Iron Heel Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 I'm still waiting for my orders, so I don't know the actual text and limitations of it, but the figure swapping abilities of the torakage seem like a pretty HUGE "get out of jail free card." Anyone who's played them want to chime in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroFire Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 It can be one of their most useful abilities, definitely. A couple things to remember is that it has a range limit; it's a fairly large range, but it's still something that needs to be considered (not like the Viks just swapping from anywhere.) Also, it can only swap with 10T minions, so those masters who can take certain things from their other factions will need to keep that in mind or all their plans could fall apart. Another thing to consider is that it takes a :masks to cast it, so you either need to have one in your hand or use up their (0) on Faceless. A major thing the Tora-swap is used for is to 'sneak' up on an enemy and then bring in a big melee beast who might be vulnerable making the approach themselves. I suppose they could then swap back out if the melee hitter is in serious trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mach_5 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 I don't have a book yet, but also keep in mind that unless it says that you don't need line of sight, you would need LoS to the model you're swapping with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alviaran Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 It can be one of their most useful abilities, definitely. A couple things to remember is that it has a range limit; it's a fairly large range, but it's still something that needs to be considered (not like the Viks just swapping from anywhere.) Also, it can only swap with 10T minions, so those masters who can take certain things from their other factions will need to keep that in mind or all their plans could fall apart. Another thing to consider is that it takes a :masks to cast it, so you either need to have one in your hand or use up their (0) on Faceless. A major thing the Tora-swap is used for is to 'sneak' up on an enemy and then bring in a big melee beast who might be vulnerable making the approach themselves. I suppose they could then swap back out if the melee hitter is in serious trouble. Just a point, it is not a Ten Thunders MINION. Just a Ten Thunders MODEL. So you can swap Masters. But you are correct about the non-dual faction stuff not getting to come along. I don't have a book yet, but also keep in mind that unless it says that you don't need line of sight, you would need LoS to the model you're swapping with. It does specify TARGET, so yes, you do need LOS to swap them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mach_5 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 I'm pretty sure all spells target even if it doesn't say the word in the description. RM pg 52, first step to cast a spell is "Declare Spell and Target". ---------- Post added at 09:44 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:43 AM ---------- Oops, nevermind, reading further you only declare the target if one is required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearLord Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 Ah, so its a spell, and not just an ability? That makes it a bit less crazy (I've been thinking how crazy good this will be all week!) - Sounds like you can do a (0) to meet the suit requirement? What kind of number are we talking about to cast this? Am I going to be needing high cards, or is it a pretty easy cast? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroFire Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 Just a point, it is not a Ten Thunders MINION. Just a Ten Thunders MODEL. Apologies. I don't know why I so often say 'minion' when I just mean 'model.' Ah, so its a spell, and not just an ability? That makes it a bit less crazy (I've been thinking how crazy good this will be all week!) - Sounds like you can do a (0) to meet the suit requirement? What kind of number are we talking about to cast this? Am I going to be needing high cards, or is it a pretty easy cast? The casting cost is pretty reasonable; slightly less than half the cards in the deck will get you there... I think. Maybe it's exactly half. Somewhere around half, anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearLord Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 Apologies. I don't know why I so often say 'minion' when I just mean 'model.' In real life do you often say "Minion" instead of "Person"? ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratty Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 In real life do you often say "Minion" instead of "Person"? ;-) I do.. I would like to say that over time I've grown to consider you all "minions". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearLord Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 I do.. I would like to say that over time I've grown to consider you all "minions". Thanks... I guess? ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePandaDirector Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 I do.. I would like to say that over time I've grown to consider you all "minions". Pfft minions... I prefer to class myself as a Pawn thank you very much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroFire Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 In real life do you often say "Minion" instead of "Person"? ;-) Oddly I refer to people as models... *grin* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alviaran Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Ah, so its a spell, and not just an ability? That makes it a bit less crazy (I've been thinking how crazy good this will be all week!) - Sounds like you can do a (0) to meet the suit requirement? What kind of number are we talking about to cast this? Am I going to be needing high cards, or is it a pretty easy cast?7 of Masks without using Faceless. If you can get by without it, it IS beneficial to do so. Their other (0) are Smoke Bombs and they are AWESOME. Great way to cover the crew on their way in. Apologies. I don't know why I so often say 'minion' when I just mean 'model.' No problem. Especially because the book isn't in everyone's hands yet, I just want to make sure it's clear. I know a lot of people are chomping at the bit and looking forward to the shenanigans. Want to let them get their hopes up just a bit more. I do.. I would like to say that over time I've grown to consider you all "minions". My friend and her husband have declared they will never have children. They will, however, have minions. And they will do their bidding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cats Laughing Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 My friend and her husband have declared they will never have children. They will, however, have minions. And they will do their bidding. Obviously they are still trying. Once they have a child, they will come to understand that children never do a parent's bidding. It works the other way around... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alviaran Posted August 27, 2012 Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 Obviously they are still trying. Once they have a child, they will come to understand that children never do a parent's bidding. It works the other way around... Oh, that was my response too. And I'm not even a parent. My argument is, "Have you ever tried to herd cats? Kids are like that. Good luck." They are gonna' try to command them. I told them to throw in a maniacal laugh. It can't hurt, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnternalVoid Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Horrible screaming creatures that cause damage to everything around them and each others...So is herding kids anything like herding Squirrels? ... okay I got my bad joke in, I am happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smurfORnto Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 thing is,you must not think about them as children,rather think about them like dogs,and apply appropriate training methods Since I am rather looking very much in misaki as my master,and you get 3 torkage in box,and they are 6ss,how much you think that will be useful to have with you? 1-2max? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgraz Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 thing is,you must not think about them as children,rather think about them like dogs,and apply appropriate training methods Since I am rather looking very much in misaki as my master,and you get 3 torkage in box,and they are 6ss,how much you think that will be useful to have with you? 1-2max? I've been thinking about that myself. I do believe I will always have at least one and I was thinking I would never take 3. But 3 of them with 2 hard hitters (Misaki and Ototo for ex) is a lot of swapping... They have pretty low weak damage, but against crews that aren't great in melee and rely on shooting or magic attacks, 3 torakage could be in their deployment zone at the end of turn 1.....engaged with all of their shooters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearLord Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 I agree that at least one seems like its going to be pretty standard for me, but I'll wait until I see their full stats before I commit to how many I'll actually run... The ability to swap just seems hugely useful... I think 2 may be pretty good as well for smoke bombs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy in Suit Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 I worry Misaki is going to struggle a fair bit being out-activated - so you are going to need to bring a 10T bro to set up a companion chain unless you want whatever you swap in with the torokage to take a pounding. At that point you are already spending 11SS to set up the swap - add in a few more Torokage for more elaborate swaps - and you have no actual crew! Then again, Misaki may just go on a rampage and kill everything herself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rancor709 Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 with a pure multiswap crew you could almost run Misaki like a very interesting Lilith. Not saying it would work but the continual launch foward, eat get replaced by a toro would be interesting to say the least probably far from optimal but could be fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgraz Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 I worry Misaki is going to struggle a fair bit being out-activated - so you are going to need to bring a 10T bro to set up a companion chain unless you want whatever you swap in with the torokage to take a pounding. At that point you are already spending 11SS to set up the swap - add in a few more Torokage for more elaborate swaps - and you have no actual crew! Then again, Misaki may just go on a rampage and kill everything herself I'm also concerned about this.....I think there will be liberal traps and desperate mercs with her. At least it's not like the Torakage can't fight....in fact, they get better when they're on their own - they may not be awesome fighters, but they can fight. My biggest problem is fitting in more than one Torakage since I like so many of the other new models. Yamaziko is almost auto for Misaki. The Archer is awesome. Ototo is a great beater. Too many good models at 5ss & 6ss. Nothing really at 4ss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alviaran Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 I'm also concerned about this.....I think there will be liberal traps and desperate mercs with her. At least it's not like the Torakage can't fight....in fact, they get better when they're on their own - they may not be awesome fighters, but they can fight. My biggest problem is fitting in more than one Torakage since I like so many of the other new models. Yamaziko is almost auto for Misaki. The Archer is awesome. Ototo is a great beater. Too many good models at 5ss & 6ss. Nothing really at 4ss. What are you talking about? There is a great model at 4ss! Two Desperate Mercs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgraz Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Or one merc and one trap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FearLord Posted August 28, 2012 Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Depending on the combat ability of Wastrels, I think they could be okay for Misaki at 4ss - I think they'll be good with Torakage as objective grabbers... But yeah, there do seem to be lots of decent 6ss + models... On the other hand, Traps seem very very cool for 2ss, so perhaps they'll be where I bulk out my activations - drop one 6ss model for 3 Traps... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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