Hjelmen Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Hi folks! Since the beta forums are closed, and all the delicious discussions on Jack Daw are no longer (readily) available, I thought I would ask here. I really like the new (beta) rules for Jack, and I really want to run him and his themed crew. I do appreciate that the spirit of the game may be to run all models available to a crew in order to play Malifaux "right", but I really only like to play a crew with the models that fit into the theme of a crew (be it visually or storywise). This, coupled with the fact that I really like the old metal models more than, most of, the new plastic ones, means that if I want to run Jack, I have to get the old models fast, before they are phased out. So, the question/query/conundrum is what did people usually run with Jack during the beta? I know that Montressor, the Guilty and Lady Ligea will have to be plastic, which I can accept, but what about the Wave 1 models that Jack can use? I remember seeing battle reports where tormented crews used both The Drowned, The Hanged and Crooked Men. Can anyone that ran Jack during the beta, or just have experiences with the above models, give me some pointers as to what would be a good fit with a Jack Daw crew, knowing that his rules, and the rules for his Wave 2 themed models, are not set in stone until a week from now. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterDisaster Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Firstly The Drowned were Wave 2, Jaakuna Ubume was also a Wave 2 Tormented model. You have The Hanged and Crooked Men from Wave 1 Rezzers but also Papa Loco as well. They all seem to offer something to the crew. Drowned and Jaakuna offer hazardous terrain debuffs. Papa Loco offers blast damage and plenty of it, he also has a tasty buff for friendly models so long as he activates with 2" on them The Hanged are pretty tough due to incorporeal and have that douche bag ability Whispers from Beyond which halves enemy health and gives a condition preventing any further healing for the duration of the encounter. Can't say much for the Crooked Men as I've only played them once or twice and it was a while back. IIRC they can spread poison but thats about all I got for them. Hopefully this'll offer some help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rameses Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Don't forget Nurses! Jack gets to have fun with Nurses! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kogan Style Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 My usual crew would be Montressor, Papa Loco, Ama No Zako with Hanged, Nurse, Gulity, Lady Ligela, Drowned, Crooked men all making appearances. For my themed crew I'd have more Gulity than hanged/crooked men. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hjelmen Posted February 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 It seems like I'm pretty well off if I get a blister of Hanged, Drowned and Crooked Men, and then wait for Jacks crew box (sometime in the far future). Nurses and Papa Loco don't really catch my fancy, as I can't see why they'd be associated with Jack Daw, but that's because of my crazy theme-hangup Thanks, guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kogan Style Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Papa was locked in an asylum if I remember, and he is the craziest of the Ortegas, so there is a theme (mental torment) I hope to be starting a blog soon with a themed Jack Daw crew, I think he has one of the strongest themes of the new Malifaux, and it deserves to be explored (beyond just the standard hanged men look) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barnaberible Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Well I never realised Papa Loco was tormented I can see a nasty Papa Loco with oathkeeper, montressor with creeping terror and Lady Ligeia combo to try now. Thematically I can see Ama No Zako, Hodgepodge Effigy and Void Wretches with Jack, but all of these are plastic anyway so it dosent really help with your quest for metal models Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hjelmen Posted February 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Hodgepodge will work, if I can find the old model somewhere. I have a soft spot for the effigies, so those are one of the few exemptions to my self-imposed aesthetical rules I agree that Jack has one of the more interesting themes/fluff in Malifaux, which is why I was so delighted that he was made a Master in M2E! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadeton Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Papa Loco is actually more thematic with Jack than he is with the Ortegas, in my opinion. The Ortegas spend their whole lives learning to fight in the wilderness against the worst that Malifaux can throw at them. They're all tough, stubborn survivors by nature... except Papa, who is a weak-minded self-destructive creature. With Jack, Papa is a man so tormented by his own demons that his only instinct remaining is to kill himself and take as many of his tormentors - everyone else - with him. That sounds like exactly the sort of person who would be drawn to Jack. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hjelmen Posted February 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Very convincing, Kadeton! I suddenly had an image of Papa Loco being somewhat like Henry Bowers in IT, where he sees Jack through the bars on the asylum window, and breaks out to satisfy his madness, fear and torment! Sold 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sezar Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 I tested extensively Jack Daw's Crew all along the wave 2 beta process, and I must say I am really happy in their final beta cards (apart from Guilty's Accusation Trigger). I am also a a mostly in-theme player, and Jack's really one of those Crews with so strong theme that in my opinion it is actually a pity to go out of it. Of course, there are plenty of models who will work wonders besides Jack, but I just like to keep the theme there. In my testing, I only played with Sue and Ama no Zako as non-Tormented models, but they worked pretty fine within the Crew. In fact, Ama works like a charm with Jack, and it is a force multiplier if you also hire Jaakuna and some Drowneds. The only Tormenteds I didn't test were the Crooked, but just as a personal dislike of the models, as they really have potential on the Crew. As you already said, Montresor and Ligeia, as well as Guilties are almost mandatory for the Crew. The Hangeds were almost an auto-hire in my first games, we all know how strong they are, but by the end of the beta I never hired any, I just didn't feel they were so needed by then. Strong? Always, but not needed at all for success. I just love the Crew; Jack is such a strong character that one can't simply ignore it in this game, but its gameplay is pretty interesting too. It's not that it is so unique or amazing, it is just fun to me. His Curses give him some tactical tools who can be game winning sometimes, but most often than not, they're not that important. Jack himself is not a powerhouse in any aspect of the game. Tough? He is hard to take down, but not inmortal in any way. Jack has a bit of everything. He can "Obey", "Mimic", has movement shenanigans, can be fearsome, deals OK damage, buffs his Crew, debuffs the enemy, card manipulation... even Scheme tricks! Every one of the Tormented's Crew Upgrades are desirable, and none of them too much more than the others. Even the Curses can be ignored or at least you are not required to take the 3 of them everygame. The Crew has his own strenghts and some weaknesess too, which can deal some bad match-ups here or there, but I feel like that's how it should be in Malifaux anyway. As some of you, I can't really wait to see his Starter Box Crew, which will be pre-ordered just the very minute I see it available. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehren37 Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 I think it might be interesting and thematic if Tuco got Tormented as well. Does Jack get anything from Neverborn? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sezar Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 There are no Tormented models out of Guild (only Papa Loco) and Ressers (Jaakuna, Drowned, Hanged, Nurse, Crooked). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malharath Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 It seems like I'm pretty well off if I get a blister of Hanged, Drowned and Crooked Men, and then wait for Jacks crew box (sometime in the far future). Nurses and Papa Loco don't really catch my fancy, as I can't see why they'd be associated with Jack Daw, but that's because of my crazy theme-hangup Thanks, guys! Nurse are ladies who have their skin peeled off, replaced with new skin which drives them crazy. They are insane, that's their link to Jack. Don't have my book handy but i think the procedure is without anesthetic also. Also game play wise they are great. So many cool little combos to throw around. I love running one with two ronin nearby, to utilise "downers" as much as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodent Mastermind Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Very convincing, Kadeton! I suddenly had an image of Papa Loco being somewhat like Henry Bowers in IT, where he sees Jack through the bars on the asylum window, and breaks out to satisfy his madness, fear and torment! Sold I think he could work as Tom Waits in Bram Stoker Dracula. He definitely works with the Renfield feel.I could easily proxy up a Montressor from the Hanging Tree set. What would you use for Lady Ligelia? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arli Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Want to see a Misaki player cry? Use a Nurse to Paralyze her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hjelmen Posted February 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 I think he could work as Tom Waits in Bram Stoker Dracula. He definitely works with the Renfield feel. I could easily proxy up a Montressor from the Hanging Tree set. What would you use for Lady Ligelia? I am going to use the Mourner from Hell Dorado. That should be sufficiently creepy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kogan Style Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Not a bad shout that. I was struggling for a Lady Ligelia concept. What are your thoughts for Montressor? I think the that taking inspiration from the story the name comes from leads to a generic hangman model, which the guild Executioner is too alike. I love the idea that Montressor draws the pain and torment of others to his/herself, and as they get closer, the torment escalates and drives people insane. I see Montressor more as a little child/being that radiates great suffering. I also think the name sounds more feminine than masculine, so a model I may use to represent her is this one:http://elementgames.co.uk/wargames-and-miniatures/fantasy-miniatures-games/bushido/taka-and-wrath Just Taka obviously. The bindings also link the model with Jack (metal version) and the hanged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sezar Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 If you keep going with Taka, I would just put both models on the same 50mm base, as there should be plenty of room for them (Taka in front of the Wrath). The Wrath should personiphize (sp?) the pain and danger one runs into get coming close to Montresor. Still, Montresor is Ht 2, so Taka alone may be just too small for him. My take on Montresor's proxying is Wyrd's exceptional Special Edition Carver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hjelmen Posted February 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 I can't really "see" Montressor in my minds eye, so I don't really know which way I would like to go with him. Since his namesake in the Poe story is plagued by his guilt (or by rights should be) of burying his friend alive, I have this idea of him as a well-dressed man, but his clothes are in tatters and he may or may not be chained up somehow (Not unlike the illustration for the source material on wikipedia (Link to image)). But that doesn't entirely convey the atmosphere of the original story to me, nor the character in Malifaux, but it might work. I personally like my models to be more subtle than a lot of Wyrds newer models, so I'm at a bit of a loss as how to get the above aesthetic right, since I'm not all that convinced that the Wyrd sculpt will work for me (based on previoue plastic releases). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barnaberible Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 I love the proxy for Ligelia from Hell Dorado, great model. I'm using half the alternate Bette Niore for this As for Montressor Im using the Nightmare Hanged, He / She is HT3 so i'm not sure the carver would be big enough (but its a lovely model) Obviously the Nightmare Hanged are difficult to pick up but I wonder if there is any milage in converting one of the Games Workshop plastic trees, with the addition of some ropes and a dapper gent standing in fromt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kogan Style Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 I never worry too much about the actual height of the model, since its printed on the stat card. I have yet to have an incident where the physical height of the model has played any part in the game. However Taka (sans Wrath) on a mound in the centre of the base, with some kind of channelling of torment going on (either other models or potentially - hangman's nooses) would solve any imagined complaints. Would look amazing too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uktena Posted February 7, 2014 Report Share Posted February 7, 2014 They may not be dead or tormented (yet) but the Convict Gunslinger fits well thematically and tactically 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aramoro Posted February 7, 2014 Report Share Posted February 7, 2014 I've got a list using The Drowned and Jaakuna Ubume that I really want to try out, lots of pushes and movement to use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malharath Posted February 7, 2014 Report Share Posted February 7, 2014 I've got a list using The Drowned and Jaakuna Ubume that I really want to try out, lots of pushes and movement to use. What is the list? I have tried a drwoned/jakuna list before, not very well though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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