Stand and fire

[thunderwolf]

Am I right in thinking if I charge the rifleman and get to engage them then they don’t get stand and fire as they now engaged ?

[TheUnseemlyOne]

Yes

[Mortarion]

No. I would say the Rifleman can still use Stand and fire as the charging model resolved the Charge action within 8" while the Rifleman was unengaged. Stand and fire does not state that it is resolved after the Charge action.

[thunderwolf]

It does say enemy models that resolve the charge action so I’d think it’s after it’s resolved ?

[Mortarion]

55 minutes ago, thunderwolf said:

It does say enemy models that resolve the charge action so I’d think it’s after it’s resolved ?

It says "enemy models that resolve", not "after an enemy model resolves".

Compare Stand and fire with Perdita's Finger on the trigger. Finger on the trigger states that the effect happens after the Charge move. Another comparison would be with Scamper, which states "after resolving the current Action or Ability". There are quite a lot of examples of similiar wordings. But Stand and fire uses a different wording. It says "that resolve". Present. When it is resolved.

[solkan]

1 hour ago, Mortarion said:

It says "enemy models that resolve", not "after an enemy model resolves".

Compare Stand and fire with Perdita's Finger on the trigger. Finger on the trigger states that the effect happens after the Charge move. Another comparison would be with Scamper, which states "after resolving the current Action or Ability". There are quite a lot of examples of similiar wordings. But Stand and fire uses a different wording. It says "that resolve". Present. When it is resolved.

 

1 hour ago, Mortarion said:

It says "enemy models that resolve", not "after an enemy model resolves".

Compare Stand and fire with Perdita's Finger on the trigger. Finger on the trigger states that the effect happens after the Charge move. Another comparison would be with Scamper, which states "after resolving the current Action or Ability". There are quite a lot of examples of similiar wordings. But Stand and fire uses a different wording. It says "that resolve". Present. When it is resolved.

For the record, please specify the result of this situation as you understand the rules (where does the model suffer the wound):

A model with one wound remaining declares a Charge action within the Stand and Fire aura.

[TheUnseemlyOne]

11 hours ago, Mortarion said:

It says "enemy models that resolve", not "after an enemy model resolves".

Compare Stand and fire with Perdita's Finger on the trigger. Finger on the trigger states that the effect happens after the Charge move. Another comparison would be with Scamper, which states "after resolving the current Action or Ability". There are quite a lot of examples of similiar wordings. But Stand and fire uses a different wording. It says "that resolve". Present. When it is resolved.

There are other differing wordings that happen at the same timing step, like “when this model activates” and “at the start of this model’s activation.”

Using your own logic on this, the argument could be made that since it doesn’t match the wording of something like hazardous terrain which states damage occurs if any part of a move or action occurs in the terrain, it wouldn’t work the way you described 

[Mortarion]

19 hours ago, solkan said:

 

For the record, please specify the result of this situation as you understand the rules (where does the model suffer the wound):

A model with one wound remaining declares a Charge action within the Stand and Fire aura.

It would suffer the wound as soon as it resolves any part of the action within the aura, during step C.2.e.

[Mortarion]

16 hours ago, TheUnseemlyOne said:

There are other differing wordings that happen at the same timing step, like “when this model activates” and “at the start of this model’s activation.”

Using your own logic on this, the argument could be made that since it doesn’t match the wording of something like hazardous terrain which states damage occurs if any part of a move or action occurs in the terrain, it wouldn’t work the way you described 

I was unclear. Sorry. The rules concerning "Ability timing" (page 35 in the digital rulebook) says that "Most Abilities are passive and always in effect, but some occur as a result of another game effect. In these cases, the Ability will use the word “After.” These Abilities happen after the effect in question is resolved."

Stand and fire states that models "that resolve" the Charge action suffer damage. It does not use the word "after". It is written in present tense. Therefore, it takes effect when the Charge is resolved, and not after.

(And I agree that Stand and fire is different from Hazardous Terrain, which states that the effect is suffered "after the current Action or Ability is resolved".)