Forced to play Gremlins, need your advice

[geistwald]

With a fistful of luck and a smack of skill, my Marcus crew just managed to win our first local Malifaux tournament. The prize was the Som'er Teeth Jones box set + 1 Hog Whisperer blister, and I got sentenced to play gremlins the next event. Now I obviously have to do some shopping to reach the 35 pts level, but for the present I can't see how many models do I need to run my gremlin crew. For example I know that I need 2-3 Piglets and Mosquitos, but can't imagine how many extra pieces usually come to the board due to summoning and multiplying. My first catch is like:

1 Som'er Teeth Jones

1 Warpig (seems to be enough)

5 Bayou Gremlins (2-3 to field)

4 Mosquitos (awesomeness)

4 Piglets (2-3 to field)

2 Hog Whisperers (3rd one seems to be an overkill)

What do you think, do I need more or less pieces of any kind? (Supposing that I don't plan to play spam lists of 18 Bayou Gremlins or something.) By the way, what is your average all-comer Jones crew at 30-35 points level?

Thanks for your help in advance!

[eusebe]

After my first experiments, I think that

Hire piglets at the beginning of the game is not a good idea, they are weak, just maybe one cause they run fast.

2 Hog whisperers are fine if you need them, and on my opinion you only need them if you have two warpigs.

warpigs are big, warpigs are cool, I love them.

Hire 4 mosquitos at the beginning is a little overexpensive.

So I would play

Somer teeth

One warpigs (8)

hog whisperer (5)

5 gremlins (10)

2 mosquito (4)

1 piglet (3)

5 soulstones.

or with 6 gremlins and 3 soulstones.

[Nick]

Meh,, I'd go for at least 2 piglets in the begining,, they're ideal for objectives like reconnoiter or treasure hunt,, and with their stampeding, and their high defence, they're pretty good for what they cost.. So I'd go for:

Somer teeth

One warpigs (8)

hog whisperer (5)

3 gremlins (6)

2 mosquito (4)

3 piglet (9)

3 soulstones.

Or I'd go for 2 pigs and 4 gremlins,, leaving you 4 SS..

[goblyn13]

This thread might be helpful

http://wyrd-games.net/forum/showthread.php?t=10472

[geistwald]

Thanks for the info.

I tried to read through the mentioned thread, but haven't found anything about the extra models required to play, e.g. how many extra goblins / piglets / etc. do I need in addition to my crew. I don't really like to put empty bases in play because I don't have a third, fourth or seventh pig in my case. Does any thumb-rule exist like 1,5×(goblins in crew) hit the board in your average game?

Anyways, I'll try the following: 2 mosquitos, 1 warpig, 1 whisperer, 4 gremlins, 2 piglet, 4 ss. We'll see...

[Gremlin Swarm]

I usually go with a lot of Gremlins.

I've faced my friend's force with 1 or 2 Warpigs, and those things are a real pain to deal with, despite being fairly easy to wound.

I'd be tempted to add another Gremlin, or maybe drop 1 or both piglets (since you can summon them into the game) for more Gremlins, but it really depends on your playing style.

If you prefer the tank-like approach, go with more pigs. If you like to swarm, go with more Gremlins (and maybe more Mosquitoes.) Needless to say, I like to swarm with this crew.

My friend uses Warpigs, and I tend to swarm, and we seem to do about the same so far as wins/losses go. He usually has 3 or 4 Gremlins and 1 or 2 Warpigs, while I might have anything up to 10 or even 12 Gremlins. I've also gone Mosquito heavy, with similar results.

I know this is kinda vague, but there's no real hard and fast rule for how many Gremlins/etc. is a good number.

BTW--Don't forget that your Warpig can do useful things when it's not stampeding (like Eat Anything, which is great for frustrating all those Scavengers and Graverobbers).

Whatever you go with, just have fun. Gremlins are hard to play (unless you're a finesse nut with your armies), but they're a blast if you don't get too crazy-serious about it. (Ah usu'lly git a bit silly doin' voysez an'such durin' da gaym.)

[thaehl]

Som'er is by far one of my Fav. armies, I see him as one of the best lists in the game if used properly, His Boom stick though inaccurite is a powerful asset and take a swig is be far one of the more effective healing abilities in the game, i often will cast get yer bro then reckless him to take a swig both gremlins, duplicating models is never bad, the masquito trick is classic and amazing. the gremlins are a fantastic deal at two points and anyone who cant see that needs to take a look at the high defence, non insignifigant swarm you have at your disposal, they have a twelve range on every little guy, you cant go wrong, remember Malifaux being an objective based game, more signifigants almost always wins reconnoiter, claim jump, breakthrough, treasure hunt, and keeps the opponent from obtaining most objectives.

[Gremlin Swarm]

The down side to the Gremlins is that they're fairly easy to take out.

That said, thael is right about the swarm potential. (I've used it to good effect--as if it weren't already obvious.)

All-in-all, the Gremlins are a difficult crew to play, but can be quite effective if used right. (Every war/skirmish game seems to have one of these.)

Edited June 2, 2010 by Gremlin Swarm

[Omenbringer]

Thanks for the info.

I tried to read through the mentioned thread, but haven't found anything about the extra models required to play, e.g. how many extra goblins / piglets / etc. do I need in addition to my crew. I don't really like to put empty bases in play because I don't have a third, fourth or seventh pig in my case. Does any thumb-rule exist like 1,5×(goblins in crew) hit the board in your average game?

Anyways, I'll try the following: 2 mosquitos, 1 warpig, 1 whisperer, 4 gremlins, 2 piglet, 4 ss. We'll see...

Aside from the Starter Set which comes with Som'er, 4 Bayou Gremlins and the Warpig:

1) 2 Hog Whisperers (for running the Pig Boomerang)

2) 1 additional blister of Gremlins (for summoning shenanigans)

3) 1 additional blister of Piglets (this will give you 5 with the two hog whisperers though you usually wont use more then 3)

4) 2 Skeeters will be more then enough (I use them mainly for the Pig boomerang, some may argue for 4 but since they are no longer immune to Dg from "Pull my Finger" and insignificant they really dont do a whole lot for me).

Though Som'er can summon more Bayou's they are expendable and die pretty easily (to enemy fire and "Whoops!") so you shouldn't ever have more then 8 at a time. The Piglets can only be made in game by Som'ers "Come and Get it" trigger in melee so dont count on having more then maybe 4 at a time.

My usual list at 35 SS is:

Som'er

2 Hog Whisperers

1 Warpig

2 Piglets

2-3 Bayou Gremlins

2 Skeeters

* with 1-3 SS for the Cache

At 30 SS I just drop the 2nd Hog Whisperer.

The above gives me 6-7 models to claim objectives/complete schemes and strategies, a very manueverable pig strike force, a decent starting Gremlin Gunline, and the potential for direct damage spam from Skeeters.

[Gremlin Swarm]

Don't forget those speedy mosquitoes can grab objective markers, even if they're insignificant, and carry them to a model that is significant.

The piglets are even better for this (though a bit slower), since they can get rid of insignificant temporarily.

Then there's scooping up counters (scrap and corpse) to keep them away from opposing models who could use them. It might well be worth the couple of stones to have a hard-to-hit model zipping around scooping those up.

As usual, it really depends on your play style with this crew.

[Omenbringer]

Just remember that models lose fly when carrying the treasure counters.

[Q'iq'el]

Then there's scooping up counters (scrap and corpse) to keep them away from opposing models who could use them. It might well be worth the couple of stones to have a hard-to-hit model zipping around scooping those up.

Am I missing something? The mosquito is neither a graverobber nor a scavenger, so it can't pick these counters up, can it?

The Warpig can sacrifice corpse counters to heal, but that's about it, as far as I know.

[Omenbringer]

post deleted so as not to confuse future readers. As noted below Page 24 states that only models which can use the counters may pick them up.

Edited June 5, 2010 by Omenbringer

[Q'iq'el]

If another model has an ability that causes the counter to drop then the counter drops. From that point any model can pick it up

This is contrary to the rules from page 24, Counters section: "Models may only pick up counter types which they are able to use".

If anyone could pick up counters, then abilities designed specifically to destroy counters of certain type wouldn't be anything special. The point is only some opponents can mess up with other side counters.

AFAIK Giant Mosquitos can't do it.

[Omenbringer]

Good catch, had to look that one up again in the FAQ and Errata.

[Cherubis]

Has anyone tried a piglet swarm? Does it work? Or is it more economical to just take a little bit of everything? I like the idea of unleashing 8-10 pigs...

[Omenbringer]

It is difficult to control that many pigs without the hog whisperers and skeeters, orchestrating the charge. And without them assisting the Pigs aren't as nasty.

[ChaosLenny]

My buddy plays Gremlins so though I don't play em I fight them most of the time...the pig swarm doesn't work out all that well (it didn't when he tried it a few times)...oddly he's been having a lot of success with the straight out the box crew, one hog whisperer and the four piglets...one thing I've noticed if you play conservative with Som'er using get your bro and take a swig...then send you pigs out forward he does really well...Gremlins are tricky crew though took him a few games to get how to use em best...again best piece of advice don't use Som'er like Lady Justice or Lilith going full bore if he hangs back with his boys and heals and summons the little bastards are vicious:)

[Gremlin Swarm]

I've used Som'er with a whole slew of Gremlins (big surprise), and it's done fairly well. Lots and lots of Y'all Watch This with Dumb Luck--brutal. (Of course, I've knocked off about twice as many Gremlins as my opponent doing this.)

Remember that even though an insignificant model doesn't count for victory conditions, it can still drag an objective counter (I'm thinking specifically of the treasure marker for Treasure Hunt here) back to where it needs to be, and then hand it off to a non-insignificant model. The mosquito may lose flight doing this, but it still moves 10". Even better with a piglet, since they can lose insgnificant temporarily (until the start draw phase) by using Root Around.

A friend of mine, however, prefers to use 1 or 2 warpigs, and does okay with that set up for his crew.

It really comes down to your play style.