Lamp Markers

[Maciej]

Hi All. 

Looking at Ancient Lamps skill, in scenarios where enemy does not create his own markers, you can create the lamps only around strategy markers? So if strategy pool was to change to strats not involving markers, Lamplighters wouldn't be creating any markers this way?

(One exception I can Imagine is creating them around a Moorwraith, but that's limited to area around Deployment zone).

Ancient Lamps: After Deployment, Create two Dim Ht 4 Concealing Lamp Markers anywhere at least 4" from another Marker. Seeker models are unaffected by friendly Lamp Marker's Concealing trait.

[muraki]

1 hour ago, Maciej said:

Hi All. 

Looking at Ancient Lamps skill, in scenarios where enemy does not create his own markers, you can create the lamps only around strategy markers? So if strategy pool was to change to strats not involving markers, Lamplighters wouldn't be creating any markers this way?

(One exception I can Imagine is creating them around a Moorwraith, but that's limited to area around Deployment zone).

Ancient Lamps: After Deployment, Create two Dim Ht 4 Concealing Lamp Markers anywhere at least 4" from another Marker. Seeker models are unaffected by friendly Lamp Marker's Concealing trait.

I think if I'm reading this right you're asking 'do lamps have to be created within 4 of another marker when dropped?'

If so, the answer is no.  It's more 'you can't put a lamp super close (within 4)  to other markers when you deploy' not 'markers need to be placed near other markers', so feel free to toss markers in big blank spaces of the board.

[muraki]

For reference it's very similar to fae's abundant growth where you cannot place a underbrush within 2 of other markers.  This one just has a 4 inch 'you cannot place' range instead of 2.

[santaclaws01]

"At least x" from..." is not the same as "within x" of..."

[Maciej]

Oh, seems you're right. 

It is worded slightly differently from, for example, Titania's crew where underbrush markers say "...anywhere on the table, at least within 2" fron any other Markers".  

The fact that Lamps don't have this "anywhere on the table" line, made me automatically assume it is within, without second thought....

Thanks!

[Maciej]

@muraki maybe there is one more thing you could clarify about lamps. It confuses me a bit that they have a height, but aren't blocking or impassable or climbable. 

Having height means you can't move over them? They are not impassable, so you can stand on top, but they are not climbable, so you can't move vertically?

If Lamp Markers can effectively blok pathways, and are not destructible, taking 2 lamp lighters to a corner deployment can really hinder enemy's ability to leave their deployment zone! 

[Scoffer]

37 minutes ago, Maciej said:

@muraki maybe there is one more thing you could clarify about lamps. It confuses me a bit that they have a height, but aren't blocking or impassable or climbable. 

Having height means you can't move over them? They are not impassable, so you can stand on top, but they are not climbable, so you can't move vertically?

If Lamp Markers can effectively blok pathways, and are not destructible, taking 2 lamp lighters to a corner deployment can really hinder enemy's ability to leave their deployment zone! 

They have hight for LOS reasons - Lamplighters need LOS to target them with actions. 

[Maciej]

@muraki sorry can't untag... Phone is trolling me...

@Scoffer thanks, that makes a lot of sense. But since they have height do you still need to move around then, so can block movement?

[Adran]

the Ht stat doesn't prevent models moving through them. It only affects determinign LOS. 

As far as I can see you can stand in a Lamp marker and it has no really affect. Its not climbable so you can't get on top of it, its not blocking or impassable so you can share the same space as the marker. 

[Maciej]

On 1/14/2022 at 11:57 AM, Adran said:

the Ht stat doesn't prevent models moving through them. It only affects determinign LOS. 

As far as I can see you can stand in a Lamp marker and it has no really affect. Its not climbable so you can't get on top of it, its not blocking or impassable so you can share the same space as the marker. 

This makes sense, although feels odd. So 40/50mm model with Size 3 can stand on the marker and the marker is still visible, extending 1 inch above size 3 model  

At least they don't block deployment. 

[Adran]

19 minutes ago, Maciej said:

This makes sense, although feels odd. So 40/50mm model with Size 3 can stand on the marker and the marker is still visible, extending 1 inch above size 3 model  

At least they don't block deployment. 

Roughly yes. In actual rules the marker will ignore everything with a smaller ht than it when drawing LOS.  It's the same rules that would allow a ht4 model to target a ht 0 marker " hidden" underneath a ht 3 model. 

[Morgan Vening]

40 minutes ago, Adran said:

Roughly yes. In actual rules the marker will ignore everything with a smaller ht than it when drawing LOS.  It's the same rules that would allow a ht4 model to target a ht 0 marker " hidden" underneath a ht 3 model. 

Don't have the rules in front of me, but can a Ht5 model see a Ht4 Lamp Marker underneath a Ht4 model, in the same way a 30mm model can't block a 30mm marker, or are the rules for height different than the rules for width?

[santaclaws01]

2 hours ago, Morgan Vening said:

Don't have the rules in front of me, but can a Ht5 model see a Ht4 Lamp Marker underneath a Ht4 model, in the same way a 30mm model can't block a 30mm marker, or are the rules for height different than the rules for width?

Yes, any smaller models are ignored.

[Adran]

2 hours ago, Morgan Vening said:

Don't have the rules in front of me, but can a Ht5 model see a Ht4 Lamp Marker underneath a Ht4 model, in the same way a 30mm model can't block a 30mm marker, or are the rules for height different than the rules for width?

The rules basically are can you draw a sight line between the two which does not cross something "blocking". And you can ignore blocking from smaller things. If the answer is yes you can see. If the answer is no you can't.