the forearm. or any other custom weapon that would take two hands to normally wield. my response? Go for it. Do it. I'm serious, feel free to use that method to physically attach a Zweihander to your artificial elbow, it may be lighter than the artificial forearm by some possibility. the detriments of such an action? well I'm glad you asked because YOUR FOREARM NOW ENDS IN A SWORD! I really, really pray you had the foresight to cancel all non Sword-arm based activity you had scheduled. there's an old hippie slogan about not being able to hold your children with nuclear arms. you will find having a No-datchi replacing your ulna and radius to have a similar effect on the quality of your social life. you think the hydraulics were nickname magnets? you now have a giant sword for an arm. I'm pretty sure if you're name hasn't been truncated to sword-arm by session's end, your group is arguably being merciful Otherwise, I'd like to talk about the other, more entertaining option, which to me is the possible use of the military brace's ability to hide certain things, and how that can be interpreted within the context of malifaux. moreso, I'd like to talk about hiding practically any non gun weapon, not just in the brace, but as part of the brace. now, when it comes to these weapons, they'd probably have the concealable trait considered they're inside an arm. otherwise, I feel the ideas for additive arm weapons to be a field worth exploration. A whip is simple, it could be flexible, braided metallic cable hidden inside the arm, usually used for lowering down from a high point, but during combat, it can be manipulated by a user's skill with the whip. I'd personally argue that the deployment of any flat, light blade could be done easily through a wrist joint, if not it's mounting housed there. it could take some getting used to, but the rigidity and inability to be traditionally disarmed could be seen as a benefit for some, with additional possibilities sourcing from bells an whistles like a spring loaded or pneumatic housing capable of extending the weapon with sufficient force, or even the possibility of a double faced housing, allowing the blade to deploy at the elbow joint for a unique combat style, possibly ideal for martial arts like muay thai. I'd continue further, but unfortunately, it's not 9 am early for me, it's 9 am late. more is sure to come. Until later, May your craziest metal dreams come true.

This is one of the things that always interested me about Malifaux's setting, the nature of pneumatics is very sparsely explored (hence why i'm so ridiculously excited for the rumors I've heard about through the steam, it'll probably have some more concrete assertions) despite being ridiculously interesting. I can see what you're talking about with the whole "Needs 2 hands" thing for enlarged, that's why this is even a question in the first place, because pneumatics/hydraulics would assuredly have the strength to move such beasts as they've moved much larger (my case begins and ends with the rail golem) and in the case of FMing, I'd almost assuredly assign a movement penalty due to the weight of the whole apparatus. I'd also think it'd need a bit more internal power, but more on that later. Nice point on the military grade equipment for knuckle dusters, I hadn't even thought of that, but you're right, any artificial limb specifically meant to be used to punch at one point or another would almost assuredly have the specific reinforcements to do exactly that, I could even see the "containment" for knuckle dusters simply being the fact that the limb has heavily contained and armored joints meant to take repeated impact. For folded steel, this is going to be one of those things where I'd argue it'd not so much be for the weapon, but rather for the hydraulics/pneumatics that operate the limbs. high quality materials mean that they can, in all probability handle greater pressure/more stress than your average limb, a high carbon/stainless/living/properly tempered steel could easily give the limb the stability it would need to connect with the extra oomph in melee deserving of the extra +1 severe and to damage plus, if i were to make a more controversial observation, folded steel is practically Wyrd pointing and giggling at the semi-classic "Folded over 1000 times" copypasta, it kinda boils down to "magic eastern wizard-blacksmithing" as to why the weapons are better than say other famous forging techniques like Damascus steel, something I, if FMing would also grant the folded steel bonus. in essence, I see the additive as "better metal makes weapon better at it's job" so for blunt weapons like hammers, it could be something like hardened plating around a dense, heavy core. (as a quick aside, yes, I was speaking of specialized when adding the to the flip) Now for the enlarged part, and my personal take on the theory behind this mess. When it comes to two hands, I believe it could be interpreted as 2 points of contact needed to stabalize the weapon to the point where it can be used efficiently. in the case of an enlarged pneumatic arm, arguably, the forearm is the weapon portion. [WARNING, INBOUND PSEUDOSCIENCE/THEORY. TAKE WITH 1-2 BOLIVIAN SALT MINES] Now, let's work from there, looking at the human arm. the elbow is the joint of the arm, so in this case, and it is a simple joint, it's flexibility easily represented by a lever joint. now, levers aren't magic, and the joint in and of itself would simply flop around if not powered. in the case of most pneumatic limbs in Malifaux, one source of actuation is more than enough. it can pressurize for extension, and flexes when de-pressurized. this is a simple joint noticeable in multiple places, and would be the least obtrusive for the sake of an artificial limb. however, that model loses a lot of efficiency when scaled up, due to the fact that more weight=more pressure needed to move said weight. that's why in this case, analysis of the human arm will aid in the final product. when it comes to moving the arm, there are two groups that makes the whole operation go. to flex the arm, you use the bicep and flexors, and to extend, you use the tricep and extensors. two muscle groups work together to help control the arm in 3D space, so it would make sense for a mechanical version of the arm to function on the same principle. let's say in this case, that the forearm is structured in such a way that it would extend slightly behind the elbow joint. to this point, the hydraulic representing the flexing group would attach, structured to sit flush to the arm when fully contracted and extended. the inside extension joint would do the same, allowing the same range of motion, albeit with a little bit sticking out for whatever extra mechanical components need to be hiding there. this model holds a very distinctive advantage over muscles, because they exert no force on the arm relaxing, only tensing. in the case of these drivers however, the pressure differentials can aid in the arm's movement in either direction. [Extra Warning. The following entry has passed the BAR exam at rules lawyer academy. Viewer discretion is advised] now what does all this mean in game mechanic terms? it means I'm about to become the worst person ever! Let's get specific by getting very general. one does not technically need hands to hold a weapon. if something (let's say for this example, a particularly mutated Fated) had a Claw, tentacle, prehensile foot, or multiple sufficiently strong prehensile tails, that weapon could, theoretically be held as long as those points are; A: Sufficiently dexterous to hold, or become attached to the weapon, and manipulate it as needed B: When used in concert, be capable of applying sufficient force to move the weapon as needed to properly use it. Our pistons are attached, and sufficiently dexterous to move the weapon in all needed dimensions. (foreward/backwards) fulfilling condition A. and between the two of them they can deliver the needed force to act on the weapon, fulfilling condition B. Ultimately these pistons would be the two "points of contact" needed to operate a heavy weapon. I think I just wrote enough in game legalese to make Lucius squeal with joy. If I get banned over the above, I 100% understand. I'll take a moment here to touch on two things mechanical, the first being the elbow joint itself; it's technically not needed. theoretically, this design is limited by the elbow joint, as it's omission could allow the forearm portion to contract and expand, offering additional mobility, or a tertiary joint to add a third dimension of motion. I would add those features to a construct, not a human. Not a human who just lost a limb, and will have a hard enough time adapting to his prosthetic. the one exception to this rule being a mad scientist styled character, who would probably spend their time positively freaking out about the possibilities. (but guys i can turn a wrench sideways...with my elbow) the other being a theoretically applicable, but very strange enhancement, that being the extended enhancement. I believe this falls into two distinct categories. First is the literal version, that the forearm is extended into a bizarre, orangutan-like shape. I personally find this almost totally inapplicable, because it would cause the recipient of the apparatus to look nearly inhuman in profile to an outside observer, along with a need for whomever received the artificial limbs to choose between literal knuckle dragging, or adapting a gait and mannerisms capable of keeping the hands off the ground. the other option that comes to mind would be more pneumatics, like a ram to extend the fist at the apex of the strike. This would cause a need for more complexity to be present in the arm, but would otherwise allow it to have an increased range when desired. (the real downside to this method is that if anyone at your gaming table has ever seen either BIG O or Accel World, prepare for OOC nicknames for your character.) This all leaves us with a real issue however. the methods for applying extra power is all there, but where does the power for such big fists come from? My primary thought in all of this has been a back mounted boiler apparatus, for multiple reasons. Primarily, it would help centralize the weight of the arms, but more importantly, it would give the arms a central point of attachment. Normally, these points would require a large area to keep it's attachment to the graftee's body consistent, and even then, if they were each isolated weights, it would put undue stress on the rib-cage. centralizing the apparatus allows the whole affair to be carried with not-too much dissimilarity from a heavy pack, and would keep balance over the spinal column, as in an unaltered human. This pack, being a boiler, would of course require several layers of heat and fireproof cloth for insulation (which would double as padding), fastenings to make sure the assembly doesn't come loose, and sufficient channels to get pressure to where it would need to be in the systems. all in all, difficult, but not necessarily impossible. I could see the neccecitation of the apparatus being a separate "construct" grafted to the fated with some degree of intelligence to adequately direct everything to the fated's will, an artificial "Muscle memory" as it were. Now in game mechanics, this is where we would get to have some real fun. assuming this apparatus is on a late-stage fated, it wouldn't be too far off to assume this is their big, shiny toy. their baby, and to a degree, their pet project, so why not have some fun with how it works? Being a boiler, it works with pressure and heat, which reminds me of a certain ht4 model's mechanics. yes, I am without irony suggesting management of burning could be a balancing factor, used as a resource being spent for various tricks and abilities. it could also be used for the sake of gating other items added to the assembly, like a certain other steam powered weapon in the game with more barrels than need to care, spending burning to activate certain features could keep said fated from going full ham and turning into some kind of walking armory. And now, this post has turned from thought dump, to what feels like an entire dissertation. I had more ideas, but I'm also capable of knowing around the time when I need to stop. I'll probably save them for another post when it Isn't 4 in the morning.

Hi, I was told to come over to the forms from the Wyrd Place facebook group, and there's something I'd like to bring up for discussion, specifically, the exact nature of artificial limbs in malifaux [Cross-posted from A Wyrd Place] Would it be possible for weapon enhancements to be added to artificial limbs, and would that scenario allow the damage from those enhanced limbs to a combat style? EG: A career boxer loses his arms to whatever horrors go bump that particular night in Malifaux. luckily for him, he's the favorite cage fighter of a particular guild barrister, and is allowed a new set of arms free of amalgamation charges. knowing he has free reign, he chooses to get a pair of arms with the traits Enlarged, Folded Steel, And Pneumatic, along with a backboiler to power and balance the apparatus, costing lord knows how much guild script. Now, his pugilism (5) would go from 2/3/6 in damage, to 3/4/9, with :+fate on the damage flip. Granted, seeing this fighter out on the streets would probably cause Hoffman to have an aneurysm, but I can't help but imagine some prescience exists for giant robot fists. further arguments/extrapolations could be made, Such as a Knuckle plate that would count as brass knuckles to give the damage flip :+fate , or being added to the skill to either give the needed to trigger onslaught (though if a talent that allows onslaught exists in game presently, I've yet to see it) or an existing to put towards critical strike, which on a Red joker damage flip with :ram , Could punch basically anything in the game through a tree. Now, as far as I've seen, arguments could be used that the pneumatic skill would be used, however, how this interacts with a hand to hand in a way I could totally understand never coming up in play testing. I've been known to play heavily with systems in the past, so a genuine case of "so what does this do" often finds itself up to GM discretion. Personally, I'd believe pugilism would still be relevant skill. Essentially, the one thing I see is that when it comes to the overall complex machinery of Malifaux, spaces for player exploration of limbs is overall somewhat limited, but that's perfectly understandable. it's a relatively new game, and in the early days player creativity can go absolutely in who knows what direction. I think it's a really fun topic of discussion.