JisaacT Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Ok well since my love of Seamus and his badassery will never end I was wondering what you guys thought if Seamus were to get an update what would you like to see without totally changing him? I think I would like to see him get instinctual so that he can cast a second (0) point spell. Right now he has 4 available to him. This would make manifestation of his avatar easier to do, which can be pretty difficult with only 1 (0) point action per turn. This would allow him to summon 2 rotten belles in a turn, thus making him a bit more of a ressur. I think his SS cache could be increased by 1 or 2. Nothing earth shattering but it would deff. help him out. Finally i think his Df should be increased by 1. His is only a 4. To balance him out he could be changed to Hard to wound 1 instead of 2. This could be good or bad. Anyways just some thoughts. Hopefully he will get an update but who knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenborne Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 I don't think he needs stat changes, but I agree he ought to be 4 SS. Instinctual would be nice. Companion Belle would be sweet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calmdown Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 4ss, living restriction removed from Trail of Fear and Necrotic Ministrations, HtW reduced to 1 from 2, Live for Pain changed to a melee spell. And he's good to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenborne Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Good ones Calmdown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 I also wouldn't mind seeing his totem becoming more of an essential method of his play style. Drop the gun, make his Def 6 or 8 and make Mistaken Identity be an easy to cast spell or a switch ability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sinistercats Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Aww- I love the image of this little guy with a GREAT big gun that knocks him back when he uses it. But yeah- Mistaken Identity should be easier to pull off. Also love Calmdown's suggested changes to Seamus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBurner Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) I just picked him up last night, and after looking him over I'd have to agree with every suggestion given so far. Hopefully something will change, but who knows. Edit: The only change I wouldn't agree with would be Companion (Belle), he already has womanizer, so I think it would be a moot point, but if they dropped that, it would definitely be awesome to Companion! Edited February 10, 2012 by TheBurner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) I think Womanizer is fine, as many master's have something similar. I agree I like Calmdown's suggestions, although I'd just change Live for Pain to a Spell without a Melee or Ranged Icon, although I'd certainly accept it as a Melee spell. I can even see fluff reasons for allowing necrotic ministrations work on non-living or undead models, as the tech of Malifaux requires SS to make constructs work, and even the deaths of things like Nightmares can provide Seamus with insight into the workings of the Grave Spirit. Edited February 10, 2012 by Fetid Strumpet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilus Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 I don't like the idea of giving him straight companion(Belle). Would be very powerful for him to easily active all his belles without needing Sybelle in the chain like he does now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_madhatter1 Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 I agree with all of Calmdowns suggestions, it would also be fun if he was able to connect to multiple CCKs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigkid Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Instinctual and a couple more SS would be enough for me. Oh, and remove the fire once per turn rubbish from his hand cannon. Ophelia does more damage with her 'Dumb and Lucky' trigger for Gods sake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valcurdra Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 I would not like to see the HTW2 or live for pain changes suggested. I think they change the way seamus plays a bit too much. Also instinctual won't allow you to summon 2 belles as it only allows you to cast 2 different (0) actions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 The choice you have to make in what (0) action to use is one of the (many) things that I think makes Seamus interesting to play. Necrotic Ministrations proccing off more things would be nice, though. Adding Nightmares and Spirits would be enough IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JisaacT Posted February 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Still instinctual would be awesome to have. It would at least make his free charge action from (0) no escape easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calmdown Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Instinctual would in no way solve his issues, which are too few ss, too easy to kill and poor against nonliving crews. It would be a pretty brainless and boring fix instead of making him better but still making you make play decisions when using him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigkid Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 You say 'brainless and boring' I say simple and effective. Combined with an increase in SS it would be in keeping with the character of Seamus as is. If you're going to change 4 or 5 things you might as well rewrite the whole character. Which, as the Avatar already addresses several of his short-comings, I don't think is necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calmdown Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 You say 'brainless and boring' I say simple and effective. Combined with an increase in SS it would be in keeping with the character of Seamus as is. If you're going to change 4 or 5 things you might as well rewrite the whole character. Which, as the Avatar already addresses several of his short-comings, I don't think is necessary. He would have all the same issues that he has now. I think you dont quite understand his flaws if you think instinctual would fix him. And an avatar should not be a fix for shortcomings. It should be an option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigkid Posted February 12, 2012 Report Share Posted February 12, 2012 He would have all the same issues that he has now. I think you dont quite understand his flaws if you think instinctual would fix him. And an avatar should not be a fix for shortcomings. It should be an option. I think you under-estimate him as is. If you want to re-write his character so he becomes over-powered then you may as well go play Neverborn (oh wait, you do ). I use Seamus as my main Master and really don't see him as massively lacking, other then against the top 4 Masters but then who doesn't struggle against them? And we'll have to agree to disagree about Avatars as that's exactly how I see them working. They improve some areas whilst reducing the effectiveness of others. Want a proper terror engine? Manifest. Happy to keep raising belles and blowing holes in folk? Stay as standard. I don't think Seamus needs 'fixing', that implies he's broken (and lord knows that's not the case) I believe he just needs a gentle nudge... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valcurdra Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Instinctual would in no way solve his issues, which are too few ss, too easy to kill and poor against nonliving crews. It would be a pretty brainless and boring fix instead of making him better but still making you make play decisions when using him. Too easy to kill?? He has 12 wd's, Hard To Wound 2, Hard to Kill, terrifying, use soulstone, multiple ways of healing himself, plus belle's to lure him away from danger and tie up opponents. If you can't stop him from getting killed your doing something wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calmdown Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Too easy to kill?? He has 12 wd's, Hard To Wound 2, Hard to Kill, terrifying, use soulstone, multiple ways of healing himself, plus belle's to lure him away from danger and tie up opponents. If you can't stop him from getting killed your doing something wrong. Im guessing from your posts youre relatively inexperienced with malifaux and seamus. Hard to wound 2 is a bad thing due to the red joker, as has been explained many times on this forum. Terrifying is a mostly useless ability. He has a ss cache of 2 so you have to invest a lot to get use out of use soulstone. He has Df 4 and no defensive triggers. Having access to belles is no different from any other rezzer. The fact that they can lure him away from danger is no different to any other rezzer. The effect of his crew on his survivability is a moot point as all masters have crews supporting them. Healing does nothing gor you if you can die in an activation or two. Seamus is deceptively easy to kill. Thinking he's tough is a number one rookie mistake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetid Strumpet Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Of the Resser Masters, I've found Seamus is actually often the easiest one to kill, Nicodem sometimes is #1 if you can get to him before he has any zombies. McMorning has to be killed in 1 go at it, or he will just heal everything you just did to him by attacking. Kirai,... Seishin, Pitiful, Spirit (sometimes), Healing, and the lost love. She rarely goes down unless you totally mismanage your cutting, and let the lost love go down. Nicodem, if he has mindless zombies you have to kill them all first before Nicodem will go down. Seamus, hit him as many times as you can, hoping for maximum negative flips on the dmg to increase your chances of the Red Joker. He has the lowest SS cache of the Ressers so if he brings more than 4SS he has seriously gimped his crew. Terrifying is a next to useless ability unless you can hit multiple susceptible models all at once with it, and even then an opponent often only needs one model to succeed it to put a hurting on Seamus. Once you lock him in melee he can't use live for pain to heal, and thus has to count on necrotic ministrations, which hardly ever works in the current environment. Calmdown is correct, anytime I play any other Resser Master I hardly ever have them die. Seamus dies on average about once every other game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigkid Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Seamus, hit him as many times as you can, hoping for maximum negative flips on the dmg to increase your chances of the Red Joker. He has the lowest SS cache of the Ressers so if he brings more than 4SS he has seriously gimped his crew. Terrifying is a next to useless ability unless you can hit multiple susceptible models all at once with it, and even then an opponent often only needs one model to succeed it to put a hurting on Seamus. Once you lock him in melee he can't use live for pain to heal, and thus has to count on necrotic ministrations, which hardly ever works in the current environment. Calmdown is correct, any time I play any other Resser Master I hardly ever have them die. Seamus dies on average about once every other game. I find this a ludicrous argument. You could just as easily claim that Seamus is almost invulnerable as the increased negative flips mean there is more chance of flipping the black joker. I think we've all agreed that Seamus has too few SS and it is a given that he requires more to compete. The Terrifying issue has been addressed by his Avatar form. Locking him in combat should be extremely difficult when he's accompanied by Belles (as mentioned earlier). I find that even in his current state he is a viable Master against most opponents (other than the big 4), he just needs a little push. I wouldn't like to see him have his whole character changed just to keep up in an ever increasing arms race. If you want to play a Resser Master that requires little thought choose Kirai. If you want a laugh and the knowledge that you really did deserve that win, choose Seamus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy in Suit Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Hard to wound 2 is a bad thing due to the red joker, as has been explained many times on this forum. If Ophelia has a Red Joker in her hand - he is the only master in the game that isn't seriously boned by a focused shot + a decent soulstone from her... 9/10 times HtW 2 is pretty damn awesome - and cheat down if you are so worried about multiple negative flips Terrifying is a mostly useless ability. I don't know how you can say this with a straight face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiku Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 Wow, I never see people mention Ophelia and the Red Joker, yet it has won me a fair handful of games by giving me the on-demand 12-16 damage =D Sadly I live with a Seamus player, and I favour Ophelia. Can't tell you how many times I've had to deal with Steal the Relic being free victory points for her ressers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
micahwc Posted February 16, 2012 Report Share Posted February 16, 2012 McMourning and Kirai are the too most difficult ressurs to kill in my experience. Kirai is just a PITA. McMourning isn't too bad if he has already activated, otherwise you have to do massive damage in one activation or one companion chain. Nico is deceptively survivable with mindless zombies and an easy way to paralyze models. I have had a mature nephilim or other large melee minion paralyzed next to him more times than I can count. Usually a punk zombie is summoned next to it, then it's lured farther away from Nico. I have played one Seamus match where he was an extremely long lasting tarpit, but this was because he was killing off his own belles to heal, and raising more every chance he got. Every other time I have played against him (with a variety of masters) he wasn't too much of a threat. Though he can be if he is facing a living crew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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