Errata 2022 - Resurrectionists

[50 SS Enforcer]

Errata 2022 is fast approaching, what do you expect to be touched in our rotten faction?
What do you want touched that you suspect will not be? (Mourners!!) 

What do you think will be bad touched? 
 

Let’s see those hot or spicy takes! 

[Maniacal_cackle]

Out of our versatiles, I think Asura Roten perhaps deserves attention the most. She has been severely hampered by the summon changes, and needs a rework. Especially since she was sort of a miss from the get-go. I don't think they tend to buff versatiles very often, though (since you'd really only do that if you want the whole faction buffed).

Keywords that could use a boost I think include Forgotten, Revenant, and maybe Redchapel & Experimental. McMourning 1 continues to be very weak, but McMourning 2 has induced a lot of salt (although after seeing him in action a lot, I don't think he is very strong after all). 

So I'd say Mourners might be the highest priority (noting that now that they are a summon, you don't want to make them too strong). Philip and the Nanny would be next on my list. Experimental... I don't know, it feels like the whole keyword could use a rework. Flask of Formaldehyde should be able to auto fail for experimental, but then also you're really not getting enough mileage out of the keyword.

Maybe nerf McMourning 2's plastic surgery (it breaks the game), and buff McMourning 1? Could really rework McMourning 1 to work with the poison side of the crew more while maintaining his precise tech.

[50 SS Enforcer]

I’d love to see mourners touched to better sync with the 2 keywords they are attached to.

For revenant I’d put something like :        Feed on grief should add a point of burning if the corpse marker you used was a corpse candle or within an aura of a pyre something thematic.

And for Redchapel : 
Weeping widows aura needs to be reversed. “Other friendly models within 6 aura cannot have their front of card abilities be ignored by ruthless.” Ranged ruthless is a massive threat and quite common, it’s weird having the ability target enemy models rather than friendly with that many 8”+ threat ruthless models in the game. 

[Maniacal_cackle]

Oh, special shout out to Anna Lovelace. I think the calls to nerf her are quite reasonable, but there's some issues (does Von Schtook need a nerf? Can we handle those matchups Anna is good in without her?)

I think her auras are good tech, but maybe her defensive tech needs to take a hit. Decrease her defensive stats maybe, and could take away her heal on melee attack.

EDIT: Alternatively you could nerf Anna to a 9-stone enforcer, so backup assistant can bring her back so she is strong in keyword but weaker OOK!

[50 SS Enforcer]

Do you nerf Anna or do you nerf gravity well or hostile work environment? Both? If you asked me to nerf her I’d probably change her Henchman status to Enforcer, I can put shielded on Anna in keyword with schtook 2, built in I might add, stones help her more out of keyword anyways. She has two built in triggers already but, stoning for glimpse of the void is nasty. It hurts her as a ook pick while not hurting her so much in keyword(but still a bit). It stops her bury trigger unless you have suit or flip it, again hurts more ook than in keyword because of the (hopefully a decent amount of times) studied opponent that might draw you that 10+ of tombs. 

[Maniacal_cackle]

1 minute ago, 50 SS Enforcer said:

Do you nerf Anna or do you nerf gravity well or hostile work environment?

Same question was asked on the Discord xD

Personally I think these are pretty critical pieces of tech. There's a lot of rough matchups that Anna smooths out (and the people who complain about seeing her in 100% of games probably play crews that are weak to her).

The English Ivan matchup for example feels like it would be pretty horrible without Anna.

[Metalhed]

Buffs

Phil and the nanny - overpriced garbage. There is the odd matchup where he is good. But you’d still do it better with something else. 
 

Asura - overpriced too. Summoning nerf nuked her. The idea of summoning zombies in the back rank is great and thematic but costs a fortune. 
 

Mourners - expensive, die too easily and not impactful. 
 

Guild autopsies - never even seen them in play. 
 

Crooked men - fun abilities but die to a stiff breeze so they never have any impact on the game. In a crew like jack where SS are tight there is no space for these. 
 

Molly 2 - needs a way around the concealing on night terrors. This was such an awful oversight that the playtesting just missed. Either change molly or the night terrors. 

[SEV]

I'm just dipping my toes in to Seamus crew. After a few games :

1) Bells NEED a bonus action (remove pounce if in need of balance).

2) Your Emissary is cool, but 0" hurts and the high TN on Exhumation is annoying. Also the lack of self heal make hard to kill less appealing.

[Maniacal_cackle]

23 minutes ago, SEV said:

1) Bells NEED a bonus action (remove pounce if in need of balance).

Agreed, but I think for that keyword Mourners would be higher priority.

23 minutes ago, SEV said:

2) Your Emissary is cool, but 0" hurts and the high TN on Exhumation is annoying. Also the lack of self heal make hard to kill less appealing.

Yeah if they're willing to touch versatiles, Carrion Emissary could really use a tune-up

[oryxwild]

If I was in the designer's seat, I'd definitely grind anna down a peg. I think it's good to adjust her from two different perspectives;

1) If you need her tech for a match, she's incredibly expensive and forces you to build your list around hiring her. With a points drop, she becomes less demanding when the tech is necessary

2) She hard counters too many things, too hard, and is too safe. Even if she's balanced, I don't find her very pleasant to play against and I'd rather buff other things rather than leave Anna be

 

I'd adjust her to a 9 stone enforcer with def 5 wp 7. I'd change her wounds to 8. Armor 1, studied opponent becomes 1/turn. hostile and gravity well become 4". Melee attack is changed to stat 6 with built in puncture instead of siphon life, and leave the rest of her unchanged. 

Since this is a significant hit to Von Schtook, we have to do something about him. This is ok because VS has been badtouched anyway. 

VS gets a semi revert: Academic Broadcast Effective Target Number (henceforth ETN) goes to 9, but gives focused +1 and 2" push. Positive Results trigger gets a once per turn tag, but can target any transmortis model.

Undergraduate; they lost the thing about them that made them so exciting, but at 3x it was just too strong. Instead give the Research Assistant BYS, because it's vaguely thematic anyway, and because it's kind of an interesting rule on him. He's insignificant, but does bring move along to any part of the table and he can throw scheme markers around. 

Valedictorian: +1 stone, which more accurately reflects value and brings wounds into line. 

student of sinew: -2 wounds, armor + h2w is already an incredibly powerful combo for a keyword to spam. No need for extra wounds, too. Front of card ability; 1/turn, when declaring an action, remove a corpse marker within 2" to add a crow to the duel's total. 

Student of steel: - 2 wounds, see above. front of card ability: 1/turn, when declaring an action, remove a scrap marker within 2" to add a ram to the duel total

Student of Viscera: -2 wounds, see above. Front of card ability: 1/turn, when declaring an action, remove a marker within 2" to add any suit to the duel total

In general something needs to be done about sloth. Either make the fast require a 5 of crows, or make him do something else. As a seven stone support model who heals, slows, and makes undead things fast, he's warping the faction. I would change his healing: make gaining slow a cost rather than an effect. However, to maintain his mainline healer and buffer role, Change rigor mortis to: undead models instead gain Shielded +1, or Shielded +3 if they are slow. Give him creep along (ETN 6) to give him more early game options.  

Enslaved spirits gain TN5 on chain gang, and wounds goes to 2 to be in line with cost. 

Undergraduates still quite underwhelming, give their attack stat 6. front of card ability: 1/turn, before declaring an action, remove a scheme marker within 2" to add a suit to the duel total. Give them an additional bonus action Creep Along (ETN 5). Leave wounds as is, since no armor. 

Dead Rider (Riders in general): get rid of df trigger mechanic. Wounds go to 11. If I really had my way I'd probably change all the riders much more than this, but I feel like this is fine. The dead rider is good, but probably 11 stones good. 

Asura Roten: Make Zombie Apocalypse a bonus, give asura price of progress. Front of card ability: Zombie Followers: When hit, sacrifice a mindless zombie within 3" to reduce the incoming damage by 1 to a minimum of 0. Tear apart becomes 2/4/5. Dessication might need to heal for 1 instead of 2, would have to playtest it.

Emissary: Gains 1" melee

Grave Golem: Wounds go to 12, gains terrifying (11). Gains additional bonus action regurgitate. Final Rest changed to a new bonus action: ETN 9, walk or melee action, golem can remove any number of corpses within 4" for +1 to the final duel total per corpse. Dismember replaces Zombify on Huge Fist, and Huge Fist gains Puncture on a Ram.

Gwisin: already does a lot of very strong things for cost. Reduce wounds to 5 to keep them in line with similar incorp models. Give them Vile Reclamation at stat 5 to compensate, and make sure they have reasonable bonus action most turns. 

Bone Pile: almost good enough to be great, but mostly outshined by the nurse. Change Throw 'Em a Bone to 6" range and "this model may suffer up to 2 irreducible damage. For each damage suffered, target may heal 1/1/2 or remove a condition on itself." Make the Enemy Down Below a bonus action. 

I'm sure I'd change other keywords too, but as you can see this is less errata and more a rework... Well that's what I'd like to see XD

[50 SS Enforcer]

Ressers is a defensive faction, I really don’t agree most of what you wrote, especially when taking wounds away. Hard to wound is ment to save you cards at the cost of always being hit, which is why ressers don’t have ridiculous card draw, but we also have discard abilities like crazy so we need a little more than we currently have. Plus this is a redesign of entire keywords and mechanics, I think the game is closer to where it needs to be at the moment, things just need to be nerfed or buffed to where there is always a reason to take a model, just not always the SAME model. Every model in the game should hit the table at one point or another, even if its niche. 

[Maniacal_cackle]

I think it'd be neat if they reworked keywords, but the general trend is they do not errata a lot of cards (for whatever reason). There's never been a case of a keyword being reworked (and thus also abilities that appear on lots of models can't be adjusted).

Also I think there'd be higher priority keywords for addressing, since Transmortis isn't really dominating anymore. The reason you see there stuff OOK so much is the other keywords are pretty weak.

For similar reasons, chain gang can't be given a TN (although it could be changed to a similar ability like Take by the Hand, but that's not really fluffy). I think you'd just hit their defensive stats, but it's pretty unlikely they'd hit new models so soon.

The versatile changes are interesting. Would be interesting to see some of those. Sloth I am surprised to see called OP since he is largely an AP transfer model with a solid heal (and I'd say the heal is a bigger deal than the fast).

Taking away the defensive trigger on rider and giving it more wounds could backfire - it makes it easier to heal it back up, and all of a sudden it isn't really weak to stunned anymore.

[Maniacal_cackle]

If errata-ing the Emissary, I'd really like to see a lower TN on its coffin-making. That's the biggest reason I don't hire the Emissary in crews that want a zombie.

[Korrok]

As a shtook player hitting Anna with a full on nerf would be a mega feels bad after what happened last year. Though I could see them reducing the range on her auras. Tbh I hope most of the changes this time around are buffs. 

[50 SS Enforcer]

I’d also like to see mainly buffs, there’s a few models that need nerfs, but a vast majority of what I want to see are buffs.

if I were to design a nerf it would be something like : Fuhatsu I would like to see him as an enforcer with laugh off removed. Not a major nerf, but I feel stones are especially strong on him both offensively and defensively, laugh off and ruthless is amazing to have, one needs to go, I say keep his offensive pressure and lose the defensive ability. 

[Arlos896]

Speaking of buffs, how about Rafkin? He seems entirely lost between both versions of McMourning. Mortimer and Asura also need some addressing as well. Those are ones I'd appreciate getting touched up as they are coop models that just don't have a purpose currently.

[Korrok]

I wouldent mind the backup assistent getting a buff 😅

But for real I think Philip and the forgotten marshal both need something. I want to feel like bring them is worthwhile 

[unti]

What I want the most is a clarification on vengeance + take the hit and a faq for bete's rise again.

Other than that models like guild autopsies, crooked, and mourners should get a bit help...

[50 SS Enforcer]

Asura Rotten is my favorite painted model, and it never sees play. Also I remember in 2nd edition how many random mindless zombies you got out in a game, why is it now that they have a rare limit, I never see them even incidentally? I had a Nico vs Nico game that had easily 40+ mindless zombies (and I have at least 20 of the models from tournament prize packs, local resser usually got all the zombies from the mystery boxes after tournaments) 

[50 SS Enforcer]

On 1/5/2022 at 3:10 PM, Maniacal_cackle said:McMourning 1 continues to be very weak, but McMourning 2 has induced a lot of salt (although after seeing him in action a lot, I don't think he is very strong after all). 

Experimental... I don't know, it feels like the whole keyword could use a rework. Flask of Formaldehyde should be able to auto fail for experimental, but then also you're really not getting enough mileage out of the keyword.

Man, I keep saying this too! I don’t think mcm2 is half as strong as others think, he is extremely good at what he does, but it’s sooooooo one trick that it feels scripted and super counterable. I’ve played him quite a bit, and that’s probably why I feel that way, sooo many working parts and easily countered by stunned and irreducible. I would love a mcm1 buff. 

[Maniacal_cackle]

Just now, 50 SS Enforcer said:

Man, I keep saying this too! I don’t think mcm2 is half as strong as others think, he is extremely good at what he does, but it’s sooooooo one trick that it feels scripted and super counterable. I’ve played him quite a bit, and that’s probably why I feel that way, sooo many working parts and easily countered by stunned and irreducible. I would love a mcm1 buff. 

Yeah, my initial impression was that he was super super strong, and now he doesn't even feel top tier xD

Except plastic surgery is broken and needs a fix (the cremation combo for example is an issue).

[50 SS Enforcer]

2 minutes ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

Yeah, my initial impression was that he was super super strong, and now he doesn't even feel top tier xD

Except plastic surgery is broken and needs a fix (the cremation combo for example is an issue).

Exactly, I would love for this keyword to be our shockwave keyword. Ressers really lack shockwaves and blasts. 
edit: and pulses

Edited January 9, 2022 by 50 SS Enforcer
More info needed

[Arlos896]

6 hours ago, Maniacal_cackle said:

Yeah, my initial impression was that he was super super strong, and now he doesn't even feel top tier xD

Except plastic surgery is broken and needs a fix (the cremation combo for example is an issue).

So who do you feel is the big winner from Malifaux burns for ressers if not McMourning 2? 

[Maniacal_cackle]

1 hour ago, Arlos896 said:

So who do you feel is the big winner from Malifaux burns for ressers if not McMourning 2? 

There's a chance Ressers were net-losers. While all of our keywords got a boost, we may not have gotten as much of a boost as other factions. It is early days. This would probably be a good thing - Ressers were top of the pack previously, so a bit of a loss in power compared to GG1 is probably fine.

Everyone has different opinions on what is OP for ressers now:

• The Russian meta says it is Reva 2 and Seamus 2.
• I know a lot of people are saying McMourning 2 and Kirai 2.
• I feel like Molly 1 actually got a pretty decent power spike because of enslaved spirits.
  • So we have to ask what other crews may have gotten a new lease on life because of gwisin & spirits...

My current suspicion is that McMourning and Kirai are the overwhelming ones that people will figure out how to beat eventually, while Seamus and Reva end up being sleeper hits as people learn to play them better.

Long story short - it is hard to say so soon after release! Unlike Explorer's (which released only 8 masters at once, so breaking them happened pretty quickly), it may take a long time for the new 54 masters to settle into a coherent meta.

[Gloomy]

Bit late to the thread but I'd like to see a few buffs

Carrion Emissary needs at least a 1" engagement range. Or if not take the projectile symbol out of Rot and Rend. At the moment it's too easy to engage him so he has to walk and hit you, or disengage. Not good for a 10ss model

 

Mourner is one I've been moaning about for a while, such a cool models that never see play. My fix for them would be:

Abilities

Remove Revenant Keyword - Add Tormented Keyword

Remove the Final Veil - Add Torment

Remove Recent Funeral – Add Life Leech.

(Or if not just make them versatile, they are pointless in Revenant)

Attack Actions

Add Trigger to Sharp Claws – (mask) Stagger

Change stat of Feed on grief from 5 to 5 (mask)

Tactical Actions

Replace (Bonus) Mourn the Dead with (Bonus) Mournful Wailing

3” Pulse -Stat 5- TN 12

Enemy models within range must pass a TN 11 WP duel or gain distracted.

 

Phillip and the Nanny needs to be less confused, boring conversation is really good, except to use it effectively you need to give up his Manipulative. Then he's just a Def 4, 9 wound model with a big target on its face. I think maybe Def 5 or HTW would help