Gremlins and Som'er

[IronChief]

Hi,

When Malifaux first came out, I thought the concept of the Gremlins was great and the models looked good enough, so I purchased the starter. After much losing, mostly to the Ortega's, I put Som'er away.

Now my friend wants to play Malifaux again. It has been well over a year since we played. So I decided to read up on Som'er, here and on "Pull My Finger."

From my reading:

1) Som'er Teeth is rubbish without mosquitoes

2) Lots of gremlins (in general) are rubbish without Ophelia

3) Pigs may or may not be rubbish

4) Slop Haulers are a 'must include'

5) Young LaCroix are a 'must include' if you take Ophelia

6) In smaller fights (25ss) take Ophelia and the LaCroix and forget Som'er

In summary, since I don't have any book 2 or later models, I need to purchase the LaCroix box, a pack of Young LaCroix and a pack of Slop Haulers if I want to be able to assemble a competitive Gremlin list. Does this seem accurate?

Thanks for your ideas!

[Mister Tezla]

Well, I haven't played many games with Ophelia as the master yet, But my mani crew is S'omer and the Gremlins and both won and lost some games with various crew builds.

1) Som'er Teeth is rubbish without mosquitoes Skeeters are Damn useful for S'omer. I wouldn't say he's completely rubbish without them but I would say take them whenever possible. Their CA makes many spells tough to pull off (IMHO) so they're flying gas bag's spaming "Soooeeeyyyy" for a pig stampede or "pull My Finger"

2) Lots of gremlins (in general) are rubbish without Ophelia Even without having Ophelia on the board I've managed to pull of wins with alot of Gremlins (summoned through "get your Bro" mostly), with Deliverence and Y'all Watch this keeping my opponent away from my objectives.

3) Pigs may or may not be rubbish Depends who you ask. Some people can use pigs real well, some people have difficulty getting past their Insignificance nature. I tend to use them for Stampede's (game against Sonnia saw one piglet as the MVP, charging and pushing her and her crew away from my objective and killing 4 guys.) The trick is knowing how to control their stampede, or using them as a utility model. Truffles helps shuffle your Gremlins around, and with a Hog Whisperer on board, casting "Bacon" when your pig is sitting right on an objective can be a nice little trick.

4) Slop Haulers are a 'must include' Agreed, unless you're lobbing models from a distance with Pigapult.

5) Young LaCroix are a 'must include' if you take Ophelia my experience is lacking here to give a good answer, sorry.

6) In smaller fights (25ss) take Ophelia and the LaCroix and forget Som'er I started with S'omer in 25ss fights. He's not bad, though Ophelia is a better choice with the nature of her crews. S'omer just depends on a lot of models running around (hired or through summonings), and in smaller games it can be tricky to summon a decent force without some good defence/offense already on the board.

The best advice with gremlin's is try a few different combinations and see what fits for you. Gremlins are the "fun" crew of Malifaux that people don;t expect to win, have the fun is being horribly destructive to your enemies forces and seeing the surprise on their face when they realize how much they underestimated the bayou fol.

[CannonFodder]

Gremlin are the comic relief of Malifaux, but don't rule them out. They are good at strategies that mean grabbing stuff not necessarily survivability, like line in the sand.

Som'er lists tend to need more models to play and each list spam 1 type. So its lots of Pigs and pig oriented stuff, Or Pigapult and stuffed pig and taxidermists, or Bayou swarm. mixing a little of each reduces it effectiveness.

Ophelia basically take one Kin (unique grem) and really boosts them alot. So people tend to think the models that come in her box need her. But even without her they are worth their points, with the boost and auto-triggers they are worth 2-3 times thier points for the turn. I had one of the 5 point once (free shot on trigger) take out a Teddy and 2 Alps in one activation because of the boost. It does not mean without Ophelia he is not worth 5 points, it he is still very good for 5.

The piglets are situational and tactical, not offensive. I would love to take a piglet in an Ophelia crew to do a yo-yo tactic. But she can't take them, in a Som'er list, you tend not to take the models from the Ophelia crew because his lists need to spam other models, so the piglets lose their real benefit. The warpig is the gremlins only real chance of doing anything vs a terror list, its pig charge make it effectively immune to morale checks.

Slop hauler... Yep anything over 25 SS they should be included, (All) heal flip on 4 models is really goods since they have reckless. I've yet to use the debuff ability, but would love to have it vs the Perdita list. and the long shot is kinda fun.

Totems: I have yet to pick up a Mosquito, but I think they should be good Because there are some spell that I don't Think Som'er will cast himself, like the emo discard spell. The young Lacroix are very good, but you gain insignificant vs the Bayou grem. So if you are going for objectives, them reconcider, otherwise its usally better to take them over the Bayou grem.

In smaller list Henchmen are always better because they can bring extra models.

I started with the Ophelia box, Bayou Grem(1 blister), slop haulers and Young Lacroix. This is a decent & fun crew that is good but will have problem vs top tier list (LCB especially). But its not a list to go head to head with brute force combat. Take note the Colette crew is top tier and not meant to go head to head either. The goal is not kills.

For Som'er, you need to tailor your crew for a type of game and what you wan to do.

Som're the Summoner: 8-12 Bayou Grem, 4 Mosquitos, Piglettes. Slop haulers

Som'ers Swine list: 2 war pigs, 2 pig whisperers. Piglets, and some bayou grem, Slop Haulers & mosquitoes, not necessarily 4.

Som'er Blow'em to bacon bits list: Pigapult, taxidermist, stuffed pigletts, & mosquitoes (maybe piglets), some bayou grem. This list in theory can work without the pigapult, but you need the max number of stuffed piglets.

So the Som'er lists tend to specialize a lot. you can toss in some uniques for flavour but you need to remove 2 of the other models needed for the list. I picked up the Ophelia list above and a Som'er box and a piglet blister. In a fun game vs someone who just want a fun game, or learning, I'll do a mixed list.

Long story short: Ophelia crew for fewer models and just as fun, Som'er of you just can't have fun without 50 million models, ideal for war hammer player who just can't get around the idea of only having a few models

Edited September 23, 2011 by CannonFodder

[Dumb Luck]

Everything has pretty much been said. The best Somer crew seems to be an Ophelia one with attached onto the end of it.

[Nixon]

Glad I got the bayou box.

[Omenbringer]

The piglets are situational and tactical, not offensive. I would love to take a piglet in an Ophelia crew to do a yo-yo tactic. But she can't take them, in a Som'er list, you tend not to take the models from the Ophelia crew because his lists need to spam other models, so the piglets lose their real benefit. The warpig is the gremlins only real chance of doing anything vs a terror list, its pig charge make it effectively immune to morale checks.

Piglet's are actually very offensive and not that situational (if you run them with the right support), plus they more chance of actually hitting and more Dg potential (when concentrating on the same target). Neither version cares about Terrifying because they share the Set'er Off ability (if anything Terrifying is more like a guidance system then a deterent for them). The only real advantage of the Warpig is their size (great for screening/ directing Piglet charges) and that they are not insignificant.

Som'ers Swine list: 2 war pigs, 2 pig whisperers. Piglets, and some bayou grem, Slop Haulers & mosquitoes, not necessarily 4.

Would recommend 4 Piglets vice 2 Warpigs and definately 2 Skeeters to act as Air traffic Controllers for the squadron. This favors the "Pig Boomerang" strategy. If you do run a Warpig then he should be used as a screen to direct the piglet charges or as a finisher for models wounded by the squadron.

So the Som'er lists tend to specialize a lot. you can toss in some uniques for flavour but you need to remove 2 of the other models needed for the list. I picked up the Ophelia list above and a Som'er box and a piglet blister. In a fun game vs someone who just want a fun game, or learning, I'll do a mixed list.

Disagree with this quite a bit, to maximize Somer you really do need to bring at least a few of the staple models (Skeeters, Piglets and Bayou Gremlins) this allows you to transition between his play styles. Though I tend to play the "Pig Boomerang" exclusively, I always bring at least 2 Bayou Gremlins as fodder for Sommer's Come and Get it Trigger and the Skeeters Larva & Parasitic Infection (to replace Piglet Squadron losses and skeeter controllers). This also allows Somer the option of building up a "Gremlin Gunline" second wave or "Alpha Stank" run.

The worst way to really run Somer is with the lacroix crew as he really does nothing for them other then take away Soulstones that could be used on more synergistic models and control cards that could be used for cheating attacks (to get off those all important triggers).

Long story short: Ophelia crew for fewer models and just as fun, Som'er of you just can't have fun without 50 million models, ideal for war hammer player who just can't get around the idea of only having a few models

With the speed at which the Gremlins die (both from the enemy and the use of their abilities) you dont really need that many models (Though I do own more, I generally only carry just the Starter crew box, 1 blister of Bayou's, 1 Blister of Piglets, 1 Hog Whisperer, and 2 Skeeters).

[Justin]

Hi,

When Malifaux first came out, I thought the concept of the Gremlins was great and the models looked good enough, so I purchased the starter. After much losing, mostly to the Ortega's, I put Som'er away.

Now my friend wants to play Malifaux again. It has been well over a year since we played. So I decided to read up on Som'er, here and on "Pull My Finger."

From my reading:

1) Som'er Teeth is rubbish without mosquitoes

2) Lots of gremlins (in general) are rubbish without Ophelia

3) Pigs may or may not be rubbish

4) Slop Haulers are a 'must include'

5) Young LaCroix are a 'must include' if you take Ophelia

6) In smaller fights (25ss) take Ophelia and the LaCroix and forget Som'er

In summary, since I don't have any book 2 or later models, I need to purchase the LaCroix box, a pack of Young LaCroix and a pack of Slop Haulers if I want to be able to assemble a competitive Gremlin list. Does this seem accurate?

Thanks for your ideas!

Yes.

[Dumb Luck]

Piglet's are actually very offensive and not that situational (if you run them with the right support), plus they more chance of actually hitting and more Dg potential (when concentrating on the same target). Neither version cares about Terrifying because they share the Set'er Off ability (if anything Terrifying is more like a guidance system then a deterent for them). The only real advantage of the Warpig is their size (great for screening/ directing Piglet charges) and that they are not insignificant.

I would say that their slight damage increase in comparison to Gremlins is offset by the extra range that the Gremlins. Piglets have to actually get in there. Gremlins can slowly chip away from relative safety.

The worst way to really run Somer is with the lacroix crew as he really does nothing for them other then take away Soulstones that could be used on more synergistic models and control cards that could be used for cheating attacks (to get off those all important triggers).

The drop in hand size is pretty bad but I'd say the worse thing is just having to pay eight stones for Ophelia, whereas you'd normally get her for free. Is it the worse way to run him? In my experience, it does alot better than any Pig related list because the troops themselves are generally better. You're not shelling out a large investment in points for things like a Warpig to stop the Piglets from charging ogg when you don't want them to.

With Somer, I believe the name of the game is picking your fights. In scenarios like Turf War, he's worth his weight in gold. In others, maybe not much so. But I have yet to be sold on Piglets as a competitive alternative choice to the LaCroix.

[Omenbringer]

I would say that their slight damage increase in comparison to Gremlins is offset by the extra range that the Gremlins. Piglets have to actually get in there. Gremlins can slowly chip away from relative safety.

Piglets have no problem getting in there with their 20" threat range in the "Pig Boomerang" (on the first attack, which increases further via the Swine Dashes allowing strikes deep into your opponents deployment zone). With the Hog Whisperer giving them Flight via Never Happen they will usually attack from cover (after the Skeeters push them 10" via Sooey! toward their intended target) and return to cover as well (as the second Skeeter calls them Back via Sooey!).

Also the increasse in Dg potential I was refering to was in comparison to the Warpig not the Gremlins (though it does apply to all the basic Gremlins, not the Lacroixs).

The drop in hand size is pretty bad but I'd say the worse thing is just having to pay eight stones for Ophelia, whereas you'd normally get her for free. Is it the worse way to run him? In my experience, it does alot better than any Pig related list because the troops themselves are generally better. You're not shelling out a large investment in points for things like a Warpig to stop the Piglets from charging ogg when you don't want them to.

You dont need a Warpig in Pig heavy lists (in fact I have only really used mine a handful of times beacuse they are underwhelming when compared to a squadron of 3 piglets). Although he can be used as a screen, a well run "Pig Boomerang" doesn't need him at all. Lastly, piglets aren't as uncontrollable as they appear (though it does require a few compulsory models to control them).

With Somer, I believe the name of the game is picking your fights. In scenarios like Turf War, he's worth his weight in gold. In others, maybe not much so. But I have yet to be sold on Piglets as a competitive alternative choice to the LaCroix.

Yes, Somer is all about adapting to the threats at hand and picking the fights (I would say he is the epitome of the Warfighting principles espoused by Clausewitz). He is definately a lot more cerebral master then his "hill billy" monicker suggests.

The Lacroix's are a competitive choice (and definately a better first crew then Somer because of a strait forward playstyle), however they still share a lot of the "Gremlin" disadvantages, low Wp, small stature (both boon and curse), and self infliction of Wd's.

Off topic a bit but, Dumb Luck I have been following your Somer Diary thread with a lot of interest (and have posted some thoughts in it as well), dont lose faith, Somer takes a while to click. There is a lot of really good advice in there from a lot of seasoned Somer players.

[Shank Seamus!]

Hey,

I run a lacroix crew and so far I've had a fair chunk of success, havnt touched somer yer, so I won't mention him, although I do see them both as seperate lists.. mainly as Orphelia can't take piggies..

For a 35 SS game, (41) with orphelias henchman,

Orphelia,

3 young'ns (these little critters, believe it or not have the potential to be very heavy hitters!)

Raph (cus he's rock 'ard!)

Francois (like his hat)

Pere, (this guy depends, if there's lurers or obey'rs on the table, don't bother)

2 haulers (invaluable)

Then I cram the rest of my points with bayou gremlins,

The lacroixs can handle themselves, especially with a healer/hauler attached, orphelias drag a gremlin to base means the hauler can usually keep up and keep the healing on you,

the normal gremlins, ever been worried your opponent will take Hamlin and its all over? Not with these guys, run 5or 6 of these guys at him and (2)ya'll watch this.. dead hamelin... 12inch range, yes please! (0)deliverance, get away from my objective.. plus reckless.. honestly think any gremlin player who doesnt take breakthrough is giving vps away..

Just a few points from my experience

SS!

[Dumb Luck]

Good to hear you enjoyed the exploits of the diary, Omenbringer. I've had a few games recently with Somer that I haven't posted up on there purely because I don't think I've learnt anything that new. Most activations with the big guy boil down to Gettin Bros/Taking Swigs. I wouldn't say Somer himself is that more complicated than Ophelia really. Just a little less showy. All told, I think I have a pretty decent handle on the guy.

I am curious about the Pig heavy list. I have seen you speak its benefits many a time on this forum and yet, I can't seem to get it to work. Could I ask you to stick up a sample 35ss list with some pointers on good matchups and good scenarios for it?

By the way, my Somer crew is currently leading the shop league. Woop.

[Justin]

Good to hear you enjoyed the exploits of the diary, Omenbringer. I've had a few games recently with Somer that I haven't posted up on there purely because I don't think I've learnt anything that new. Most activations with the big guy boil down to Gettin Bros/Taking Swigs. I wouldn't say Somer himself is that more complicated than Ophelia really. Just a little less showy. All told, I think I have a pretty decent handle on the guy.

I am curious about the Pig heavy list. I have seen you speak its benefits many a time on this forum and yet, I can't seem to get it to work. Could I ask you to stick up a sample 35ss list with some pointers on good matchups and good scenarios for it?

By the way, my Somer crew is currently leading the shop league. Woop.

With what you have learned, do you have anything to add to the wiki?

Just curious, because as of this moment I'm the only one who has added content (lots of help editing) to his page, and that can be a narrow view point.

[Dumb Luck]

With what you have learned, do you have anything to add to the wiki?

Just curious, because as of this moment I'm the only one who has added content (lots of help editing) to his page, and that can be a narrow view point.

Nothing new to add on the Somer front, its all pretty comprehensive. The other Gremlin stuff I could get around to filling out.

[Omenbringer]

...ever been worried your opponent will take Hamlin and its all over? Not with these guys, run 5or 6 of these guys at him and (2)ya'll watch this.. dead hamelin... 12inch range, yes please! (0)deliverance, get away from my objective.. plus reckless.. honestly think any gremlin player who doesnt take breakthrough is giving vps away..

Just a few points from my experience

SS!

Hamelin still cant be targeted via Y'all watch this beacuse you are still making a Boomstick strike against him, meaning at best you are plinking him for 2 Wds and losing your Bayou Gremlin in the Process (with no way for Ophelia to replace and only doable once per Bayou Gremlin). Additionally Hamelin is at zero risk for the colateral Dg from Y'all watch this since you will be in his melee range and unable to shoot or out of his melee range in which case he doesn't care anyway.

Terrifying 11 isn't a worry for most models in the game (average living model Wp is 5, and a lot of models are completely immune since they are non-living). Additionally it only really stops the charge (nothing stopping them from just shooting or spelling you to death completely bypassing the Terrifying).

I am curious about the Pig heavy list. I have seen you speak its benefits many a time on this forum and yet, I can't seem to get it to work. Could I ask you to stick up a sample 35ss list with some pointers on good matchups and good scenarios for it?

By the way, my Somer crew is currently leading the shop league. Woop.

Sure, this is what I usually take

Pig Boomerang- 35 - Scrap

Som'er Teeth Jones

--

3 Pool

2 Giant Mosquitos [4ss]

• Bayou Gremlin
  [2ss]
  
  
• Bayou Gremlin
  [2ss]
  
  
• Hog Whisperer
  [5ss]
  
  
• Piglet
  [3ss]
  
  
• Piglet
  [3ss]
  
  
• Piglet
  [3ss]
  
  
• Piglet
  [3ss]
  
  
• Piglet
  [3ss]
  
  
• Slop Hauler
  [4ss]
  
  

Some times I'll massage the list to include a Gremlin Taxedermist for some more flexibility.

Just curious, because as of this moment I'm the only one who has added content (lots of help editing) to his page, and that can be a narrow view point.

I'll be getting of my ass here in a few days and posting some pig specific items (I have to finish up a course first).

[Justin]

Nothing new to add on the Somer front, its all pretty comprehensive. The other Gremlin stuff I could get around to filling out.

That would be fantastic. Same applies to Omen.

[Justin]

I'll be getting of my ass here in a few days and posting some pig specific items (I have to finish up a course first).

Ah, there we go then.

[Dumb Luck]

Best thing vs any Hamelin is Skeeters or Pere, since they don't target.

Cheers Omenbringer, I'll give that list a look in this week.

I might do a LaCroix page or two this evening.

[IronChief]

Hi folks,

Thanks for the input! It seems like if I want to play So'mer, some additional purchases are going to be necessary.

[Dumb Luck]

Totally worth it. Gremlins are so much fun.