3E just deleted lists?

[Rengrave]

Seriously Wyrd? I just started looking into getting back into Malifaux and since 3E is a thing I figured I should start researching. You just flat out deleted both of my lists. Ramos and Neverborn Lynch. So basically I would have to start over. Everything I have is pretty much invalidated in this edition. What a terrible choice to just remove armies from 2E... I guess I'm just done with Malifaux. Not gonna start another list and find out in a few years time it too will just get deleted from the game.

Updating this post to reflect the information below (IE DMH). Wanted to strike that last part out as it was a bit emotionally driven and has since been clarified (plus want to avoid more vitriolic and unproductive posts.

Edited September 23, 2022 by Rengrave
Want to avoid further useless 'goodbye' posts.

[Adran]

Just in case you missed it, you can play Ramos, his stat card is in dead man's hand. Many tournaments won't allow dead man's hand, but if you are just playing with friends then you can certainly still play him. 

And depending on what exactly you had for lynch, you may still be able to play him. A lot of the things you would have bought moved to the ten thunders with him.  (Alot stayed as well but if you had a large amount of the  " neverborn  all-stars", you might have a legal list for nekima if you can't make a  ten thunders lynch list. )

Every M2 model got an M3 profile, but its certainly true that some collections couldn't make a legal list.

[Morgan Vening]

While I understand the unhappiness, and wish they'd figured a different way to do it, the OP definitely got hosed by bad luck.

But the number of Masters that got screwed by shift was comparatively small (I know someone who had McMourning for a Guild crew), and the number deleted even less.

Again, I wish it'd been handled differently, but compared to what happens in most actual edition changes, I'm not too annoyed.

[Rengrave]

Thanks for the responses!

The Dead Man's Hand certainly helps, but knowing that the one list I have fully painted (Ramos) is 'dead' now for any type of Organized Play is a bit disheartening. Its so odd to see an edition just remove an army. I know it has happened but its usually because of a massive change (looking at you space dwarves 'Squats') and typically due to a loss of return for the company to keep producing them.

In fact this feels more like a hate move because some people would whine about summoning Masters. The pass tokens make that a non-issue now, and even more so make summoners actually feel underpowered. This was actually a big missed opportunity for Wyrd. They could have had a new sculpt for Ramos without messing up their story much. Something like Jailbreak Ramos.

The move to Ten Thunders for Lynch is also disappointing. I love the look and feel of Neverborn. Ten Thunders is a bit meh to me. Even Outcasts would have made more sense for both a story aspect and a theme aspect. Teddy and Stitched Together were some of my favorite models in the game and now I would have to replace them to use Lynch or pick a new Master (which means essentially buying a whole new team) to be able to use like 3 models. Ugh.

While I love the idea of getting into new masters/factions because they appeal to me, something about being forced into the change really irks me...

[Adran]

My personal view was that dead man's hand was an experiment in seeing what the player base did,   if it went down well, they could consider it a way they could rotate some of the masters. I don't know why they chose the masters they did, story is the most obvious ( as there isn't really any other reason to remove lilith and make nekina a master). It doesn't seem to have been done as a way to remove summoners, as whilst 2 of the original summoners were moved there, they added more summoning to the game, giving every faction at least 1 summoner ( although they were once again viewed as too strong this edition and have had the summoning rmade less effect in gaining grounds ).  Effectively 4 masters  ( and their totems) and 1 other model were moved there, and of those 5 cases  I can think if 2 where a new model did a lot of similar things so they could have made rules work. ( Melissa kore  could easily have been the Ryle model)

 

There are still some places that do allow deadman hand in organised play, but I think it has reduced in number over the years since release. 

Lynch has been a ten thunders master since he was introduced to the game in first edition,  so he just lost one of his 2 factions rather than moving to a new one. I always thought of him as more ten thunders than neverborn, as his thematic crew was more altered humans than original denizens of Malifaux ( and it was easier in my head to justify hiring a samurai with him than a mature nephlim) but that is just personal perspective.  

The edition change seemed to have been done to reduce master hiring pools overall and make them focus more on their thematic models.  That will have made people with small specialised collections very vulnerable to having invalid lists even if the master didn't change factions.

 

 

[Rengrave]

Thanks for the insights Adran. Much appreciated.

[Paddywhack]

I don't recall what Ramos had in 2E. Other than Ramos, what models do you have? You can likely shift into something new with those models. So you might only need to paint a new Master and totem. I'm 

As a Nicodem heavy player, I feel your pain, but the only models I don't still use are Nicodem and the Vulture. All the other models get used by other masters. It actually made me jump into other masters a bit more and find some other themes I enjoy. Ramos might be a little harder (no players around here, so I don't recall his crew), but you might be able to find something. 

[Rengrave]

Ramos

Joss

Steam Arachnid (many)

Metal Golem

Brass Arachnid

Electrical Creation

Howard Langston

[j3diii]

FWIW title Lynch in 10T is a fantastic master choice. It unleashes Hungering Darkness by making both him and Lynch 2 3AP. OG Lynch even looks decent in the light of Gaining Grounds 3, but 3AP Huggy and being able to resummon him once he dies is a hell of a drug. Lynch, Dark Bet is a potent way to play that Keyword. Add in a couple of 10T versatiles and it can be extremely flexible. Check out Fuhatshu for sure of you're going to play him.

Sorry about Ramos, I'd be disappointed seeing a master I enjoyed and painted up being faded out of the game. At least you can still play him with DMH.

Good luck and I hope you can get back into Faux! 

[Regelridderen]

On 9/18/2022 at 7:12 PM, Rengrave said:

Seriously Wyrd? I just started looking into getting back into Malifaux and since 3E is a thing I figured I should start researching. You just flat out deleted both of my lists. Ramos and Neverborn Lynch. So basically I would have to start over. Everything I have is pretty much invalidated in this edition. What a terrible choice to just remove armies from 2E... I guess I'm just done with Malifaux. Not gonna start another list and find out in a few years time it too will just get deleted from the game.

Well… good bye. Have a great life.

It’s a shame you’re missing out on 3E, it is by far superior to 2E - and you’re still able to play with Ramos and Lynch.

[Mangod]

3 hours ago, Rengrave said:

Ramos

Joss

Steam Arachnid (many)

Metal Golem

Brass Arachnid

Electrical Creation

Howard Langston

Ignoring Dead Man's Hand (Ramos, Arachnid and Electrical Creation), Joss and Howard are both in C. Hoffman's Crew now, with the Metal Golem having gone with Sandeep and/or Mei Feng, and the Steam Arachnids having become Arcanist all-rounders.

[Rengrave]

Thanks for the pointers on Arcanists. I looked over the masters and none of them really do it for me unfortunately.