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pandora?


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Ok I played again against Pandora yesterday, the first time I've ever played against her.. My opponent cast dementia on his own Pandora, then every time he took a walk action he took a walk action he also took a wp duel and pushed 4"... I was like ok thats a little nifty.

After the game he showed me some combo that Pandora can do that is just an endless chain of spamming incite and pacify.

So my question is how many sorrows can Pandora have linked to her?

Is casting dementia on Pandora a viable tactic?

And how many time can Pandora use her Incite and Pacify ability?

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Pandora can have any number of Sorrows linked to her. The practical maximum however is 3 since any more and they prevent her from moving (they're not Spirits so she cannot move through them) and Link will end if the models are not in base contact at the end of a turn.

EDIT: Pandora can cast Dementia on herself. However, for maximum effect you want someone else (Totem or Sorrow) to cast it so she will get one more chance for Fading Memory.

Pandora can use Incite/Pacify any number of times as long as each attempt succeeds. Stop her once and the Wp train halts there as she does not gain a new use from a failed Incite/Pacify. Also note that a model can only be affected by these abilities only once per turn, so she should run out of targets soon enough. Make sure your opponent is not using these on her own models, they only work on enemies.

-Ropetus

Edited by Ropetus
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Pandora can use Incite/Pacify any number of times as long as each attempt succeeds. Stop her once and the Wp train halts there as she does not gain a new use from a failed Incite/Pacify. Also note that a model can only be affected by these abilities only once per turn, so she should run out of targets soon enough. Make sure your opponent is not using these on her own models, they only work on enemies.

-Ropetus

As far as I can tell as soon as you use Incite you are stuck with only being able to cast more Incites. The same with Pacify. Am I right about this?

If

this model wins the WpDuel, it may choose to take the

Incite Action again this activation.

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You can cast Dementia on Pandora and this gives her a ton of relatively easy Wp Duels to fuel up Fading Memory and thus makes her insanely mobile. Just remember it's only her Totem that can cast it, she cannot target herself with the attack. Dispose of the Totem and that trick is gone.

-Ropetus

I totally believe you. But where does it say this in the rulebook? The only place I can find that you can't target yourself with attacks is in the rules for strikes, but Dementia is not a strike.

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Make sure you guys are using the V2 cards. There's a few erratas to Pandora and her crew in particular that you need to make sure you're using. Mainly in regards to not inciting/pacifying friendly models.

As Ropetus said, Pandora can't cast spells requiring a resist (eg. dementia) on herself. A totem can do it with magical extension, as can a linked Sorrow with Siphon Magic (now a (2) to cast rather than (all), as per the V2 cards).

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As far as I can tell as soon as you use Incite you are stuck with only being able to cast more Incites. The same with Pacify. Am I right about this?

Yup, your 100% correct about it. Once she chooses either incite or pacify, she is locked into it for the turn.

Also yeah, thankfully you can not perform an attack on yourself and attack has be errata'd to include a spell with a resist on it. So she can't do it to herself any more... but the totem trick is still a really cheap trick. A bit of an unsavory tactic in my opinion because she doesn't need it at all to win, it's sort a crutch tactic.

And wow a Pandora thread I was not immediately on top of! Damn you posting nearly 1am! *shakes fist*

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I'm with Ratty. The errata is for the Strike Attack Sequence targeting, not the spell targeting.

Models can still cast offensive spells on themselves as per the latest rules.

Errata has:

1. A spell with a resist is an attack.

2. Can't target yourself with Strikes.

It doesn't say anything about spells requiring resists without the melee or ranged icon.

Also, by this reading, Lilith couldn't use Transposition on herself, which is again, not specified by the RAW.

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I'm with Ratty. The errata is for the Strike Attack Sequence targeting, not the spell targeting.

Models can still cast offensive spells on themselves as per the latest rules.

Errata has:

1. A spell with a resist is an attack.

2. Can't target yourself with Strikes.

It doesn't say anything about spells requiring resists without the melee or ranged icon.

Also, by this reading, Lilith couldn't use Transposition on herself, which is again, not specified by the RAW.

Hmm looking over it again, I see what your saying.

But I'm content to just wait for the Rules manual at this point heh =) It will make things a lot easier.

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I've been ranting forever about the fact that models should NOT be able to cast spells with a resist on themselves - unfortunately though, this is not how it currently works - been told so by the Marshals many times now :/

Pandora is indeed able to cast Dementia on herself and by doing so can speed up even more (both 1" further from resisting her own cast compared to a Walk, but also by using her casting expert AP on targeting herself).

I can only hope that it has indeed changed in the rules manual and my major grief with the Malifaux core-rules will be back in order ^_^

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Yes she can. Some players are hopeing this will change with the new book but for now she can. I dont think this change will happen. From what I understand the point of the book is to add in the current changes and make the rules clear. I am sure some changes will happen for example the current ROE is gone in the new book I dont think they plan on changing how the game works much.

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You can cast Dementia on Pandora and this gives her a ton of relatively easy Wp Duels to fuel up Fading Memory and thus makes her insanely mobile. Just remember it's only her Totem that can cast it, she cannot target herself with the attack. Dispose of the Totem and that trick is gone.

Ropar rules man just so its covered. Sketch put out in this thread that models can target themselves with spells. As long as they are not strikes.

http://www.wyrd-games.net/forum/showthread.php?t=16744&highlight=target+model&page=2

This means that pandora can put the spell on herself her totem need not cast it. Unless there has been a change to this that we should be aware of. I am with wod on this one personaly I hope it gets changed.

Edited by tadaka
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That certainly does it in then.... she can cast Dementia on herself without needing her Totem to do it. Oh well. I think this was just one of those things unforseen when she was originally created and didn't quite make it through for V2.

But you know how you can help stop this being used? Just don't use it yourself =) There is a reason I never bring this up in my Tactica or in any strategy thread about Pandora. It's pure Cheese, and while that is completely fine to play that way... I just prefer not to and to not spread it around. Maybe at a later date it will get something like "This may not be cast on Pandora." but we will see.

@Phinite: She certainly can... but I wouldn't recommend doing it. It is a really cheap trick to pull off and you don't even need it to win with her. All you will do is make your opponents hate you and the master more, I heavily heavily recommend you don't use this trick.

Looks like this is settled at least, nice archeology Tadaka!

Edited by karn987
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so a little of topic, but i was told that it was errata-ed that any thing targeting you was considered a strike? at the time I didnt want to argue but this would be nice to know, since at the time An Alp was involved.

So spells DON'T cont as strikes?

Ummm not sure who told you that, but I think that person has their wires crossed. I'm rather sure and can not find anything in the current errata stating anything that targets you is a strike... Now there is errata stating what makes an attack and that includes spells with a resist.

But yeah... spells are NOT strikes. Even if they have a melee or ranged attack symbol, they are not strikes. They just becomes Melee attack Spells or Ranged Attack Spells as appropriate.

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