Sell me on Marcus.

[Jonas Albrecht]

I'm in the market for a new crew box, and Marcus has been someone who I've always been interested. I like his theme, and his crew models, but I'm interested in his play strengths and tactics. I read the tactica, and a scattering of Marcus threads, and now I'm ready to hear some cool stuff about him from his players.

[TimeLapse]

-puts on his best infomersal smile-

"Hi are you like most players intrested in a challange? well look no further then the markus boxset! One of the most diffacult to win with box sets.

This box set show cases Markus the most under powered master in the game. Though I am not saying he is worthless, he just a tad be behind those other masters so winning with him is a shure sign of a good player.

He has the uberobey skill that alows you to steal whole activations, he can heal other beasts and he has a lovely sidekick that turns into ugly things.

Now where other masters got a boost in the 2nd book markus got a bird that does not really need to be in his list, though he may think about it.

So play him now for 6 easy payments of of 3.00 plus tax and shipping.

But order in the next ten min, and recive his ever living totem! it will never really die unless markus dies or it dies. what a deal.

Edited November 13, 2010 by TimeLapse

[hippieshopper]

I am with you on this. I am looking to try him as well.

I have been a Resser for a long time and I've played with both the Shikome as well as the Rogue Necromancy, and I think these are toys I'd like to play with again using Marcus. He seems vastly different than the other masters I have played but it looks a little to me like he is the Beasty version of C. Hoffman.

Also, many people seem to classify him as an underdog of sorts, which makes me want to try him and beat them.

[nerdelemental]

He is an underdog and it is difficult to win with him in comparison to other masters. He's still one of my favorite to run.

Running him successfully is a lesson in developing tactics that defy what seems most logical. With a bunch of powerful beasts and the ability to hit like a freight train all on top of some of the fastest moving models in the game, it sure seems like he's a pedal to the metal kind of aggressive hitter. But that's why he dies a lot. Playing him is one of those masters and crews where you want to insist on playing to strategies and schemes if you're not already doing so and run him as an objective stealer. Lure the opposition in and then spring the trap. Keep Marcus back even though it's incredibly tempting to run him up (because he can) and use him as cleanup. Personally, I think Razorspines are best with him and I use Razorspines to charge into one target and then charge away to another. Marcus will activate after and come in for the killing blow(s) against the first target. The opposition will be tied up dealing with the Razorspine and next turn Marcus will be in a position to take down whatever his snake went after. If you leave Marcus exposed he'll get killed.

Raptors don't seem worth a hill of beans in his list. Shikome, however, are amazing. Many people use Molemen but I find they're so stupidly slow in an otherwise incredibly fast list that I cannot even stomach to field them any longer. Silurid make many players happy and run them like I do my snakes (and they're cheaper) but I find them to lack the punch and durability I'm used to.

Once you really know him well you can switch his tactics entirely mid-game. Instead of that one-two-punch combo, when you see everything clumping together in the center for a slugfest, that's when you can switch it to the "obey enemy beasts" mode and hopefully tag something big into a beast and then make it slap the opposition's secondary threat, also taking the bigger threat out for that turn.

He is tricky and won't easily win you games. Even fielding him with a lot of comfort and confidence I still have to really take my time and think it through. It's part of what I love about him. No easy button but a ton of versatility. There's always something neat to do. Turns are never the same twice.

[Jonas Albrecht]

A lot of cool information there. What about Myranda? How well does she support Marcus?

[Iamwyrd]

Well turning myranda into a shikome and hunting partnering with another is pretty good. I've played him a couple of times and he is to the T kind of master. Like nerd said you really have to defy all logic when playing him. You really need to stick to your strategy and schemes. If you get slaughter try your hardest, he hits like a train/can hit like a train. I just wish his alpha was only a one action that can only be done to a model that he turned into a beast. Cause you will really have to play it right to be able to alpha a beast that you created. He's still fun, and one of my regulars is trying to perfect him, and he has won two out of his three games. But it is still in the making.

[Jonas Albrecht]

I just wish his alpha was only a one action that can only be done to a model that he turned into a beast.

Is Feral no longer a (0) action?

[nerdelemental]

He's one of those masters, too, that might demonstrate some forward thinking: In Book I he seemed truly the weakest and now with Book II he's a bit more competitive. In the future he may have so many options that allow him to fulfill any task with ease.

Even now, the question about Myranda is proof of Marcus' flexibility. She can offer some tricks where she can start as one creature and turn into another mid-activation but my builds are so geared to a crazy alpha-strike that her screwing around and tweaking out her form and absorbing too many decent cards just never seems to pay off. But he can play a different board control game, too, and that's where she comes in handier and then i like to bring those dumb molemen, etc. He just changes the way he plays with so many different build options.

I still like him with two snakes and a cerberus and then filler. Ironically, further defying logic: he doesn't really need any beasts in his lists. All he offers them is healing and if you're running him like I like to then there's no time for those shenanigans. I've tried him with a Steamborg to good effect and I'm wondering if a pair of Coryphee will help that hit and run that he does. Think of him as the bodyguard or support piece and your game usually skyrockets.

[Jonas Albrecht]

Heh, Myranda also seems like you'd need just as many figures as your average Nicodem army.

But her ability to shapeshift really makes her seem invaluable. She's exactly whatever you need her to be.

Dunno yet though, as I haven't played her. I can say this though, The Order of the Chimera sounds like it'll be my next box. I'll have to figure out how to play them against the "top tier" Masters.

[Jonas Albrecht]

And while on the subject of Myranda, I understand that when shapeshifting, she has access to everything but the Beast's spells. I have no idea where this rule is. I've checked the book, the errata, the extra errata, the FAQ, and the resolved rules board.

[velri]

I think book 2 made myranda alot more appealing. When you take her with a lawyer you get alot more versatility out of either shapeshifting to beat face or sit back at cast some spiffy magic at people. Her casting roar after a howl from marcus is still very fun to do.

I also agree about the moleman thing way to slow. I prefer waldgeists only armor 2, but a decent chunk of health, alot faster, and decent combat (great combat if there are woods around).

[TimeLapse]

Night Terrors might be intresting to play around with as well with there ablity to lower WP mix that in with markus and you can make a singel model wp-5. That and he can limit shooter based lists witch is one of the harder lists for markus to deal with.

Rogue Necromancy is awesome, but I never played with one in a list before where I payed its SS cost, though 10ss for what it can do is worth in in a markus list if you ask me.

Thinking out of the beast box, the Mechancal Rider might find this an intresting list to live in as well as the gunsmith.

What Markus lacked in book one was a solid low cost minion that was a good all around model that was also a beast. Like witchling stakers and the like. he still kinda lacks that but you can add Night Terrors and Raptors if you want a list that has lots of models to chose from. In short he is a bit more flexable.

I think alot of players get lost in the hoarcat pride tactic that alows them to devour hight 2 models they tend to get stuck there and get mad when it never really works.

The Jackalope I see as a feild medic casting the healing spell from markus when ever it can, and for 1ss I am like why not add him? its like the grave spirit, if you dont use another totem, and you have one Soulstone why not bring it. I mean if you find you really need another SS why not just drain its soul and gain another one (one of the forgotten rules, that no one remembers or uses)

One thing I will say is dont get all hung up on trying to do alpha, it only has a 8 inch range and it takes both your actions, if you focus too hard on getting this one spell off you will be disapointed, instead focus on useing his other spells like Wild heart and primal flame, he is one of the few models that can give a healing flip to his army, healing is vary powerful in the game.

Well those where some thoughts I had when thinking about Markus, I hope they may prove useful.

-Andrew

[TimeLapse]

What Markus lacked in book one was a solid low cost minion that was a good all around model that was also a beast. Like witchling stakers and the like. he still kinda lacks that but you can add Night Terrors and Raptors if you want a list that has lots of models to chose from. In short he is a bit more flexable.

Totally missed that Silurids are beasts, where they are not as cheep as i would want them to be they are solid models and do well for there cost, though a nice 3-4ss model would be nice, something with both a basice range and basic melee.

[hippieshopper]

And while on the subject of Myranda, I understand that when shapeshifting, she has access to everything but the Beast's spells. I have no idea where this rule is. I've checked the book, the errata, the extra errata, the FAQ, and the resolved rules board.

It's in the beginning of the first book, around 30-38 I think.

It's under the heading "Summoning".

[oozeboss]

To summarise:

* there is more animal lurrrve in this crew than on an NRL club (aka - the Notional Rupert's League) pre-season bonding session;

* if you lose you're obviously still on his infamous learning curve & everybody will think you an utter hero for having the guts to run him;

and

* if you win, you're obviously an utter gaming god and everybody will think that you're an utter genius who should father their first born.

Hope that helps.

:marcus(dude)

[hippieshopper]

Oh yeah, I am totally the reincarnation of Sun Tzu and Zhuge Liang...

=D

I just like his crew, and well...I wanted to try someone different. I want to try Ramos as well but out of the 14 people we have overall...6 of them are "hardcore" enough to show up on Thursdays to play and out of that number...4 of them have or routinely play Ramos.

This is why I play the ressers (besides my love for all things zombie), we are a minority here, there are only 3 Ressers, and I am the only one who shows up every time. I am also the only one with more than one Resser master.

But there really is no comparison to Ramos and Marcus other than that they are on the same team. Well, they both can heal too, but I'll stop with that.

[Koali]

Look at the Rules for Shapeshifting in the book

[Jonas Albrecht]

Thanks folks, this has been very informational. I think I will try out each of the beasts in turn. Even the Ressurrectionist ones, though I'm less keen on the Shikome.

[hippieshopper]

Me too, I personally love the rogue necromancy though.

He's a few points more than the Cerberus, but you get your SS' worth.

[nerdelemental]

Thanks folks, this has been very informational. I think I will try out each of the beasts in turn. Even the Ressurrectionist ones, though I'm less keen on the Shikome.

So many choices for him now...

Try two Shikome, each declaring a different prey. Stick them close to Marcus and he will have the choice of either of their prey for himself. A hunting pack.

Really, to succeed with him I do run my tactics thinking of a pack with Marcus in it. Then one to three other hitters to distract and poke at different things. Keep the pack with Marcus in it close to one another and assume it'll take two models to take down something oppositional (my run has Marcus activating last in the group of two to three).

[hippieshopper]

From what I am gathering from all of this and these tactica...he seems like a hit and run master.

I don't know because I am too lazy to buy his box...

[Rathnard]

I'm pretty keen on starting up a Marcus Crew as well. I've bought the starter box + Jackalope and with the Silurid and Walgeist from my Neverborn colection, I should have the makings of a decent crew.

I generally have a policy of not buying more than one pack of any given model, but I'm really tempted to break that with the Razorspine Rattler. He's my favorite sculpt in the starter and I really like his style. In a single activation he can charge into combat, hit something then charge a friendly minion to get him back to safety. Or it could charge two different models for a 26" total reach and the potential to get around a flank to hit the model you really want to engage.

Myranda? Hmm, aside from using her for a better Roar, I'm having trouble seeing her usefulness with Marcus. In 35SS she's probably got some utility as a support minion, but I really need to see her on the tabletop.

Night Terrors might be intresting to play around with as well with there ablity to lower WP mix that in with markus and you can make a singel model wp-5. That and he can limit shooter based lists witch is one of the harder lists for markus to deal with.

Ooh, this is a very good point. When I initially looked at Night Terrors I'd dismissed them out of hand. With Cb 3 I just didn't rate them as worth the 3SS investment, even against shooting crews. But the -2 Wp trigger on a spell that can't be resisted is actually pretty useful for a Marcus crew. The anti-range is a nice bonus, but I'm not convinced I'd take them just for that.

It seems to me that there are three basic tactics for a Marcus crew;

1. Abusing Roar from the Cerebrus, assisted by Marcus, possibly Night Terrors (for the Wp lower) and Myranda (for the higher Ca). Marcus and Myranda's ability to companion beasts should help you pull it off in a single activation if needed.

2. Throwing Alpha on a big beastie. Raptors can help (though I have my doubts - you still need to hit with the things AND get the trigger off), as can Night Terrors (Once again, for the Wp lower).

3. Hit and Run. Silurids, the Razorspine and the Cerebrus (to a lesser extent) all have the ability to charge in and get out again before finishing their activation. Come to think of it, the Night Terrors can potentially do the same with their flock ability. Marcus is less capable, but stare down plus wild heart can keep him safe from retaliation.

Hit and Run definitely seems like the main playstyle for Marcus, with Roar/Alpha being the sort of tactics you can plan for, but shouldn't focus on as your main strategy.

One more random thought - as cheap, fast and non-insignificant (if you have enough Raptors) minions, Night Terrors and Raptors are probably quite handy for fulfilling strategies and schemes that require models to interact with objectives, or just be somewhere at a certain time. So they can spend part of the game being a pain in the arse and supporting your crew, and the rest of the game fulfilling your objectives.