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Tactica: Outcasts - a work in progress


Massaen

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Also - where you've copied and pasted some of the stuff I've said, *twitch*, you've just lumped totally opposing oppinions in the same breath.

True, you started this thing, but I'd really prefer if you didn't appoint yourself editor of the lot.

The final version will be a more cohesive product - thing is though, i have a life and family and did not have time to edit it properly so i 'lumped' it all in so as to at least show your opinions.

As for the editor - if you want to do it be my guest. I started the thread to help the community and as such, ended up editing it. If you want to write a comprehensive entry for one or more of the models be my guest.

I was trying to help:hmmmm:

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I only scanned through the first read of the whole thing, so I just noticed this:

"the ability to affect both models with any effect makes combining them with the student of conflict particularly nasty."

That ability only applies to spells, and the student of conflict's "assist" is not a spell, so it would not affect both Victorias, if that's what you meant by this.

Of course, I was wrong earlier today. *shrug*

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I'm not being remotley offensive - just stating a preference. I'd rather this thread as a whole was a repository for a debate, not something to be chopped down into the original post.

Bare in mind - we live in a society today where it's okay to disagree with somebody without telling them they're an asshole. I'm sure he had the best of intentions, which is why - with all possible civility, I asked that he not in future.

Sidenote - yeah, Fates Entwined sounds like it's awesome, but I can't really find many things to abuse it with. So far the only ideas I've had with it are pairing them up with Rasputina, so she can give them both armour, and if one's next to her while she's white-outing, I'm pretty sure that it's a spell effect which gives her cover - so the other one would automatically be permanently in cover. That said - an armour 2 permanently in cover whirling death copter viktoria sounds kinda neat.

EDIT: However - take them as a second for a ressurectionist master in a brawl for slaughter, and late game pump them full of combat drugs. They'll clear half the table before they fall over xD

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I'm not being remotley offensive - just stating a preference. I'd rather this thread as a whole was a repository for a debate, not something to be chopped down into the original post.

Bare in mind - we live in a society today where it's okay to disagree with somebody without telling them they're an asshole. I'm sure he had the best of intentions, which is why - with all possible civility, I asked that he not in future.

Sidenote - yeah, Fates Entwined sounds like it's awesome, but I can't really find many things to abuse it with. So far the only ideas I've had with it are pairing them up with Rasputina, so she can give them both armour, and if one's next to her while she's white-outing, I'm pretty sure that it's a spell effect which gives her cover - so the other one would automatically be permanently in cover. That said - an armour 2 permanently in cover whirling death copter viktoria sounds kinda neat.

EDIT: However - take them as a second for a ressurectionist master in a brawl for slaughter, and late game pump them full of combat drugs. They'll clear half the table before they fall over xD

It could be good to affect each of them with obey cast from a friendly master and get a free action out of each. Or affect each with lure. Although now that I've looked through the spells, I have a lot of questions about this ability...

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  • 3 weeks later...

I have been wondering with the student of conflict interactions as well.

I guess technically, you could put Fast on one Viktoria, get the other Viki into combat with something and use Sisters in Spirit to bring the fast Viki over... (but fast on both would be nice too)

One other bummer with the totems is that you can't really use magical extension to cast Sisters in Battle. Since it's Rng: Caster, casting through the totem would not target a Viki technically. And it can't cast any of her other freaking spells. :banghead:

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I have been wondering with the student of conflict interactions as well.

I guess technically, you could put Fast on one Viktoria, get the other Viki into combat with something and use Sisters in Spirit to bring the fast Viki over... (but fast on both would be nice too)

One other bummer with the totems is that you can't really use magical extension to cast Sisters in Battle. Since it's Rng: Caster, casting through the totem would not target a Viki technically. And it can't cast any of her other freaking spells. :banghead:

True, but at least it can be affected by multiple instances of sisters in victory, since it's not a victoria.:D

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  • 2 months later...
The Vitorias

That said - pray your opponent doesnt get assassinate, and never, eevveerr use bodyguard on them ^^ Made that mistake too many times.

Both of these are good for the Viks. Assassinate is much harder to accomplish with 2 masters on the board. Bodyguard says choose one of your Masters. The Viks are one of your Masters, so as long as you can keep one alive (witch shouldn't be that hard as you can make more if needed) your good to go. The Bodyguard thing is what WEiRD sKeTCH told me at the last tournament.

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  • 1 month later...

Okay.. This thread might be long dead and all, but as it should be an ever evolving Tactica I'll revive it anyway..

I'm a new player and just got the rulebook and a few of the starter sets (unfortunately the Viktorias were sold out at the time so got some random sets without knowing the rules thinking that I'd probably end up with most of them eventually anyway).

I've now read most of the book and have a few questions to various of the models and as they mostly refer to the usage of the models, rather than the actual rules I thought it fitting to post here.

Okay! The real post starts here:

Viktorias:

It's stated in the first post that Student of Conflict giving one fast affects the other.. I don't see why this would happen as 'Assist' isn't a spell, but rather an action..

The 'Sisters in Battle' seems great, but I can only ever imagine using the 'Fury', what makes the other two options for it worth using at all?

'Unerring Accuracy' says it's only applied after you actually hit (so it'll -never- be better than 'Unfailing').

'Unfailing' would under rare circumstances improve damage by 3, mostly though it would increase it by less than 2 making it clearly inferior to 'Fury'.

Leveticus:

He seems too complex for me to mess around with any time soon, but.. If you actively try to kill him yourself, how do you prevent the enemy from just blasting the Hollow Waif once you succeed? They seem terribly fragile at best, and if they're continuously summoned to the front of the battle (where I assume Leveticus would be) it's not like you can easily hide them, is it?

Rusty Alice:

Now I'm a bit confused about the wording on 'Something to Live For', if played with Leve, when do you get to draw extra cards? It doesn't directly affect the maximum handsize like 'Arcane Reservoir' or 'Ill-Fated' does.

Striclty from the rules it would only ever work on the very first turn, what am I missing (as I'm sure I must be wrong)?

Lady Hammerstrike:

Has anyone ever found a use for 'Menace'? At first it seemed great, locking the enemy in place while staying outside their reach still able to swing your hammer at them up to 3" away, then I read the FAQ that people can resist with Wp it now seems utterly useless to me as I think even the lowest Wp in the game is still considerable higher than Taelor's Ca.

Finally I hope I'm not sounding too negative (I really don't intend to), but I find this to be a great overview, but a rather poor tactica as there isn't really any tactics to be found (except a few gems here and there throughout the entire thread..). I think maybe a different section for each of the masters as on the other boards had worked better?

Cheers and thanks~!

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Rusty Alice:

Now I'm a bit confused about the wording on 'Something to Live For', if played with Leve, when do you get to draw extra cards? It doesn't directly affect the maximum handsize like 'Arcane Reservoir' or 'Ill-Fated' does.

Striclty from the rules it would only ever work on the very first turn, what am I missing (as I'm sure I must be wrong)?

Empty Inside

Replace “…do not draw cards…” with “…draw 0 cards…”

So I am guessing - Leveticus draws 2 Control Cards during the Draw Phase when he is within 3" of Alyce at the start of the Draw Phase.
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Viktorias:

It's stated in the first post that Student of Conflict giving one fast affects the other.. I don't see why this would happen as 'Assist' isn't a spell, but rather an action..

The 'Sisters in Battle' seems great, but I can only ever imagine using the 'Fury', what makes the other two options for it worth using at all?

'Unerring Accuracy' says it's only applied after you actually hit (so it'll -never- be better than 'Unfailing').

'Unfailing' would under rare circumstances improve damage by 3, mostly though it would increase it by less than 2 making it clearly inferior to 'Fury'.

Viktorias are not both affected by Fast, nope.

As to Unfailing it says 'attack flips'. Not 'damage flips'. That means when you're taking a Sword Swing or Pistol Shot with Bounty Hunter Vik, you flip two cards and pick the highest for your 'to-hit' attack. That's different from damage.

Unerring Accuracy should never, ever, ever be used, since it doesn't do anything.

Leveticus:

He seems too complex for me to mess around with any time soon, but.. If you actively try to kill him yourself, how do you prevent the enemy from just blasting the Hollow Waif once you succeed? They seem terribly fragile at best, and if they're continuously summoned to the front of the battle (where I assume Leveticus would be) it's not like you can easily hide them, is it?

Leveticus is actually extremely 'survivable'. You can make a hollow waif easily the second turn, and they stick around forever as soon as you get them. At the end of a turn, Summon (or place, as the new errata may have it), to within 6 of a Hollow Waif. Then remove all hollow waifs in play and summon them within 6 of Levi. This means you can put them in closets, and behind walls, and other hard to reach locations. The Waifs only get 1 AP that must be used to walk though, so that's somewhat of a compensation.

He is very, very potent. Trust me.

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So I am guessing - Leveticus draws 2 Control Cards during the Draw Phase when he is within 3" of Alyce at the start of the Draw Phase.

Ah yes, I'm certain this is how it works..

Though Alyce's rule is the more general of the two, so was thinking that even with the rewording Leveticus' more specific rule 'draw 0' would still take precedence.

Viktorias are not both affected by Fast, nope.

Such a shame, really hoped I was missing something critical :)

As to Unfailing it says 'attack flips'. Not 'damage flips'. That means when you're taking a Sword Swing or Pistol Shot with Bounty Hunter Vik, you flip two cards and pick the highest for your 'to-hit' attack. That's different from damage.

Unerring Accuracy should never, ever, ever be used, since it doesn't do anything.

Haha.. Rookie mistake on my part, sorry about that, obviously makes the Unfailing alot better.

Leveticus is actually extremely 'survivable'. You can make a hollow waif easily the second turn, and they stick around forever as soon as you get them. At the end of a turn, Summon (or place, as the new errata may have it), to within 6 of a Hollow Waif. Then remove all hollow waifs in play and summon them within 6 of Levi. This means you can put them in closets, and behind walls, and other hard to reach locations. The Waifs only get 1 AP that must be used to walk though, so that's somewhat of a compensation.

He is very, very potent. Trust me.

I see.. Guess terrain is really critical to Leveticus then, protecting them in the open would still be a tough thing to do.

Also need to get TLOS out of my head when thinking about how the rules work.

Thanks and sorry for the bother~!

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  • 2 months later...

I'd like to try to put my two cents into this, if I could. I'll write this using book 1 format (errata and edits to come later) and keep in mind, I've never played this model in the field.. yet, though I do own him.

Jack Daw - ... is vicious. At a cost of 9 soulstones, he seems expensive. However, most people would agree that he's worth every stone. As far as Masters' go, you have to be careful as to who you pair him with. If you bring along his Hanged friends (and him), they're likely to "betray" you if you flip the Black Joker on either model. Thus, giving your opponent control of Jack or the Hanged (which ever flipped it). Someone like Leveticus or Nicodem aren't effected by this, as they can hire the Hanged without Jack Daw, leaving only Jack to the betraying. Also one side note - Masks flipped by Jack in a Resist Duel are also considered 0's so be careful and pay attention when cheating fate.

Aside from those few down sides, let's take a look at the good things. Jack comes with his own scheme, giving you a VP is he's alive at the end of the encounter and killed at least 1 model. Don't let him die because your opponent will gain 1 VP for doing so. The beauty of Jack Daw is that he can only be harmed by spells, focused attacks, or magical weapons. About 60% of the models in this game don't have any number of those. For the most part Jack Daw won't go down easily, and if he does, you can use a SS or Control Card to keep him around. Playing him with Leveticus is ideal in this situation as Control Cards aren't priority in his crews. Pulling off a successful trigger can turn the table around on your opponent leaving them without cards to cheat fate with. Though, you could completely relieve everyone of cheating fate with Jack if you wanted to. His triggers alone, though, will render your opponent speechless. But then you can tell them you just getting started. :D Throw in the hanging tree and you've just unleashed one mad hanging victim.

(That's all I've got for now. If anyone wants to add to it or correct me on some things, feel free to do so. I'm open to it. There are many more strategies for him so he'll probably have a huge part.)

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  • 2 months later...

so I found a LOVELY combo with the SPA's and Ashes and Dust. though I'm sure I'm not the first.

You take 4 SPA's, as the rules thread I posted you CAN leap frog them to put ones that haven't activated yet up front so when they walk they carry the other three. This is important.

So you push them all the way up as far as you can across the board and then when the last punk activates you walk, and then (1) action, Place the Desolation Engine, and then begin to wreck face!

now the Ashes and Dust will activate and walk once, then Zero Action. Contort! Push this model ALL The Way! to the Desolation Engine [[10' range though so...]] but anyway, now you have 25 points of absolute rape and evil most likely on their side of the board. lol And if your lucky you might meet one of their models half way, and possibly earn yourself another SPA.

one last note! How many Desolation Engines have you guys manage to have out at one time?

I peeked at one Deso, and 3 SPA's, then my Deso died and I manage to pick him back up same turn. lol

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Doesn't contort require you to deal wd to the two models moving together?

it deals 3 wounds split up between the model he pushed to in anyway. IE Deso takes 3, Ashes takes 0, or 2-1 or whatever.

also! if you do the whole, Deso takes 3, and Ashes takes 0, then you can just use, "Dominate Abomination" and force the Deso to make a melee strike therefor, healing him with Consuming Touch.

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