Subötai Posted July 14, 2012 Report Share Posted July 14, 2012 Unfortunately, you will get people who will try to cheat for a $25 gift certificate. I have encountered/heard of just a couple of cheating experiences in Malifaux. One was in a tourney right after the puppet decks were out, and he got every trigger because of me not knowing the difference in the suits on those cards; afterwards I learned that he was lying about suits, and built-in suits on his cards. Another was a guy that would melee my model, find an excuse to reach into the area and bump my model out of the same melee range; that was not cool, and I didn't let him get away with it. The third was a friend of mine catching a guy doing card manipulation sleight of hand. Turns out it was all the same guy, from somewhere far away who we kept coming across at cons. After that, he hasn't been seen or heard from, likely found a new game where he isn't known. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigmike Posted July 14, 2012 Report Share Posted July 14, 2012 Just remember there is a tactful way to approach the subject and then there is a way to make everything awkward. If you have an issue, you can politely say " wow that's epic, can I see that real fast". simply playing it cool can make all the difference, plus he may not be cheating, he may just have rules wrong, it happens to the best of us. To be fair on the triggers position as well, my friend cant get triggers to save his life and i can get them almost all the time, neither of us are cheating, its just how it happens sometimes. :Hiding_Puppet: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JisaacT Posted July 14, 2012 Report Share Posted July 14, 2012 I just moved to a new area in West Virginia. There is only one game store and it is about 30-40 minuets away so gaming there ona regular basis is rather difficult for me at times. Anyways I heard about malifaux at this store last year. They used to have the models in stock but this year they stopped carrying them. I have been tryin to figure out why because I want to play against someone. Anyways apparently there is a guy who ruined the game for many people at this store. He would be a huge stickler for the Rules almost to the point of unsportsmanlike. Then on top of that he would then cheat with his measurements and his flips. It makes me sad that one cheater can ruin a game for a whole store to the point to where they don't carry the game. Now I have no one to play against Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huang Da Wei Posted July 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2012 I think the puppet deck would be good for cheating, I have no idea what the suits are on them. Very easy to point and say 'that gets my trigger for xyz' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratty Posted July 15, 2012 Report Share Posted July 15, 2012 I think the puppet deck would be good for cheating, I have no idea what the suits are on them. Very easy to point and say 'that gets my trigger for xyz' Really I can spot the suit just by the picture on the card.. BTW Wyrd made Nightmare Lord Chompy Bits for a reason... And that reason is so you could put it in a sock and wait for cheaters down dark alleys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Heel Posted July 16, 2012 Report Share Posted July 16, 2012 (edited) Anyways apparently there is a guy who ruined the game for many people at this store. He would be a huge stickler for the Rules almost to the point of unsportsmanlike. Then on top of that he would then cheat with his measurements and his flips. It makes me sad that one cheater can ruin a game for a whole store to the point to where they don't carry the game. Now I have no one to play against There are a couple of these people lurking around in each gaming meta. It is really gratifying to beat these folks while being a good sportsman. You have to know the rules of the game your playing very well to come out on top with a person like that. It is sad that "powergamers" exist. I would go for proper shunning over quitting a game. If you can get a couple people playing a the LGS, perhaps the old players will come back and you all can avoid playing that knucklehead. I never really understood these people. I have always been more interested in playing well and having fun than winning. Don't get me wrong, losing all the time is no fun, but winning through cheating or capitalizing on a new player's ignorance does not prove my own skill (or lack there of in some cases :1_Happy_Puppet1:) Edited July 16, 2012 by Iron Heel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythicFOX Posted July 16, 2012 Report Share Posted July 16, 2012 IMHO there are a number of things that get lumped in together in these debates. Actual cheating (stacked decks etc) should not be tolerated, and should be a hard ban in any environment. That being said it is important that players are absolutely sure there is cheating before making accusations. The simplest defence against card cheating is cutting your opponent’s deck. I also actively insist my opponents cut my deck. That way there can be no accusations. The rest of it; rules lawyering, dodgy measuring, misrepresenting rules / abilities for me falls into general poor behaviour. The absolute best defence against this sort of behaviour is to call you opponent out on it and robustly challenge them. This behaviour only works when allowed to go unchallenged. It relies on players wanting to avoid confrontation. It’s everyone’s duty to challenge this behaviour whenever manifests. This goes double for TOs. Once a player knows they can’t get away with poor play with you they’ll either avoid playing you, or they’ll tone it down. The final thing I wanted to quickly note is I don’t agree that there is a link between competitive play and poor behaviour. The worst examples I’ve come across have been in the least competitive environments, maybe I’ve been lucky. You can be ‘that guy’ without being competitive and competitive without being ‘that guy’. Play for fun, play to win but above all play nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsmiles Posted July 16, 2012 Report Share Posted July 16, 2012 I really don't think 'rules lawyering' falls under 'cheating' or under 'poor sportsmanship.' The rules are there for a reason. Dodgy measuring is definitely 'cheating' though. I always make sure my measurements are exact, and I measure everything (unless the models in question happen to be B2B). Even if I know my target is in range, I measure. I usually expect the worst when it comes to my opponents, so I make sure every rule is followed to the letter, and every measurement in spot on. As far as playing to win goes, I go all out for tournament play, but in casual play I play to have fun. Winning and losing in casual play has no meaning for me, but in a tournament, the entire purpose of entering is to win. [/$0.02] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Heel Posted July 16, 2012 Report Share Posted July 16, 2012 "Rules lawyering" is more than a wish to adhere to the rules; I don't think that anyone is advocating for ignoring the mechanics of the game. In the US legal system, a lawyer uses the law to advocate for her/his client's victory. Similarly, a rules lawyer uses the rules of a game (sometimes in an agressive or obnoxious manner) to advocate for her/his own victory. They seek for and capitalize from loopholes and murkiness (found in all games) to advocate for their victory...rather than finding logical conclusions for the health of the game. In some ways they are good for systems as they shine a light on what needs fixing as they make games unpleasant for the rest of us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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